After the National Security Guards and the Indian Navy’s MARCOS, it is now the turn of the Indian Army’s 65,000-strong Rashtriya Rifles to acquire the Cornershot (see: http://golangroup.com/products-cornershot.shtml) system. Army HQ has issued an RFI calling for technical proposals for a weapon system that can mount an in-service 9mm Pistol 9mm for shooting around the corner without exposing the firer, or with minimum exposure of the firer. It is envisaged to engage targets effectively using traverse firing. The offered system should also be able to mount an in-service (30mm or 40mm) UBGL for shooting around the corner. The selected system is also likely to be licence-assembled by the MoD-owned Ordnance Factories Board, against an order for at least 5,000 units. Several of India’s Central Armed Police Forces and state-level Police agencies too are likely to induct another 7,000 such systems in the near future.
Apart from the Israel-based Golan Group, such weapon systems have been developed by China’s Chongqing Changfeng Machinery Co Ltd and Shanghai Sea Shield Technologies Company (these being the HD-66 and CF-06), Iran, and the state-owned Pakistan Ordnance Factories (POF), which in 2008 unveilled its POFEye.—Prasun K. Sengupta
http://idrw.org/?p=6469
ReplyDeleteMore men like this are needed if India wishes to be moderately self-sufficient in defence..
We will be getting a lot of TOT from MMRCA , FGFA and Project 75I....what I am eager to know is how efficient are our DPSUs and Private companies in absorbing all that Tech???
ReplyDeleteWe can all agree that DRDO and its associates achievements are few .... so is there any substantive organizational changes (Such as Armed Forces personnel at the Helm ) being made?....
I think this is very important as we dont want drain of TOT like Type 209 Subs and Bofors guns and T-72 tanks .....
Maybe you could write a article on changes needed in DPSUs :)
http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htairfo/articles/20120121.aspx
ReplyDeleteFrom this
"Mig-21s, MiG-23/27s, and MiG-29 all have had design defect and quality control issues."
Is it true?
Great news Prasun
ReplyDeleteAre Paras equipped with corner-shot ? Also are our Paras equipments mean for better situational awareness ?
So we will purchase of the shelf 5000 such units and any further order will be met by in-house companies or just 5000 units ?
Also i have to ask, did you visit Defexpo 2010 ? If yes then did you saw IN's booth ? There are reports from people claiming that they saw model of a warship that resembles completely like Fincantieri's FREMM variant. Also everybody knows Fincantieri is helping MOD in P17a project. Is it possible that Italian FREMM design is selected for P17a project ? Because its hell of a coincidence.
What have we purchased from Poland ? Whats the progress of Indo-Polish light tank ? (even if IA doesn't purchase it)
Is Mahindra making some other land systems other than armored wheeled vehicles ?
Whats Ahok Leyland is offering or planning especially after their tie-up with German defence giant KMW, the maker of Leopard 2 ?
How are the deals to procure new assault rifles & CQB carbines for IA progressing ?
ReplyDeleteTo An-32: Yes, the DPSUs and private-sector can absorb all the ToT, PROVIDED there’s enough skilled human resources available in-country. Right now, such skilled human resources are lacking. My vgiews on the DPSUs have already been made known since 2009, and that is, the MoD needs to go for strategic disinvestments in most of the DPSUs. Make them majority publicly-listed entities and their transformation will be phenomenal. But to do all this the decision-makers making up the various Union Cabinet Committees and GoMs need to be technocrats themselves, and not mere academicians or BA LLB degree-holders.
ReplyDeleteTo Anon@12.15AM: Even the F-16A/B had design defect and quality-control issues when first introduced into service and there were a few fatal USAF F-16 crashes in South Korea due to wire-chafing problems.
To Anon@12.16AM: Why would the Paras need Cornershot? Cornershot is only meant for those units that undertake CQB. As I said above, the winning design will be subject to licenced-assembly in-country. The model at the IN’s booth at DEFEXPO 2010 was that of a P-15A FFG. India’s only purchased the WZT-3 ARVs from Poland’s Bumar Labedy. The Light Tank programme is on hold since it has first to be ascertained whether or not such vehicles are required for future battlefields. Right now M & M is not making any other MIL-SPEC vehicles other than the MPVs. Ashok Leyland is also competing for the FICV project and for the motorised 155mm/52-cal howitzer project.
To Anon@12.16AM: What bothers me is why on earth couldn't the OFB announce a competition a few years ago between Indian private-sector SMEs to come up with a Cornershot-like solution capable of accepting 9mm pistols and UBGLs made by OFB. Afterall, the Cornershot is just a mechanism for for shooting around the corner using the traverse-firing technique, and does not involve the design and development of futuristic firearms.
ReplyDeleteSO Israeli based Golan manufacturer will win the order, right?
ReplyDeleteHow good is this when compared to those from China and Pakistan. Paks boast they have world class gun manufactured in Pakistan.
WHy Indian OFB (MoD) did not go for pvt manufacturers because if they go (means, MoD) then MoD cannot buy from foreign vendors and so will not get commissions.
Why so much delay to announce the winner of MMRCA?
I saw the pic on the web, its a white color model of FREMM. Yeah there's also a navy blue color pic of a P15 DDG.
ReplyDeleteSo is ALL making the whole in artillery system or using the German turret ?
When did ALL joined FICV ? Last i heard only 4 companies were there in the competition (Mahindra, Tata, L&T and OFB).
Has L&T tied up with someone for FICV project ?
Here's a pretty interest tidbit about the MMRCA from a British local newspaper-
ReplyDelete"It’s widely understood that the Eurofighter bid is the cheaper option – but the Indian Government would prefer to deal with one nation, rather than the four involved in Typhoon."
http://www.blackpoolgazette.co.uk/news/business/oman_deal_could_save_jobs_at_bae_1_4174719
Do you think this dilemma (lower costs vs strategic flexibility) is the reason why we have seen a nearly-two month (and probably longer) delay in arriving at a preferred bidder?
And there was a CCS meet on Tuesday which reportedly discussed the MMRCA among other things
http://www.deccanchronicle.com/channels/nation/north/ccs-meets-army-chief-dob-712
Is it possible that IA will select the whole soldier modernisation suite rather than selecting individual equipments like from France (Félin) or Italy (Soldato Futuro) or Israel or wait for drdo's FINSAS ? Finmeccanica is offering their system and so is Thales for Indian FINSAS.
ReplyDeleteTo A Mallu: The winner will be known only after the RFPs are issued and the responses are received. If China & Pakistan don’t bid, then one will be left with a sole vendor situation, which means that the procurement can’t proceed. It’s that simple. Therefore, it is far better to invite competitive bids from a few private-sector Indian companies for proposing indigenous solutions. Believe me, the Indian companies will be able to respond within 8 months!
ReplyDeleteTo Anon@1.55AM: If it is a white-colour model of a warship and that too in the Indian navy’s booth, then it is either a Project 28 ASW corvette, or a Project 1135.6 FFG for sure. There cannot be a scale-model of a foreign warship displayed at the Indian Navy’s booth. ALL will never make any artillery system for such a small quantity. At the most it will attempt licenced-assembly and through-life product support. ALL is definitely involved with the FICV project. L & T has tied up with Raytheon.
To Anon@1.55AM: The EF-2000’s flyaway cost is far higher than that of the Rafale. However, the Eurofighter consortium’s indirect offsets quantum is, in dollar or Euro terms, far more than what the French have offered. On the other hand, the Rafale’s flyaway costs are lower, and although the indirect offset quantum is not as much as what the Eurofighter consortium has put on the table, the French have used the ‘technology provider’ option under which companies like SNECMA Moteurs and DCNS will provide exactly the kind of ToT that will enable GTRE to come up with a viable and credible Kaveri turbofan, and for the Naval Design Bureau & DAE to realize their dream of designing and producing indigenously a fleet of SSGNs powered by lifelong PWRs. It is for all these reasons that the definition of L-1 (lowest bidder) is not that easy to calculate, since several ‘variables’ too have to be factored in.
To Anon@3.25AM: As I had explained earlier a few hours ago, only individual modules/components will be imported, if necessary. The entire F-INSAS suite's final systems architecture will be totally Indian in both conception and in terms of operating software.
ReplyDeletePrasun, few months ago you wrote about the various parts to be procured for LCA mk2 like IRST, AESA Radar etc. How are these procurements going on ?
ReplyDeleteFew months back MOD awarded a $186 million contract to develop and supply two integrated electronic warfare systems for mountainous terrain to Tata SED. Whats the deal with this ? What happened to BEL Samyukta, its already in service too ? How many such systems will be procured under this 186 million $ contract ?
Hey Prasun, your response to Anon@1.55AM about the offer from EF consortium and Dassault really explain things why its taking so long. I mean the choice is really difficult. Although if i would have to chose i would go for French offer if the news about SSGN and Kaveri offer is true.
ReplyDeleteI have to ask three questions, i heard the delay in signing the deal for Kaveri project is because the whole requirement is changed. Earlier Kaveri was meant for LCA but now things have changed and plans are to make an engine that will suite the need of a 5th gen aircraft like AMCA. Is it true ?
Also is French offer also includes help in indigenous aesa project ? I don't get it, i mean we are basically operating almost every radar produced by Israel, why haven't we signed a deal with elta and start a joint project to build an aesa radar for our fighter jets ?
Does EF consortium have no idea what French are offering in the tech department ? UK can offer us SSGN design and Germans can help us in our future indigenous SSK afterall they are really good in SSK. All the 4 nations also have good naval shipyards, they can basically make every shipyard in India a world class naval shipyard which will be capable of building any kind of warship or submarine.
Hey, Prasun
ReplyDeleteYou'd expect Israeli Cornershot to win though right? And I was under the impression the IA PARA SF had procured some CornerShot weapons as per a RFI some time ago. After all IA SF are trained in CQB/HR. And have MARCOs/NSG actually got theirs yet?
And could you comment/produce an article about the NSG's recently announced plans for "super", upgraded commandos by 2015?
Hey,
ReplyDeletewhen you said:
"Shiv Aroor-anchored exposes on the UID (what a fuck-up!!!)!"
in a preivious post what fuck-up are you referring to? and what is UID?
+ how would you rate Indian SOFs compared to others in the world? and of the numerous Indian SOFs which would you place as number 1?
To Anon@4.19AM: The RFPs responses for most of the avionics items for the Tejas Mk2 is due this March. During the DEFEXPO 2012 expo from march 29 to April 1 there will be some official announcements. Even the RFP responses for the first 16 multi-role 10-tonne helicopters for the Navy will be in this March. The Samyukta EW system from the DRDO/BEL was optimized for plains warfare, and its design architecture was of the late 1990s vintage. The EW system being developed by TATA SED will be optimised for operations over mountainous terrain and will be of a much more modern design. Most importantly, it will be more of an ELINT/COMINT system for passive surveillance and less of a jamming system. The jammer component will include elements from the existing Samyukta system, for which TATA SED too had supplied some critical sub-systems.
ReplyDeleteTo Anon@5.12AM: The definitive Kaveri will be of modular design and therefore it will be upgradable for the next 30 years after its induction into service, meaning its base design will more than suffice for the AMCA. For the AESA-MMR, the best bet for technology cooperation is still Israel, since it is heavily involved in this area as it is with the DRDO. That is precisely the reason why the EL/M-2032 was chosen for the Tejas Mk1, since the EL/M-2032’s transmitter/receiver module, programmable signals processor and environment control systems are identical to those for the EDL/M-2052 AESA-MMR. Therefore, the existing back-end of the EL/M-2032 can be easily integrated at very low cost with the front-end AESA antenna. Regarding SSGNs, the UK and the US are on the same page when it comes to nuclear non-proliferation issues. In fact, it has been the UK that has persistently advised India against going for nuclear attack submarines, citing the huge cost overruns of the Astute SSGN programme. For India’s future submarine fleet makeup, the Indian Navy wants a fleet of Barracuda-type SSGNs yesterday!!! Ask any Indian Navy submariner & he will tell you without blinking that left to choose between a SSK & SSGN, he will go for the latter any day. It is not difficult to have a world-class shipyard, just ask Pipavav & L & T how to do it and they will tell you so. For having world-class shipyards one must have access to land, or be allowed to set up Greenfield projects (like L & T has done in Tamil Nadu & Pipavav has done in Gujarat, and most importantly, possess a readily available pool of skilled personnel who is willing to work on three-shift days. Presently, in all the MoD-owned shipyards, this is not the case. Once you change the mindset and work attitudes, excellent results will automatically follow.
To K Singh: All SF (Para) Battalions are not CQB-qualified. The NSG & MARCOS acquired the Cornershot immediately after 26/11.
ReplyDeleteTo Anon@5.23AM: UID + biometric Unique Identity Card. In India to establish one’s identity one has the passport, followed by the driving licence, the ration card, the PAN card, the voter’s ID card, and the latest is the UID card. The more the merrier, as they say, instead of simplifying matters like having a single common registration number for each of these identity documents, as should logically be the case, or issuing a single ID card with a built-in encrypted chip containing all the data that’s otherwise available in all the other five documents. After all, how many registration numbers can one memorise just to prove that he/she is an Indian citizen? A truly fucked-up state of affairs. What more do you want to know? Shit happens!!!
Indian SOF formations are customised (in terms of training & equipment) for operations that are best-suited for the unique operating environments of India. Therefore, it will be improper to compare them with their global or regional counterparts. For instance, the ‘Ghatak’ elements attached to the mountain divisions is unique to India, something which even the US, UK, France and Germany have been highly interested in post-9/11.
Hi,
ReplyDeleteWhat do you mean not all IA PARA SF battalions are CQBS qualified? I thought there was a common training regime amongst all SF battalions these days and specialisation had been done away with so all units can do all things? If not which btns are CQB qualified? And are the others moving towards be CQB qualified? Very odd as CQB is a key element to any SOF and even regular PARAs seem to be trainined in CQB/room clearance these days.
Why on earth would Pakistan or China bid for Indian cornershot requirement?Isn't it strange seeing India is NOT an ally of either of these countries?And if they bid and India go with the Israeli weapon then why bother going for a tender and not buy direct?Is this bureaucracy gone mad x infinite?
ReplyDeleteIs Nirbhay UAV gonna be MALE or HALE UAV ? Also will it be like IAI Harop or it will be multiple warhead carrying vehicle or it will be just a surveillance UAV ? How much is its endurance ?
ReplyDeleteWhich situational awareness tools being used by indian special forces ? Does our SF also use Micro UAVs ?
Will ALL be using pzh2000 turret for wheeled 155mm artillery system ? It has a very good rate of firing...
Prasun what is the progress of Akashdeep and Nakshatra Aerostat projects ? How many of these will be procured and will all the 3 services gonna induct them ?
ReplyDeleteHey,
ReplyDeleteCould you please tell the status of the proposal to equip the SFC with 40 dedicated fighter-bombers? Will this just be filled by an additional order of Su-30MKI down the road or possibly an additional platform? And does this requirement have anything to do with Dassualt's offer to supply 40 Rafeles off the shelf in a fast track process?
and regarding the Airihant, the sub is operated by the IN but who is the payload operated by? SFC? and what is the mechanism for authorizing nuclear launch? for example in the US this capability lies purely with the President via a "briefcase" I have not seen a similar case carried with PM MMS.
Prasun
ReplyDeleteLatest test firing of lakshya target drone II, if indeed it has been flownin sea skimming mode, can we assume that now it can better emulate flight path of a sea skimming anti ship (subsonic)missile, to test the effectiveness of the protection(Barak 1 &2)in our warships against those threats?!
Hi, I have visited the IMI website . I have visited the tank ammo section. The APAM round is available in 120 mm & 105 mm versions. There is no 125 mm round and the 24A6M gun on the T-72 & T-90 is 125mm. So how can the APAM round go on the T-72. Has IMI produced a 125 mm version exclusively for India? Also pls tell that the additional armor plates fitted on the sides of Arjun are composite armour or conventional steel plates. Generally ERA can withstand only one hit and after that it becomes useless. Will the Relikt ERA on T-90AM has multihit capability? Also what is the difference between Kontakt 5 and Relikt? Pls reply to this. Also are there any plans of fitting composite appliqué armour on the T-72 & T-90 ? The sides of the T-72 will not provide any protection after hit once. Pls reply.
ReplyDeleteHi Prasun, on the sides of the T-72A1 only a single line of ERA blocks are present on the very top of the side steel plate. What about the lower part of the steel plates. They remain unprotected and thus vulnerable. Also the ERA provide protection only once. Also pls tell about the Rhino project? What are the Phase 1 & Phase 2 of this project. Under Phase 1 of Project Rhino are the T-72 s equipped with new generation ERA blocks, addon composite armour, new engine, new commander night & day vision? Does this T-72 have adequate protection on it's side? Does the ERA have multihit capability? Why isn't the DRDO upgrading it's fleet of T-90 with composite Kanchan armour developed for the Arjun. Pls reply.
ReplyDeleteTo Unknown: How can there be a common training regime amongst all SF (Para) battalions when the battalions are specifically earmarked for operations in particular terrain conditions? Do you mean to say that the SF (Para) can do all that the ‘Ghatak’ platoons can do? Even in far more developed countries there are tailor-made SOF formations for operating in specific types of terrain and partaking in specialised operations. Why should India’s SOF formations be the sole exception to this practice? CQB has never been a key element to any SOF, especially in India. Of what use will CQB tactics be for SOF units specially raised for operating over desert or mountainous terrain?
ReplyDeleteTo Pierre Zorin: China’s OEMs have always been more than happy to bid for Indian programmes, be it for the supply of small arms or ammunition, or even AOPVs and oceanographic survey vessels. And there’s no harm buying such small arms from China. Last month at an internal security expo held in New Delhi, more than 80% of the exhibitors were from China and they displayed some of the latest gadgets employed for internal security.
To Anon@3.29PM: Nirbhay is will be neither a MALE-UAV or a HALE-UAV, nor like ther HAROP. Rather, it will be a cruise missile simulator.
To Anon@5.08PM: Those aerostats are being developed for use by the central Armed P:olice Forces and will be equipped with optronic surveillance payloads.
To K Singh: For the SFC the 40-combat aircraft requirement will be met by the upgraded Super Su-30MKIs. Dassault Aviation’s earlier offer of 40 Rafales on a fast-track basis was made long ago for helping the IAF overcome the crisis concerning its depleted squadron strength. That offer is now off the table. The Arihant’s complement of SLBMs will be owned and operated by the Navy, but it will come under the direct command and control of the SFC. India’s launch authorization protocols are not the same as that of the US. The US retains the right to initiating a first-strike, whereas India does not, and instead has adopted a retaliatory second-strike policy, meaning India can take between one to two weeks before retaliating to a nuclear first-strike. Within that period, the issue of a retaliatory n-strike will be referred to an all-party meeting, then it will go to a Standing Committee of Parliament, and then there will be acrimonious debates on whether it is ‘un-Gandhian’ to retaliate with full force, and only after all this ‘tamasha’—if by then the decision-makers’ balls and testicles are not fully frozen thanks to the bleeding liberalistic attitude of the mind, will the time come to make the final call. There’s always a briefcase carried by the SPG in close proximity to the Indian PM. But the briefcase contains a Micro-UZI now. Previously it used to be a HK MP5K SMG.
To Shaurya: Are you kidding? The lakshya can only go down to an altitude of 12 metres ASL, whereas the Mirach 100/5 can go down to 3 metres. Check out the latest thread.
To Anon@10.47PM: The 125mm APAM round was developed by IMI specifically for an Indian requirement.
So Nirbhay is an UAV which will simulate the trajectory of a cruise missile ? Or Nirbhay UAV project is cancelled ? If its a UAV simulating a cruise missile where it will be used ?
ReplyDeleteThanx for your rapid explanation of the retaliatory second-strike policy. OMG...Bramha/Vishnu/Mahesh.
ReplyDeleteTo Anon@12.09AM: The Nirbhay cruise missile simulator project hasn't been cancelled.
ReplyDeleteTo Mr.RA 13: Also to be noted is that the ultimate weapon--Brahmastra--as per the Mahabharata epic, is never meant to be used. Whicvh means that if India's civilian decision-makers equate the country's n-arsenals with the Brahmastra, then we're indeed in very serious trouble.
Regarding the reactionary nuclear strike, I don't think the 1-2 week time period is practical. Given the scale of devastation any nuclear strike will cause 1-2 week period to respond is beyond stupid, by then there maybe very little to protect let alone launch. Not to mention it would be hard to overcome political pressure not to strike the longer you left it.
ReplyDeleteAlso I think the briefcase carried by the SPG in proximity to the PM/protectee is not for housing SMGs as , in most cases these days, there is 1-2 SPG agents with overt P90 SMGs in proximity to the PM so what would be the point in disguising a Mini Uzi in the briefcase? I beleive, and this has been confirmed by a friend of mine who worked very closely with the SPG some years back, the briefcase carried is a ballistic/kevlar blanket that can be thrown over the PM in case of shooting/emergency. Many other heads of state have similar arrangements, PM Sakorzy has ballistic/Kevlar umbrellas for similar purposes- protect the primary.
Solution to problem
ReplyDeletehttp://poultry-consultant.blogspot.com/2012/02/organic-inorganic-acids.html
This is one of the most versatile Gun i have ever seen, it is packed with many feature
ReplyDelete