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Monday, December 16, 2013

Remembering India’s True Heroes—The Fallen & The Living

(narrative to follow)


reddy said...

Thank God. Somehow it is not East Pakistan now, otherwise pak could bleed India on Eastern Board as well.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To REDDY: Rest assured, once you've digested the narrative that I will soon upload, the stark truth will set us all free. Lots of hitherto untold sagas of what really transpired prior to & during the Lightning Campaign, especially the contingency planning; roles played by the US, USSR & China; special operations; etc will be revealed for the very first time--all based on what was revealed last week at a seminar in New Delhi.

Raman said...

Really looking forward to the Narrative !!!!!!!!!!!!

VJ said...

F-35 for $85Million a peice in 2019, and $75mil in current US Dollar, sounds lucrative than Rafale. What you say Prasunda?

Anurag said...

@Pasun da,seems like your prediction again coming true,Agni V will indeed have a weight of 25 ton.

Seems like DRDO (HEMRL) has atlast managed to develop some high energy solid fuels.
By the way,do you think that Agni IV will replace Agni II??

arjun said...

This is the way to becoming a great power nation on earth.

Anonymous said...

Am glad to see Indian retaliation to US embassy staff if it is true.But again am wondering from where these people got so much guts to act like this

Anonymous said...

On a different note is the 2nd Indian map shown at the last really from the seminar?

Anurag said...

Hey Prasun da,I almost forgot to ask you one thing in my previous post.
I heard that despite of having a rough parity in force concentration with Indians and a halfhearted offensive by IA in western front-Pakis still lost about 5500 sq mile area even on the west-Is it for real??
And why do you think the Pakis performed so poorly even on the west-it's not like they were outnumbered 3 to 1!!

By the way,THANX for this particular topic.Will be eagerly waiting for the narrative.

Mr. Ra 13 said...

At least the first map is more Indian than the other.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To DASHU: That was only theatrics. What matters more is whether the US was legally justified in taking the step. In my personal view, the US was indeed justified & it never contravened any international diplomatic covenant. And I have seen first-hand with my own eyes several cases of ill-treatment meted out by these Indian bureaucrats & diplomats posted overseas to their India-sourced servants, both male & female. Such bureaucrats & diplomats, when posted overseas, truly believe that they’re some Baadshah or Maharani vested with the divine right to treat their servants as slaves. They also frequently show off a lot by kicking up a fuss about allotment of ‘staff cars’ from the Indian High Commission/Embassy just to make a point about their pecking-order in terms of departmental superiority vis-à-vis other staffers of the Commission/Embassy. Any NRI who gets invited to functioins hosted by the Commission/Embassy or happens to be a regular visitor to the Commission/Embassy can witness it all first-hand.

Are you kidding? Such elaborate maps emanating from Indian officialdom??? These are from an analysis of the 1971 war conducted by the US National Defense University. Even in the still-classified official history of the 1971 war, all maps are just hand-drawn sketches. Imagine the RM & the three armed services chiefs all paying homage to the fallen at the Amar Jawan Jyoti on December 16 on one hand, & on the other still refusing to officially acknowledge the occurrence of the 1971 war by keeping a war-records a state secret! Truly a pathetic state of affairs, don’t you agree???

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SIDDHARTH: I had already explained everything about the fictitious DF-21D at:

Scroll down to the last para of that thread’s narrative & the explanation can be found there.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAMAN: Have been swamped with data since all the participants at the seminar had only personal recollections & therefore it takes a lot of time & effort to develop it all into a coherent, sequential narrative. Hence the delay in uploading the narrative, whose first of two parts will definitely be up by tonight.

To VJ: That’s the off-the-shelf purchase price of the F-35. If India were to acquire the Rafale directly from Dassault Aviation, the per-unit cost of the Rafale will definitely drop. What’s driving up the per-unit cost is India’s insistence on replicating most if not all of the manufacturing facilities that are now present in France with Dassault Aviation, THALES, SNECMA Moteurs & SAGEM.

To ANURAG: VMT. Agni-4/Agni-5 will replace the Agni-1/2/. The forthcoming narrative will explain it all. Pakistan lost a lot of territory in northern J & K. Kargil & Drass became a part of India only after 1971. Prior to that they belonged to Pakistan. Pakistan performed poorly in the West because its ammunition stocks were quite low due to the US embargo on weapons exports that was imposed from 1965 till 1975.

Anurag said...

Oh I see.But I heard the US under Nixon and Kissfuc*inger supplied extensive military aid matterials to Pak overlooking the embargo!!Besides they also received tremendous ammounts of military supplies from PRC,Soudis and Turks.Besides,there were Pakistan Ordnance Factories producing munition-So how could they just run low on ammo??

And do you remeber I asked you about pulse-jet powered UAVs and smart bombs;well I found that Livefist article:
So do you recon that the same pulse jet could be used to power future ARDE glide bombs??

THANX in advance.

joydeep ghosh said...

@Prasun da

I know i am not always correct, i remember i said something about Brahmos to which you said i should be spanked :-(

But I do know that I am not always wrong

If you remember I had said India should try launch UAV from submarines to which you said its not needed better to launch AUV from submarines. But looks like US is trying to do just that,

your views on this

a few things

1. My calculation says IN has finally realized that a 2 line submarine production line is not possible now or in the near future, so it will go for upto 18 Scorpenes under P75 with next 12 being based on SMX21 derivative or S80. Its the only way to take submarine count to over 24 by the year 2030, along side HDWs and Kilos.

2. My calculation says once the HDW/Kilo start retiring by 2030 only then will IN go for P75I SSN, which as per you was the original plan.

3. My calculation says P75I SSN will be a truly Indian design incorporating features from HSW/Kilo & the derivative of the design that will be selected for P75I.

4. You say B05 is a TD, I say the upcoming 3500 km K4 SLBM that will be tested next month will also be a TD since the 3500 km missile reaches no important place in China that will act as deterent. Only the 5000 km K5 and the 6000 km K6 will be operational as only they provide any credible deterent.

5. IA has strikes corps on land, IN has CBGs that act as strike corps on water, dont you think IAF must have a similar combination, coordination in place to act like a strike corps in air that will have fighters, interceptors, attack/LOH/CSAR/helos, transporters, AEWs, refuelers opeerating from various bases acting in sync.

I say this as some IAF air bases operate small number of a particular jets, some operate large number of a particular jets, some operate 2 different type of jets and some like hindon operate

what do you say


Joydeep Ghosh

Anurag said...

@Prasun da,just take a look at what ret. Col Ajay Sukla had to say about the autobiography of Gen V.K. Singh:

I for one found this piece to be highly degeneratory,offensive and totaly biased againsed the General,it almost occured to me that Col. Sukla was politicaly motivated and has his own vested interests in trying to defame that upright and honest and highly decorated General V.K Singh.

And do you think BJP has chance to win the 2014 Loksabha elections?I have some doubt as BJP is not so strong in Southern states???

Sujoy Majumdar said...

Prasun Da ,

Many thanks for your answers .

Re this Devyani Khobragade diplomat row , GOI suddenly shows unprededented outrage .

However , when US snoops on India using PRISM or the US Navy kills Indian fisherman , these same git politicians will NOT display a modicum of outrage .

Clear indication that in India , it's only if you are a high flier will the Govt and the media be concerned about your welfare .

Thanks ,


Gessler said...

Prasun, check these out -,d.Yms

Scroll down the page to view images of the new LCA production hangar. A first picture of the SP-1 Tejas is also there still down the pages.

Question: How many Series-Production (SP) birds do you think these facilities can churn out in an year after LCA actually makes it to that stage?

And VMT for those video links in last thread! Really helpful.

Garuna said...

I wonder what mathematics or formula are you using Joydeep Ghosh that you can get such credible answers according to your calculations? Or is this calculation more like an astrologers calculation? I wonder if you are the Prof Shanks (Shanku) in the flesh!Hope you have read Prof Shanks stories by Satyajit Ray.

Deepak said...

Prasun sir,
how many hardpoints lca mk2 will have on iaf version and navy version?
And please tell also about the payload capacity of lca mk2.
Thanks in advance and please carry on the good work you are doing by educating us about the defence world.

sntata said...

Dear Prasun,
Looking forward to your narrative.
1.Is Nag missile a write-off?
2.Is K-4 a hybrid missile?
3.Has Tejas-1 really rectified all its short comings or it is all a big hype by MoD and HAL?
4. Will democracy survive in Bangladesh or it will be taken over by the fundamentalists, aided by ISI?

Bhaswar said...

Oh I don't doubt that BD's national psyche is muddled and fragmented, after all they sided with us kaffirs against their own coreligionists. For the particularly zealous or even the pious that must be a rather complicated fact to reconcile with, along with accepting the fact that the creation of their state was only possible due to our involvement not to mention that it was born through the break up of an "Islamic" state ergo handing the non-believers a victory. In light of how they view us today as overbearing and controlling they must feel that perhaps it is indeed true that Hindu India is trying to subvert a muslim nation. It is after all difficult to explain the complexities of geopolitics to the masses in any nation leave alone the more chaotic one's of SA. How do you see this panning out in the short term, medium term and the long term? Shall they eventually fall into the lure of extremists in some attempt to rid themselves of real and/or perceived Indian involvement/influence or will a right wing political faction aim to under-cut us by forging even closer alliances with China and Pakistan? I surely don't think that Hasina is going to have anything other than a very turbulent and troublesome time ahead for herself and her party?

A customized design would still be based on the Athlas family, no? Why would we or they spend valuable funds on a clean sheet design? Perhaps you meant that they are not offering the existing Athlas family products but instead will make certain required modifications, after all the well dock on the largest member of the family already has the volume required for the task you envision. It would be a shame to lose out on the spacious light/heavy vehicles hangar and helo-hangar on the Athlas-26000, it seems to be the near perfect design, no?

What do you think of the latest diplomatic row between us and the Americans, are they trying to arm-twist us or send us a message regarding something completely unrelated to visa fraud and what not?

Considering that the LCA's mission simulator was developed quite a while back what seems to be the problem in that area? You keep stating that there is a deficiency as far as tactical simulators go?

Also you had stated that the Nirbhay would be tested at the end of this year, what happened?

Hasn't the DSRV arrived yet, why hasn't the Arihant commenced its sea trials? Has the reactor reached full power?

Even now the only confirmation available is regarding the sanctioning of a 900Mw shore based PWR but there is no word on the 180-200Mw naval PWR yet, has the sanction actually been officially provided or are we dithering and procrastinating as usual?

Antony seems to be heading for his victory lap and yet not a single IAF/HAL/ADA bigwig has told the public the truth by trashing his lies and half-truths? A loss of professional integrity perhaps or just these people giving up on the foolish babus and sheeple?

Apparently some movement has occurred on the subject of the Keylong-Leh highway, what do you think- IF we get it done albeit in our usual long delayed manner- will it aid us and improve our capabilities?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ANURAG: No US-origin military hardware was directly supplied by the US to Pakistan between 1965 & 1975 during the period of the US embargo. But the US did lobby with Jordan, Iran & Turkey for supplying spares to Pakistan in 1971. Jordan supplied 27 F-104 Starfighters, while Iran & Turkey supplied spares for M-48 Patton tanks, all of which arrived only after the hostilities were concluded. Pakistan’s war wastage reserves in 1971 catered for only a 28-day high-intensity conflict in a single-front scenario, not for a two-front scenario.
Pulse-jets are extremely noisy & no one in their right mind will ever use them for powering either CALCMs or UAVs, rest assured. Therefore, whatever the ADE & NAL are trying to do is nothing else but a waste of time & money, period.

To JOYDEEP GHOSH: Regarding your “I’m not always correct, but I’m also not always wrong” posture, it would appear that you’ve actively embraced ‘Jyotish Vidya’. Good luck with it. One cannot compare apples with oranges & consequently comparing the capabilities of the navies of the US & India would be a fallacy. 1) My calculation says that the IN wants to go for 3 submarine-production lines of which 2 are already operational: one for additional Scorpene SSKs, one for S-2 Arihant/S-3/S-4/S-5/S-6/S-7 SSBNs & one for SSNs. 2) SSN production line will be activated within this decade, rest assured. Without SSNs, any IN-operated SSBN will be a dead-duck in the high seas. 3) Impossible, since the IN’s DND has no naval architects trained in submarine designing. Nor does any India-based OEM have any such skilled human resources. 4) Correct. 5) It already exists.

To SUJOY MAJUMDAR: The very fact that this Embassy official has been transferred to India’s Permanent UN Mission with such alacrity is proof enough of the fact that the MEA by now knows very well who is at fault & hence the urgent measures to shield the violator of US laws. The US knows only too well from past experience that Indian officialdom has always had this innate tendency to build to a hysteria from which they don’t know how to escape, & due to this the officialdom always resorts to obfuscations & sometimes outright falsifications all aimed at the average gullible Indian taxpayer.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To GESSLER: HAL being inspired by the Hawk Mk132’s licenced-assembly procedures when designing the Tejas Mk1 MRCA’s final assembly line----LoLzzzz!!! What a spectacularly unimpressive charade indeed! Looking at those rigs & jigs, at most eight MRCAs can roll off this much-touted ‘final assembly’ per annum, rest assured.

To DEEPAK: VMT. 7 weapon stations + one for the LDP. Payload capacity will be 3.5 tonnes.

To SNTATA: 1) Of course not. Not only is the ATGM totally compliant with all the laid-down GSQRs of the IA, but the NAMICA vehicle too has been reconfigured by BEL & is totally GSQR-compliant. 2) Hybird of what? 3) 90% of all technological shortcomings related to airframe performance have been overcome. Only MRAAM integration is missing. The real shortcomings are in the arenas of flying training/operational flight conversion & 1st-/2nd-level servicing. To date, only one tandem-seater PV has been delivered & one can’t expect 20 pilots to convert using just one OCU trainer. Secondly, no cockpit procedures trainer & full-flight simulator have emerged from ADE. Thirdly, for 1st-line/2nd-line fault diagnostics/isolation, briefcase-encased automatic test equipment (ATE) was specified by the IAF, but ADA has been unable to develop them & have instead developed only cabinet-rack-based ATE hardware that can be used only by intermediate-level avionics repair/servicing workshops. Consequently, squadron-level operational serviceability issues have not been catered to & this in turn will result in very low levels of LRU serviceability & aircraft availability of the SP-series aircraft. 4) Democracy of the type that existed in the UK 300 years ago will exist in Bangladesh, rest assured, just like Indian democracy is like what had been practiced in the UK 150 years ago.

To BHASWAR: Despite all shortcomings, my reckoning is that the Awami League will continue to middle through since it has delivered on several economic fronts, something which the BNP could not do so during its term in office. Deriving clean-sheet designs of LPHs is not a cost-prohibitive exercise at all. Using TRIBON CAD software such designs can easily be created & validated nowadays. ATHLAS is only the base design & can easily be subjected to several iterative processes. There’s no diplomatic row between the US & India. What is being splurged out by India’s officialdom is nothing but shadow-boxing & a bhel-puri of ‘nautanki’/’tamasha’ all designed to manipulate the insanely emotional way of thought of the average gullible Indian taxpayer. No one in India or abroad has ever developed any six-axis motion full-mission simulator or even a cockpit procedures trainer for the Tejas MRCA. All that the ADE has developed to date is a fixed-base cockpit avionics/instrumentation simulator encased within a dome (for testing out various cockpit ergonomics options) similar to what HALBIT had done for the HJT-36 IJT. 2013 isn’t over as yet for the Nirbhay & the rest of us. So why jump the gun? Arihant’s PWR attained criticality last May at full power. Financial sanction for developing naval 190mW PWR will be forthcoming only next fiscal year. And what victory lap for A K ‘Saint’ Antony? What exactly has he delivered? No National War memorial, no AW-101 VVIP transportation helicopters, no LW-155s, no ‘desi’ 155X45 towed howitzers, not a single BRO-built arterial road completed in northeastern Ladakh or Arunachal Pradesh, etc etc….sounds more like an utterly defeatist lap to me. Meanwhile, Sikkim & Arunachal Pradesh continue to be devoid of even civilian airports in this day & age!!! Truly a refusing-to-develop mindset, wouldn’t you concur?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Interesting read:

sntata said...

Dear Prasun,
Thank you very much for answers. By hybrid missile I mean a cross between Ballistic missile and Cruise missile, some thing like Shourya.

rad said...

Hi prasun
My earlier question about r-73 being chosen for the lca has been answered as the ceimlac guy said that the python has been chosen to be integrated. Now its going to be a series of test flights for the integration of the firing as well. Please explain if the IRST can be used to slave the ir missile seeker in the general direction in su-30mki.
Further the ceimlac guy says the that the derby and the python -5 weighs 150 kgs! so says journo Anatha krishnan in express, any one can google and find out that they weigh much less, . I have never heard of a radome made of quartz! is it true and possible.
Have you any idea of the successor to the python -5 missile , its seems impossible that the israelis have been keeping quite all these years as the python 5 came out long ago.
we havent heard much about the hjt-36, whats is happening , as well as the local embraer awacs

Raman said...

Intezzar ka phaal.....................(!!!)

Anonymous said...


The latest JF-17 with IFR probe:

also if you go down you will notice it loaded with IFR probe, 2WVRs, 2BVRs, 2C903 anti ship and 1 drop tank. The cost of it all is 15 million US dolalrs and for BLK II it will be between 20-25million.

sachin_sathe said...
ur thoughts? The IOC drama aside I find it rather puzzling tht DRDO keeps using R-73E when it(CEMILAC) announced tht the Air-to-air weapons package for Tejas mk.1 has Derby/python-5 combo? Also since the Air-to-air setup is dictated by the radar El\m 2032 why not get a few rounds of Derby & complete the integration as part of IOC itself as the missile is lighter than Astra & since astra is just now being flight-tested keep tht for FOC or as a little update package once astra is ready? your thoughts?

Are all 4 LPH's being built in india if so then has indian side learnt nothing from scorpene fiasco where it would have been easier to build first 2 in france while upgrading the shipyard capabilities. even it it is pvt players who end up getting the contract they WILL require time effort & money to learn the ropes so to speak. ur thoughts?

Excellent photo article so far but it really needs a long narrative preferably with a separate piece on the timeline.

abs said...

1)What would you make of AAP's theatrics of Mohalla Sabhas? And asking 25 lakh Delhiites of their views on Government formation?
2)What do you make of AAP's populist schemes like electricity at 50% and free 700 litres of water?

reddy said...

Regarding AAP: Good Intentions and the capabilities to realise those intentions are really two different concepts. I believe they got their intention good if not better and I seriously doubt their capabilities towards realisation.

sntata said...

Dear Prasun,

"ADE also made significant contributions in the field of simulation and simulator for the LCA. Even today the pilots fly the proposed missions in the Real Time Simulator at ADE before flying the actual aircraft, says P. Srikumar, Sc. ‘H’ & Director, ADE, in this exclusive interview to Aeromag Asia."

Is this 'Real Time Simulator' not good enough for pilot training?



Is HAL's annual ALH production rate being at all scaled up? IMHO there is still a HUGE outstanding damand for ALHs from the 3 Indian armed forces and maybe another 30+ units for the CAPFs and limited exports. The number is significvant, is HAL increasing output to faster deliver these machines?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SNTATA: So what you’re referring to are ballistic missiles capable of adopting two types of flight trajectories: pure ballistic trajectory & depressed ballistic trajectory. The Shaurya already exists as a cannistered land-mobile option but it won’t be the optimum choice for conventional strikes & the cruise missile will reign supreme in this area. Therefore, the Shaurya’s future is uncertain. Te Real-Time Simulator developed by ADE is used primarily by experimental test-pilots to only familiarise themselves with cockpit ergonomics & avionics/instrumentation control-switches. This simulator is therefore not representative of an operational flight-conversion simulator & therefore cannot simulate weapons-launch modes of operation or airborne emergency simulation—something that, for instance, the Indian navy’s MiG-29K simulator can do.

To RAD: Python-5 & Derby will go on board only the LCA (Navy) Mk1/Mk2. R-73E will go on board the Tejas Mk1/Mk2. In addition to the internal EW jammer, even the GSh-23 23mm cannon awaits flight qualification/integration. As for materials used for fabricating aircraft radomes, do browse through this:

HJT-36 IJT has a long series of flight certification trials ahead & it won’t be available for at least another 2 years at best. As for futuristic AAMs, there will be a universal airframe equipped with dual-mode seekers—IIR & AESA-based radar. Consequently, such AMRAAMs will be available in the MRAAM configuration, something the MICA family already offers in terms of common airframes, albeit with different sensors at the moment. In future, the either/or sensor option will give way to dual-mode sensors.

To SACHIN SATHE: Python-5 & Derby will go on board only the LCA (Navy) Mk1/Mk2. R-73E will go on board the Tejas Mk1/Mk2. In addition to the internal EW jammer, even the GSh-23 23mm cannon awaits flight qualification/integration. Consequently, what’s available right now is just a flight-certified airframe minus its full weapons-load & defensive EW suite. These will require at least another 2 years of extensive flight-testing. As for LPHs, present-day plans call for two to be built abroad while one each will be built by a DPSU shipyard & one by a private-sector shipyard, which is a colossal waste of money when one asks why teach two separate India-based shipbuilders to do the same work? Why not select only one shipyard & avoid duplication of the learning curve? Why not build only 1 LPH abroad while the other 3 are built in-country by a single shipbuilder?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ABS: As you’ve rightly pointed out, the AAP is engaging in pure theatrics. It could well have gone with the BJP & extended it conditional support on an issue-based basis. Getting votes from a predominantly urban constituency is much easier than bagging votes from rural areas. And proposing subsidies in this day & age is completely thoughtless & unimplementable, to say the very least. Hence the AAP os resorting to such last-minute theatrics.

By the way, if you’re interested in learning about how a country with less than 7 million population can generate the world’s largest number of corporate start-ups, then do see this:

Israel’s hi-tech strengths & secrets:

To TRUTHSEEKER: There are no plans as of now to hike the annual production rate. All that needs to be done is to stick to the originally envisaged annual production rate, which too HAL is unable to attain.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SUJOY MAJUMDAR: Here's an update on another 'tamasha' being played out now:

The SEAMAN GUARD OHIO vessel has been trapped as the FIR of the Police says ship was 19nm from Coast but same FIR says the ship was 08 Degrees 52.04 NORTH and 078 degrees 26.44 East, meaning the Indian Coast Guard lured the ship in to coastal waters to get a medal and argue that the ship was in TERRITORIAL waters and the INDIA ARMS ACT therefore applies and the Lawyers of Madurai who put up their case for bail and dismissal as USUAL have no idea of UNCLOS 1982 or IMO MSC Circular 1/1405 allowing ARMED GUARDS and TRANSFERS at sea which are called Floating Armouries and have argued very clumsily in Madurai and if I was the Judge would say NO BAIL NO DISMISSAL on the plea. UNCLOS Article 28 says arrested ship and crew should be released on payment of reasonable surety and Article 24 NOT TO HAMPER what IMO has authorised. The lawyers have not mentioned UNCLOS and have argued pathetically.

Furthermore, it is now established that it was the ICGS that confiscated all arms-related documentation from the vessel & left it unescorted, as a consequence of which the vessel, when it berthed at Tutucorin, was unable to produce the vessel's manifest-related paperwork. And the ICGS conveniently FORGOT to pass over such paperwork to the local police authorities.

srikanthkris said...

prasun da do have any info on GTRE kaveri engine. is it going to see the light of the day.

Sujoy Majumdar said...

Thanks Prasun Da for sharing that update.

I suspect since the sailors on board SEAMAN GUARD OHIO are mostly Americans they will not be released until this Devyani Kobragade case is resolved .


rad said...

HI prasun

What ever happened to the
help for test flying the LCA by EADS, there seems to be no mention of it, is the contract on or terminated?.In what way did they help us out, getting help from them will invariably reveal short comings and capabilties of the LCA to them.Was it only theoretical consultancy?.
Coming to the hjt-36.Have they sorted out the stall and spin problem.? Do you have any idea why the test pilot who was conducting test flying, comited suicide.?

joydeep ghosh said...

@Prasun da

regarding the 'Jyotish Vidya' i will only say i applid a bit of logic only

1. you say 3 submarine production lines, while the SBC line for SSBN is okay, question is how many more Scorpene under 2nd sub production line as just 6 more Scopenes dont make sense spending money on SLEP of 8 kilo subs makes no sense.

2. you say the 3rd production for SSN will have to be launched by decade end but how is that possible, as if i am not wrong IN will wait & see the performance of reactor on INS Arihant till after it completes SAT and completes a full deployment schedule. only then will IN give go ahead for SSNs.

3. still dont under why do we need a 700 km and 3500 SLBMs TDs

Regarding the Indiplomat case its now learnt that the maid was reported absconding since last 6 months and just 2 days before her arrest her family was flown out of India by US, this gives rise to suspicion that the maid had something to do with a spy ring and US wanted to save her at all cost.

If the US doesnt drop chages on wjhat is just a wage dispute dont you think Ibndia should go ahead and file case against the lady US diplomat who was caught in 2006 for spying but let off to help US save face


Joydeep Ghosh

Littlemaster said...

Here it says 'The electronic warfare trials were conducted at a base in Central India.'
If the Ew suite hasnt been tested yet, then what is this ?

2.Somewhere in that blog,I read the Tejas mmr has achieved a range of just 45-50 km and efforts are going on to improve this figure to 80 km by utilisng a nw radar dome.So will elm-2032 of Tejas finally going to have an air to air range of just 80km against an average fighter sized target ?

3.Has any heavy weight torpedo been finalised for the Kolkata class,P-17 class?When will this deal get signed. When INS Kolkata is commmissioned early next year will it be having its complement of torpedos?

4.What will be the main gun of Kolkata class- 130mm or Oto Melera 76/62 Srgm ?

5.When will INS Arihant seatrials begin ?It is being speculated for quite some time that sea trials will begin soon but it hasnt begun till now.

6.Is there connetion between the 5v55 hit to kill missile of S-500 and Bmd phase 2 PDV ?

rad said...

HI Prasun
DRDO people claim the present astra missile has a range of 40 km and the mk2 version will have a 100km range , it seems far fetched as how they are going to increase the range of the missile by 150% without airframe change or ramjet etc.I would understand abou 50% increase but 150 % eems way off.
Please explain

Thakur said...

Hi Prasun Da,

Can you suggest some source for LCA vs JF 17 technical comparison on 1 place ?

Thanks in Advance !

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SRIKANTHKRIS: Which version of Kaveri? The airborne version is still under development & it won’t be ready for flight-certification trials until 2016 at the earliest. Likewise, the KGMT too requires uprating but no such R & D activity has been initiated on this uprated version as yet.

To SUJOY MAJUMDAR: The two issues are totally unrelated. It's always the same story about India's officialdom never tiring of tying itself up in knots & building up a hysteria from which there is no escape! And the average Indian citizen, totally deprived of the gift of logical reasoning, always inevitably becomes a sucker for propaganda. This is exactly what's happened with the ENRICA LEXIE & SEAGUARD OHIO & the very same is now happening in New York with this shameless & demented Indian consular person who has obviously committed perjury & India’s MEA, in order to cover up this matter in its all-knowing wisdom, has in a panic shunted her off to the UN. To be noted is the fact that the MEA has NEVER SO FAR disputed the contents of the arrest warrant, which can be found here:

Then there are other revelations that are now emerging. For instance, these two:

Bottomline is that India cannot ever stand-up to a superpower, especially one that has not yet recognised the UNCLOS. Do read this:

Lastly, what makes the Indian Navy's DND a global laughing stock is the release of official videos showing the INS Vikrant equipped with Boeing F-15E Strike Eagles. Just watch this:

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAD: Tonight, I’m hereby recommending that A K Antony, his press-secretary Sitanshu Kar, SA to RM Dr Avinash Chander ADA Director P S Subramaniam & DG-Aero & CE CEMILAC Dr K Tamil Mani all urgently seek psychiatric assistance because they all had willfully participated in an elaborate 'nautanki' played out yesterday with the so-called IOC-2 phase commencement for Tejas Mk1 MRCA. How can a 'Release To Service Certificate' ever be awarded to an aircraft that is devoid of the ASQR-specified CW/PW internal jammer (only the RWR is present & airframe-mounted apertures for the jammer are clearly missing), devoid of the KBP Gryazev-Shipunov GSh-23 23mm cannon & devoid of BVR-MRAAM missiles is anyone's guess. Furthermore, aerodynamic flight envelope expansion from -2G/6G to -3.5G/8G & 24-degree AoA from the current 22-degree hasn’t been completed. BVR-MRAAM hasn’t yet been chosen for the IAF’s Tejas Mk1 version, leave alone being test-fired. The home-grown nose-radome limits the EL/M-2032 MMR’s multi-target-tracking range to a mere 40km (resulting in the Astra-1 MRAAM being li9mited to a range of 40km), while the landing gear’s carbon-carbon brake-pads are prone to over-heating. It’s like taking delivery of a limousine from a distributor with the proviso that only the chassis & body are certified for road-usage & the limousine will have to return back to the workshop during periodic intervals to have its engine, gearbox, suspensions & brake-pads issued with supplementary final certifications!!! And will any of the world’s Road Transportation Department or insurance company ever issue a registration certificate for such an automobile? What will happen if a Tejas Mk1 PV or LSP enter an unpredictable flight regime while in the process of test-firing the GSh-23 or Astra-1? What if certain internal LRUs suffer catastrophic failure when such test-firings are taking place? Who will be held accountable—CEMILAC or the IAF? Clearly, therefore, the flight-certification process is nowhere near completion & consequently the RSC too is totally meaningless. On top of it all, P S Subramaniam has the gall to say that Tejas is completely battle-ready!!! If this is not sheer insanity, then what else is??? Then there are more outrageous remarks from him, like “it can be readied for another mission within an hour’s time”, & “we have demonstrated flying thrice in a day, which is a pointer towards the ease at which it can be serviced”. Hell, even JAS-39 Gripen C/D & Su-30MKI can be re-armed & refuelled within 20 minutes & be readied for takeoff & can fly two aerobatic sorties within an interval of just 40 minutes! Suffice to say that all this only ‘desi nautanki’ turns India in to a global laughing stock. And the outgoing CAS of the IAF has no other choice but to endure such theatrics since his patience will be rewarded with an ambassadorship in a ‘phoren’ country, just as the previous two CNS of IN became Ambassadors (one to NZ & one to Canada) for playing along with the GoI & forcing the IN to undertake coastal security tasks after 26/11 at the cost of maritime security.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To JOYDEEP GHOSH: FYI logic is never applied in bits & pieces. Either one applies logic or one doesn’t. Those who claim to apply a bit of logic are demented & immature, to put it mildly. 1) SLEP costs for 8 x Type 877EKM SSKs will be far cheaper than acquiring six additional new-build Scorpene SSKs. Presently, the IN’s projected fleet structure matrix calls for acquiring only 3 more Scorpenes to add to the six on order. 2) Arihant’s PWR has nothing to do with the PWR for the SSN since the latter will have a much more powerful 190mW PWR. 3) 700km SLBM is only a technology demonstrator. The first operational SLBM will be the 3,500km-range K-5/B-05. Regarding the accused Indian consular official, do read the following:

Then there are other revelations that are now emerging. For instance, these two:

How can India ever file charges against any US diplomat who is no longer residing in India & therefore doesn’t have to answer to Indian law? After all, it was India that let her off the hook, wasn’t it? So how can charges be filed against her retroactively? Don’t tell me you’ve stumbled into the same bottomless abyss that your illustrious President fell into while he, as Union Finance Minister, introduced the retroactive taxation regime! This is exactly what happens when one applies ‘a bit of logic only’ instead of applying logic in its entirety (LoLzZz). I therefore earnestly pray to all the Gods of Yore (since I don’t know which of them exactly are your select favourites) that they shower you with all their blessings so that the entire volume & quantum of your cerebral cortex becomes all fired-up & you’re able to overwhelmingly apply logic in your assertions & (using Star Trek phraseology) “go when no man has ever gone before.”

To LITTLEMASTER: 1) Trials of only the RWR were conducted, not those of the internal CW/PW jammer. 2) EL/M-2032 MMR’s detection range is 100km, track-while-scan range is 80km. 3) Not yet. No. 4) OTOBreda 76/62 SRGM. 5) Have already commenced. 6) None.

To THAKUR: Am unaware of any such site or poster. You may contact the IAF’s TACDE for detailed data on this subject, since TACDE specialises on formulating such comparative data.

rad said...

Hi Prasun
The hjt-36 is only weeks away from certification s!!, so says HAL ! Another joke on the public?
I heard there were serious spin problems what happened to that?. did we get consultancy from EADS fro the sitara aw well?
The released pics show the sitara with a box like structure jutting from the tail.Is it an anti spin chute.
Any idea why test pilot Baldev singh took his life?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Here's more evidence of perjury:

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAD: Of course it is. And chances are that the same type of IOC-1/IOC-2 'tamasha' resorted to for the Tejas Mk1 MRCA will also be adopted as the benchmark for the HJT-36. The re are fundamental design flaws with the HJT-36's airframe & hence the unstable aerodynamics, since the airframe was originally designed to accept the less powerful Larzac engines of SNECMA Moteurs, & not the more powerful NPO Saturn-built AL-55I. The nose landing gear's design too was found wanting. Consultancy help has come not from EADS, but from BAE Systems. EADS has been roped in only by ADA for designing a weight-budgeted main landing gear assembly of the LCA (Navy) Mk1 & Mk2. The box-like housing on the HJT-36's tail section contains the anti-spin chute. As for why Baldy committed suicide, your guess is as good as mine.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAD: Here’s more hogwash from the ADA Director:

Regarding Question 6, the ADA Director is now claiming that the EL/M-2032 MMR will be retained, meaning goodbye to all hopes for adopting an AESA-MMR (imported or home-grown). He is also probably unaware of the IAF’s ASQR for Tejas Mk2 which has mandated a new-generation cockpit design. Regarding Question 9, this guy is probably blabbering without thinking when he says that the AMCA would need 7-10 years for development. Obviously he hasn’t been monitoring the developments surrounding the FGFA or F-35 JSF & consequently he hasn’t got any clue about either the formidable R & D challenges involved in developing fifth-generation MRCAs, or about the stealth features of the Rafale M-MRCA.

Atul K said...


What are the various ways to improve the HJT-36 aircraft for its successful completion? Can you please elaborate?

Thanks in advance.

Bhaswar said...

"The first operational SLBM will be the 3,500km-range K-5/B-05."

Sir isn't the K-5 supposed to have a range of 5000Km, also it was supposed to be meant for the Arihant follow on class of submarines?

By "victory lap" I meant that he has fooled the common masses and the brain dead media into going along with his IOC-2 shenanigans, after all once you cleared the air it all becomes rather obvious, we won't even be able to sart operational conversion without a certified tac. simulator and LIFT so everything else remains rather irrelevant at the moment.

On the topic of Tejas, what progress has ADA made with their venture of creating indigenous alternatives for all the foreign sourced LRUs?

So we will see the Nirbhay tested in the next ten days or so?

Btw the international media has pilloried us for our stand on the "diplomatic spat" with the US, babus being babus I guess, no regard for how to ACTUALLY protect the dignity of the nation. Although putting her through a strip and cavity search was indeed harsh and against the spirit of maintaining good ties given her position.

Didn't Iran pull out of the nuclear talks again? It seems that for every one step the US takes in the right direction it takes 2 backwards. What do you think will be the final result of these talks ,that is if they even continue and what will be the repercussions for the region?

When will the final verdict on the Kishanganga project be out, wasn't it supposed to be out this December after the partial verdict in Feb?

With the proper aerial and space based ISTAR assets wouldn't a SSN with tube launched Brahmos arsenal be pretty much the ultimate anti-shipping weapon, in fact it would pretty much plug the Pakistan SLOC without giving them much of an option. I believe that over the horizon ASM require such ISTAR assets to provide them with target detection, how does this work exactly? As in how does a submarine acquire target acquisition data from an ISTAR asset and then pass it on to the ASM as it is launched and while it is in flight? Could you explain the whole process in detail and how the submarine can acquire said data without breaking its cover?


Dear Prasun,
India has taken three decades to get the so-called IOC-II. I don't understand how come the JF -17 MRCA has been cleared for production within a short span of seven years. Have they gone through all test parameters? How will it fare against MiG-29UPG? Pilots who flew the craft told that, it is better than F-16. Is it true??? Your comments please.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SOUBHAGYA: Your timelines for the JF-17 are incorrect. The JF-17 project was initiated in 1986 as the Super Sabre project & in the mid-1990s it became the Super 7 project, followed by its JF-17 avatar. The Tejas Mk1 MRCA's R & D phase was delayed by 12 years due to the financial crisis between 1991-1998 & the four years of US technological embargoes from 1998 till 2002. Had R & D funds been sanctioned as per original plans, then the Tejas Mk1's entire flight-control system would have been fully developed by Lockheed Martin by 1995 itself & the first TD could well have flown in 1996. Had that happened, then even going by conservative estimates, by 2006, the Tejas Mk1 would have entered service with the IAF. MiG-29UPG’s on-board IRST sensor gives it the look-first shoot-first capability that the JF-17 presently lacks.

Kris said...

Hey Prasunda,

We are still waiting for the narrative..but no pressure...take your time.

Thanks a lot for your answers.You are like the proverbial defence guru for us.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ATUL K: Firstly, the wings have to be redesigned & the airframe’s stall recovery capacity ought to be increased. Secondly, the cockpit avionics & instrumentation will need to be radically reconfigured. Presently, the HJT-36’s cockpit avionics/instrumentation content is almost the same as that of the PC-7 Mk2. Thirdly, the nose landing gear needs radical redesign.

To KRIS: VMT. Will try to expedite matters.

To PINTU: Govt of India very well knows that its case is extremely weak & the Indian IFS officer has indeed broken US laws by giving false declarations on-record. She obviously didn’t believe in the adage “when in Rome, do as the Romans do”. Well, actions do have consequences & let her bear them all to the fullest, since she has also beyond reasonable doubt committed the same type of crime within India as well (aka the Adarsh Society flat allotment). To me, such creatures don’t deserve any mercy at all. Press TV has been indulging in such acts ever since 2010 when it was banned from the Kashmir Valley for broadcasting in a biaised manner. Therefore, one malicious campaign can only be neutralised by another equally malicious campaign. Press TV is also sponsored by Iran’s Basij/Pasdaran militias, that are not answerable to the Govt of Iran.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To BHASWAR: That’s right, the K-4/B-04 SLBM will have 3,500km-range. Until that is realized, work on K-5 won’t begin. To be fair, some of the ‘desi brain-dead’ media honchos have already realised that they were taken for a ride on January 10, 2011 with the IOC-1 ‘nautanki/tamasha’ & are therefore now at least talking about the need to do away with illusory deadlines. Some of the ADA-worshippers too have made course-corrections in their reportage. For instance, one of them is now reporting that “the formation of No 45 ‘Flying Daggers’ Squadron earmarked for Tejas might take another two more years” & “HAL’s promise of delivering the first production variant of Tejas (SP-1) by March 2014 might be little far-fetched. We hope to have the first aircraft by end by mid of 2014. The first two aircraft (SP-1, SP-2) might not meet our standards for squadron formation as the metal cutting and hardware were done before we froze the IOC-2 test points” & “Truly speaking, before the IOC event, all hardware must be finalised, which might not still be the case with Tejas”. Then there are others who have wrongly reported that the OBOGs needs to be developed. In fact, OBOGS was productionised long ago by L & T & is already flightworthy. To top it all, there have been contradictory statements from HAL & ADA, which will surely drive the RM nuts. While HAL has claimed that the first Tejas Mk2 will roll out by 2015, ADA’s Director is now saying that “by the first quarter of the next year, i.e. March 2014, the preliminary design would be frozen. Somewhere in 2018, the Mk2 will be ready for productionisation. This time there will be no prototypes. We will design for production“. I would very much like to see how the hell will ADA achieve this feat, when the heavier & more powerful F414 turbofan will require the Tejas Mk2’s airframe to be strengthened & lengthened, while more avionics LRUs will need to be housed inside, thanks to the IAF’s vintage 2012 ASQR for the Mk2. Ultimately, we come to the components not yet indigenised. These are the most critical components & unavailability of even one of them will result in the entire fleet being grounded (hope A K Antony reads this). The following are the components awaiting indigenisation:

Cont’d below……

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Enhanced Video cum Digital Recorder (EVDR), EVDR Remote Cassette Unit Holder (RCUH), EVDR Removable Mass Memory Device, GPS Antenna, Gyro Reference Unit, HMDS Guillotine Assembly, HMDS-line of sight computer Unit, HMDS-Magnetic Transmitter Coil Unit , HMDS-Seat Position Sensor Assembly, HMDS-System Control Panel, IFF Antenna, Marker Antenna, Multi Mode Radar-Ethernet switch, Multifunction AMLCDs, Radio Altimeter (RAM) Antenna, RWR Antenna, RWR Power Divider, RWR Switch Filter Assembly (RF Units), TACAN Antenna, V/UHF Blade Antenna, V/UHF Radio ACR 500LA, VHF Omni Range–Instrument Landing System, VOR – ILS Blade Antennas, VOR-ILS Diplexer, Bypass Valve Primary Heat Exchanger, Cabin Pressure Control Valve, Cabin Pressure Safety Valve, Cabin Shut-Off Valve, ECS-Shut-Off Valve, Ejector Shut Off Valve, Filter Cabin Pressure Control, Flow Control Valve for Avionics cooling, Inward Relief Valve, Pressure Reducer-Radar and Cabin Seal Pressurisation, Pressure Sensor Avionics Inlet, Pressure Sensor P26 (Condenser), Pressure Sensor P79 for Avionics Flow Control, Pressure Sensor P24 Bleed Air Inlet, Pressure Switch-High, 40 Environmental Control Pressure Switch-Low, Pressure Transducer-Cabin, PRV-SOV (Pressure Reduction Valve/Shut off Valve), PRV-SOV Control Unit, Seal Inflation / Deflation Valve, Temperature Control Valve, Temperature Sensor (High), Temperature Sensor (Low), Temperature Sensor-Pneumatic, Water Separator, 0.35 kVA HMDG (Hydraulic Motor Driven Generator)-Left Hand, 0.35 kVA HMDG Right Hand, 0.35 kVA HMDG Voltage Regulator Unit, 30/40 kVA Integral Drive Generator, 30/40 kVA IDG-Generator Control Unit, 5kVA HMDG, 5kVA HMDG –GCU, Ground Power Receptacle, Light-Anti Collision, Light Taxi/Landing, Light-Wander, Power Supply Unit-Anti Collision Light, Undercarriage display unit, Undercarriage Selector Lever, ESCAPE Ejection Seat, Air Data Probe [NADP], Air Data Sensor-Left Side [LADP], Air Data Sensor-Right Side [RADP], AoA (Angle of Attach) Sensor [AoA / AoSS vanes], Pilot Control Grip, Leading Edge Vane Controller (LEVCON) Servo Actuator Assembly, Probe Total Temperature [TATP], Sensor Assembly, Accelerometer [ASA], Sensor Assembly Rate [RSA], 74 Health and Utility Management System (HUMS) HUMS-Data Acquisition unit, Control cable - Park Brake Control, Control cable-Undercarriage Emergency, Emergency Undercarriage Selector Valve, Flow Synchroniser, Pressure Gauge, Pressure Switches, Pressure Switch–EMDP (Electric Motor Driven Pump), Pressure Switch-P/B, Pressure Transducers, Progressive Pressure Control Valve, Slide & Swivel Joints, Anti-skid Brake Manifold, Brake Feel Module Input Potentiometer, Free castor valve for Nose Wheel Steering (Solenoid valve), Nose Wheel Steering Input Potentiometer, Nose Wheel Steering Manifold, Nosewheel Steering Position Sensor, (Feedback potentiometer), Air/No Fuel Float Valve, Differential Pressure Switch, Electric Refuelling Valve, Engine third mount pin, Float Valve, Fuel Drain Valve, Fuel Filler Cap, Fuel flow straighter, Fuel flow Transmitter, Fuel Shut Off Cock, Fuel/No Air Valve, Low-Pressure Fuel Shut Off Cock dia 25mm, Motorised Fuel Transfer Valve, Pressure Reducing Valves, Surge Relief Valve-F1 & F2 tanks, Surge Relief Valve-F1A tanks, Surge Relief Valve-Wing tanks, Throttle Grip, Throttle Quadrant Assembly, Transfer-cum-Refuelling Valve, Charge Amplifier (Pre-Amplifier).

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Excellent & highly hilarious commentary on the pathetic state of affairs & a regressive Indian mindset:

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Here's more to lighten your weekend:

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

And some more.....

rad said...

Hi Prasun
The exhaustive list of parts for local production is mind boggling! may be hope fully in 10 years time we can do 50% of them, but some are not cost effective to produce in small numbers.
Because the HJT-36 has fundamental design flaws is that it will be a write of or Bae will help solve the issues.But i have to admit it looks much better and contemporary compared to the k-8 trainer. I`ve noticed vortice strakes on the wings in the later pics which mean there could have been flow separation at high AOA without them.
A source from delhi told me that Baldy was honey trapped and rather than embarass his family and the country took his life.
I have the same feeling with the richards women who filed a case against Devyanai diplomat.Its too obvious that she was spying for uncle sam and offered a green card in return and they flew her out of the country. Catch uncle sam giving a servant a green card for nothing!!
What i dont understand is the optimism about lca m2 , The foll are going to be new-- Engine , aesa radar,avionics display, extra weapon station,irst, missiles,it seems the air frame is a little longer and wings have more area,
All this means that the weight distribution and flight characteristics will change .That needs vast test flying-- please comment

Pintu said...

Very Many Thanks Prasun Da, Sorry that I have to delete my previous post in order to edit and re post, since Google Blogger does not give any option for editing the existing post.

Please continue with the great work.

Meanwhile, in view of the above link, what strikes me most, that uncanny nature of Nawaz Sharif led Govt. to 'guinea pig' Karachi population in order to maintain some national ego despite strong reservation by nuclear physicists like Pervez Hoodbhoy :

May it be :

A. Mia Sharrif, is again going for the old useless path of projecting Pakistan as sole leader of 'Nuclear Technology' in 'Islamic World' which may have been seriously dented after progress made by the Iran, while taking into the account of severe electricity crisis in Pakistan ?

B. Karachi is the HQ of 'MQM' and hence the power base of 'Muhajirs' so, in case of any disaster happens to these plants, that movement may be crushed to 'once and for all' in disguise of replacing the affected population ?

C. Total 'Bania' mentality shown by China, to her all-weather friend, taking 'Beggars can't be choosers' approach ?

Please share your views.

Vikrant said...

1)What should India's approach be towards the likes of BNP should they come to power in Dhaka?Is the any change in the stand of Begum Zia wrt India(assuming that can happen)
2)How should India include gilgit baltistan in it's Kashmir policy(its about time) and how to integrate the region(if that is possible)?
A few links regarding the same would be helpful
3)What is the status of the Nirbhay project and how much time will it take to integrate it to the naval fleet?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

RD said...

Psychological warfare has proven to be most dangerous threat in current times in which China comes ahead of US-

Neighbours r in full swing in grabbing as much land during the chaotic 2014 election year.

Another example of so called arms embargo & sanctions just restricted to paper & only applicable to third world countries can be seen-

Gessler said...

Prasun check out this amazing wallpapaer -

It's quite fantastic, don't you think? Very imaginative...

Sorry for posting off topic stuff !!

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAD: As you rightly pointed out, most of the imported components will take decades to infigenise due to the low quantities required. That’s why the crawl, walk & run approach should have been adopted so as to build up economies of scale. Had this been done, then the HTT-35 would have developed as the BTT in the late 1980s, the HJT-36 should have been developed as a swept-wing AJT by the late 1990s, followed by the Tejas Mk1/Mk2 MRCAs in the previous decade. Since this did not happen, the cost of imports has been increasing exponentially since 2002. What few know about is that today HAL’s annual bill for imports is Rs4,600 crores, & this figure will only increase in the years to come. Regarding HAL’s final-assembly line for Tejas Mk1 MRCA, it will be a manufacturing-cum-assembly line, which is quite strange since DPSUs like BEML & private-sector companies like ALPHA are already manufacturing several major airframe sub-structures for the Su-30MKI in Bengaluru (as shown at Aero India 2013) & shipping them top Nashik for final assembly & the same could have been done for Tejas Mk1 as well. Tejas Mk2’s airframe will definitely feature a lengthened fuselage & greater wing-area, & will therefore require extensive flight-tests lasting at least 3 years. Consequently, to say that no prototypes will be reqd is utter hogwash of the most insulting kind! As for the IJT, HAL was sanctioned Rs180 crore in July 1999 to build only two HJT-36 IJT technology demonstrators. In 2005, the budget was raised to Rs467 crore to order NPO Saturn-developed AL-55I turbofans. Total expenditure on R & D incurred to date stands at Rs634.23 crore. Not a single LSP-series or SP-series HJT-36 has been ordered to date, contrary to speculation that 12 LSPs were ordered in 2006 for Rs 486.82 crore & 73 SP-series worth Rs6,180 crore were ordered in March 2010. Interestingly, even the IN, which operates HJT-16 Kiran-2 BJTs, has not bothered to order any HJT-36s or even PC-7 Mk2s, although the Hawk Mk132 AJTs are now in delivery. That explains a lot about why HAL is releasing selective info on the HJT-36 while IAF HQ is absolutely mum about it. Karakoram-8 is a primary trainer, not an IJT.

Cont’d below…

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

As for Baldy’s suicide, what I have seen over the years both inside & outside India is that both non-Sikh Punjabi men & Sikh men tend to start having extra-marital affairs & become alcoholics (as part of a mid-life crisis) after they turn 40 because by that time their Punjabi wives, also in their late 30s or early 40s, tend to start getting bloated & lose almost all features of feminity (maybe due to their genetic make-up) & externally, look masculine. Just look at the wives of several of India’s senior armed services & diplomatic service personnel & you’ll be able to see this for yourself. The hapless male, meanwhile, is unable to exploit his sexuality through his marriage partner & therefore begins to look elsewhere for sexual gratification. I’ve seen several Punjabi families getting destroyed due to this syndrome, both inside India & throughout Southeast Asia. I’ve also been witness to several Indian career diplomats & Defence Advisers (all aged 40+ & all hailing from Punjab or UP) posted in at least two friendly Southeast Asian capitals taking to frequenting brothels (showing a distinct preference for females of Chinese origin) & becoming a public embarrassment for the Govt of India. I could write an entire book chronicling all their escapades!

Cont’d below…..

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

As for the maidservant being a US spy, if indeed she was, then she would have gladly endured her lesser monthly salary as a nanny & carried on spying for the long-haul, since she would have been adequately compensated by her US handlers. Evidently, this did not happen, because the Indian Consul-General in NY was engaged in only travel & cultural activities (spies are implanted only with families & officials attached to Embassies/High Commissions, never with those serving in Consulates). Furthermore, this drama has been going on since last June when the GoI revoked the maidservant’s Indian passport & her mother-in-law & father are both well-versed with US laws since the former was a housemaid to a previous US Embassy staffer in Delhi, while the latter is still the chauffeur to the present-day US Political Counsellor of the US Embassy in Delhi. Talking of extremes, if one wants to further expand the spectularly outrageous Bollywood flick-type conspiracy theory, one could also argue that the female Indian diplomat herself is a spy who never intends to return back to India since she is already married to a US citizen who will never even consider surrendering his US citizenship for the love-of-his-life once her tenure in the US is over & she would have to go back to India. Bottomline is that 1) the GoI has gone on a frenzy typing itself up in knots (just like it did regarding the AW-101 procurement scandal); 2) Not even once did it contest the charges levied by the District of New York; & 3) just like the last time, this time too the Indian taxpayer will have to foot the bill for the utterly stupid folly of an MEA official. Do read this:

The fact remains that these so-called diplomats are never tired of becoming a public embarrassment since they sincerely believe that the ‘Chalta Hai’ attitude is not just India-specific, but a global phenomenon. Well, it’s high time such blithering retards got the punishments they rightly deserve.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RD: Setting up camps in winter-time anywhere is strictly of a temporary duration & won’t last for more than a week, rest assured. They will then pack-up & leave & no one will grab or encroach upon anyone’s land. On the other hand, let me give you an example of another kind of psychological warfare of the kind practiced by a ‘desi’ Shri 420. Do read this:

What this means that this Shri 420 will be outsourcing the delivery of all his intellectual inputs, will publish them as value-added material, & make money out of this exercise, leaving the all providers of intellectual inputs with only illusory stars & strips!!! Way to go indeed….on the footsteps of the discredited Devyani Khobragade!!!

Regarding the EU arms embargo, there are several factual inaccuracies in that Reuters news-report. 1) PLA warships & submarines are powered by diesel-engines made by SEMT-Pielstick, not MTU or MAN. 2) THALES-built sonars were supplied ONLY FOR DDG 112 Harbin & DDG 113 Qingdao in the mid-1980s. 3) Production-engineering & tooling for building Eurocopter’s SA.365 Dauphin-2s was given in mid-1980s. 4) China’s FM-90 family of SHORADS is of 1980s vintage & is actually the Crotale. 5) Rolls-Royce Spey Mk66 turbofans of 1960s vintage are now totally built in China thanks to R-R’s ToT in the mid-1980s & these turbofans power the JH-7 bomber. 6) The PLAN’s Y-8MPAs have RACAL-built Searchwater 2000 maritime patrol radars acquired in the early 1990s & not ASW/AEW radars. 7) PLAN’s Type 039 Song-class SSKs & Type 041 Yuan-class SSKs have SEMT-Pielstick engines, not MTU. 8) In the late spring of 2003, a disabled Type 035 Ming-class SSK (No361) was found drifting, partly submerged, in the Bohai Sea off China’s northern coast. When the boat was raised, rescuers found all 70 of its crew dead. Their deaths were due to a malfunctioning experimental fuel cell-based AIP. 9) Type 022 Hobei-class DAC-M catamarans have Wartsila-supplied waterjets. The air-conditioning & internal communications suites for the PLAN’s four Russia-built Type 956E DDGs were supplied by Germany in the late 1990s.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To PINTU: What else can I say, except that the description of events & their analysis by renowned Pakistan intellectuals are by themselves the best commentary.

VIKRANT: 1) Any govt that comes to power in Bangladesh has no choice but to be friendly with India, since Bangladesh is hemmed in on all 3 sides by India & therefore does not have access to any other friendly hinterland. 2) Very easy indeed….just raise the decibels on a global scale about the stateless nature & existence of the inhabitants of that area since 1947. India should have initiated such activities since late 1999 itself. Today the people of Skardu are crying out loud about all-weather connectivity with Kargil & while India wants such connectivity to exist, Pakistan does not. India’s leaders need to learn a lesson or two about becoming a stand-up guy (for the right reasons only & not I support of India’s discredited & deceitful IFS officers posted abroad) just like Hamid Karzai has stood up to not only Pakistan, but also to the US. 3) Nirbhay’s R & D cycle is still on-going & such projects on average have a 10-year lifecycle. 6 years have already been spent, so another 4 more to go.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To GESSLER: What the hell was that!!! Anyway, time for some serious stuff. Here are the documentaries dealing with precise timelines on the arrival of Pleiadiens on Earth & what all they did:

Here are two excellent documentary on the Sumerians:

Kumar said...

Dear Prasunda,

St Anty said in parliament that Project 75I subs will be built by MDL (3), HSL (1) and a foreign manufacturer (2).

1. What does that mean? Is he going for another line of sub manufacturing or will improve or maintain on the Scorpene line?

2. Why HSL? The one kilo sub they opened is still open and rusting.Now they want to 'manufacture' one? OR is it an attempt of Pallam Raju to give something to his constituency? Or there is a genuine need for a separate line of manufacturing for eastern coast?

3. Which are the contenders now in the scene? DCNS, Navantia or TKMP?

4. Which AIP would be preferred? Fuel cell based or Stirling one?

5. What will happen to the following deals now? Apache, Chinook, Sikorsky-70B helos, LM role in Avro replacement, LW155, etc? Will they be affected by the current imbroglio?

6. You have argued for the acquisition of S-70B helo for marine multi/ASW role. But its an old design and Australia recently started replacing them. So why S-70B?

Thanks for all your clarifications.

sntata said...

Dear Prasun,

I thought that IJT Sitara was a dead duck.Now it seems it is very much alive and kicking.

"Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) has revealed that its Sitara intermediate jet trainer (IJT), which has been in development since 1999, is now "just weeks away from certification"."
"We have accelerated flight testing dramatically this year, doing 183 sorties - thrice as many as any preceding year. Last month we completed bombing trials and extra fuel tank trials in Jamnagar. Now we are completing the stall and spin tests, after which we will get the IOC," says Krishna Kumar, Project Manager IJT for HAL."

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SNTATA: As for the IJT, HAL was sanctioned Rs180 crore in July 1999 to build only two HJT-36 IJT technology demonstrators. In 2005, the budget was raised to Rs467 crore to order NPO Saturn-developed AL-55I turbofans. Total expenditure on R & D incurred to date stands at Rs634.23 crore. Not a single LSP-series or SP-series HJT-36 has been ordered to date, contrary to speculation that 12 LSPs were ordered in 2006 for Rs 486.82 crore & 73 SP-series worth Rs6,180 crore were ordered in March 2010. Interestingly, even the IN, which operates HJT-16 Kiran-2 BJTs, has not bothered to order any HJT-36s or even PC-7 Mk2s, although the Hawk Mk132 AJTs are now in delivery. That explains a lot about why HAL is releasing selective info on the HJT-36 while IAF HQ is absolutely mum about it.

Haryvanam Kiran said...

Hi Prasun,
An off topic from defence, I'd like to know your comments on the below article..


Prasun K. Sengupta said...

At last!!!

Mr. Ra 13 said...

This and specially Barak is a good news.

DefenseandAerospace said...

Prasun ,

Thanks for sharing the link on the Barak deal . I suspect now the Barak 8 deal will also be given the green signal .

In this article it is also stated that 16 anti submarine warships will be built and a tender will be floated for diving support vessels .

(1) Will you please tell which docks in India will be tasked to develop anti submarine ships and what are the technologies that have to be imported to design these ships ?

(2) Which foreign OEMs will bid for the diving support vessels tender ?

Many Thanx

raw13 said...

Happy Holidays Gents!!!

Atul K said...


Merry Christmas to you and your family.

Best Wishes

Nishant Thakur said...

Merry Christmas to you and your family.

Best Wishes

Pintu said...

Happy Christmas to Prasun Da,everybody around here, and their loved ones.

Pintu said...

Prasun Da, kindly share your view about the matter regarding Ex-Justice Ashok Kumar Ganguly for about 'Sexual Harassment of a Law Intern' ?


Dear Prasun,
What will be role of Tejas Mk 1 during a limited high intensity war like situation ? Can it withstand the threats from rival aircraft with its existing radome and MMR??? Can it perform according to the expectation? Will the Mk 2 be a 4++/4.5 generation aircraft? Will it incorporate any stealth features???

Pintu said...

Prasun Da , As also your views :

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To Haryvanam Kiran: I have absolutely no reason to doubt the conclusions reached by the learned official. He is spot-on in his assessment.

To Mr.RA 13: It must be noted though, that the reqmt is ONLY for additional missile-rounds, & not for additional systems for which too there is an outstanding reqmt for at least 10 more systems. The extra missile-rounds are meant for replacing those whose shelf-lives have already expired (after their 20-year lifespan) & require re-lifing for another 8 years. Also, just as I had predicted:

To DEFENSE & AEROSPACE: It must be noted though, that the reqmt is ONLY for additional missile-rounds, & not for additional systems for which too there is an outstanding reqmt for at least 10 more systems. The extra missile-rounds are meant for replacing those whose shelf-lives have already expired (after their 20-year lifespan) & require re-lifing for another 8 years. 1) These are all shallow-water ASW vessels of the type that can easily be built by GSL, CSL & GRSE. 2) OEMs from Canada, Russia, Sweden, & Norway. The Remora DSRV from Canada’s Ocean Works is the best candidate. Diving support vessel (submarine tender) can easily be built by OEMs like HSL, with the design coming from abroad.

To RAW 13, ATUL K, NISHANT THAKUR, PINTU: And the very same to you all & all your loved ones. And to all the orthodox Christians, a very happy new year & a very merry X’mas (in that order).

To PINTU: The law of the land says one is innocent until proven guilty & therefore the same should hold true for Justice Ganguly as well.

To SOUBHAGYA: The posters uploaded on the latest thread answer most of your questions. Even with the existing nose radome, a 40km-target tracking capability is excellent, since the Derby has a range of only 36km.