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Sunday, October 26, 2014

New Force Accretions Are Welcome, But There's More On The Waiting List-2

The Indian Army’s (IA) special operations forces, known as SF (Para), will at last begin acquiring the vital force-multipliers that were promised to them as far back as 2004! Yesterday, the MoD’s Defence Acquisitions Council (DAC) cleared the decks for the DPB to initiate sole-source contractual negotiations for a number of items for not only the SF (Para) formations, but also for the IA’s newly-created XVII Corps, which, essentially, is a warfighting formation that will specialise in highland warfare and will also be air-mobile in nature.  
To be ordered in the near future will be 8,356 Spike-SR ATGMs (FROM Israel’s RAFAEL) and related 321 ultra-light ATGM launchers worth Rs 3,200 crore, plus ELTA Systems-built ELM-2138T ‘Green Rock’ Tactical Counter Rockets, Artillery & Mortars (C-RAM) Systems, and ELBIT Systems Electro-Optics’ Long View CR optronic sensors. On the other hand, for equipping the Indian Army’s existing 356 infantry battalions (inclusive of 44 mechanised infantry battalions) of the 1.13 million-strong IA and the projected 30 new infantry battalions to be raised in the 13th five-year defence plan (2018-2022) 1,914 FGM-148 Javelin ATGM launchers and up 37,860 missile-rounds (including war wastage reserves) and 12,000 SMAW-2NE launchers and up to 80,000 rounds of various types are planned to be procured in future.
Presently, the IA is authorised by the MoD to have a total of 81,206 ATGMs, with each infantry battalion deployed in the plains being armed with four medium-range (1.8km-range) and four long-range (4km-range) ATGM launchers (each with six missiles), and those in the mountains have one of each type along with six missiles for each launcher. In reality, however, the IA’s total existing inventory of ATGMs now stands at only 44,000 that includes 10,000 second-generation MBDA-developed and BDL-built SACLOS wire-guided Milan-2 ATGMs and 4,600 launchers; 4,100 second-generation MBDL-supplied Milan-2T ATGMs; 15,000 second-generation 4km-range 9M113M Konkurs-M SACLOS wire-guided ATGMs licence-built by BDL, plus another 10,000 that are now being supplied off-the-shelf by Russia’s JSC Tulsky Oruzheiny Zavod. Also on order are 443 DRDO-developed third-generation Nag fire-and-forget ATGMs along with 13 DRDO-developed NAMICA tracked ATGM launchers.
The DAC, led by then Defence Minister A K Antony, had taken up the procurement of the fire-and-forget FGM-148 and SMAW-2NE for clearance on April 2, 2013, following which the MoD’s approved the DRDO’s proposal for jointly developing the high-altitude warfare-optimised warheads for the two anti-armour weapon systems. By the first half of next year, therefore, the MoD and its wholly owned DPSUs like Bharat Dynamics Ltd (BDL) and Ordnance Factory Board (OFB) will be able to ink military-industrial agreements with US-based Raytheon for both the joint development of thermobaric and HE/FRAG penetration-cum-blast warheads as well as the licenced-production of the FIM-148 Javelin’s missile rounds (the launchers will be licence-assembled by BDL) as well as the SMAW-2NE’s modified 83mm Mk80 rocket (containing a thermobaric HEDP warhead), while the re-usuable launchers will be licence-assembled by OFB.
The IA had zeroed in on the FGM-148 Javelin as far back as 2008 after it had conducted in-country summer user-evaluations of the RAFAEL of Israel-built Spike-ER ATGM. During these evaluations, seven out of the 10 missiles fired missed their targets because their on-board uncooled long-wave infra-red (LWIR) sensors failed to distinguish their targets from their surroundings (an identical problem had also beset the Nag ATGM’s uncooled LWIR sensors in 2012 during user-evaluations). In contrast, the high-altitude warfare-optimised Javelin will use a cooled mid-wave IR (MWIR) sensor that will be able to passively lock-on to targets at up to 50% farther range than an uncooled sensor, thus allowing the firing crew greater and safer standoff distance, and less likely to be exposed to counter-fire. As far as weight is concerned, the cooling equipment adds less than 2 lb per weapon. The uncooled sensor is not only less reliable, but its long-LWIR spectrum is only compatible with a dome made of softer materials that vulnerable to abrasion in harsh environments (e.g., deserts) and consequently require replacement more often. The cooled seeker’s MWIR spectrum allows a durable hardened dome, and it is better than LWIR in discerning threats in certain geographic locations or environmental conditions. An uncooled sensor thus brings increased repairs, decreased operational availability, and dangerous vulnerabilities, while a cooled IIR sensor saves lives, lessens fratricide, minimises collateral damage, lowers risk, and protects its firing platforms/crew.
It was in 2003 that IA HQ had formulated a General Staff Qualitative Requirement (GSQR) in 2003 for acquiring the Milan-2T, armed with a tandem-warhead. The tandem warhead was to be licence-built by BDL under ToT from MBDA. The GSQR of the in-service Milan-2 had provided for an essential range as 1,850 metres and a desirable range of 2,000 metres. The GSQR of 2003 for the Milan-2T had indicated the range as 2,000 metres. The RFP for procurement of 4,100 Milan-2Ts was issued to BDL in January 2007. The MoD’s Technical Evaluation Committee (TEC) did not find the product offered by BDL compliant with the GSQR as the range of 2,000 metres offered had only 1,850 metres under wire-guidance phase, while the last 150 metres was left unguided (along with the first 75 metres after missile launch). The case for procurement was therefore closed in May 2007. 
Subsequently, BDL confirmed that the guidance-range of the Milan-2T would be 2,000 metres. The case was re-opened and trials of the Milan-2T were conducted in February 2008. Based on the firing trial results, Indian Army HQ did not recommend its introduction into service in view of difficulties in engaging moving targets during the last 150 metres. In addition, the requirement was not met in terms of flight-time and overall weight. Furthermore, third-generation ATGMs were already available in the global market by June 2006. Based on  representations from the staff union of BDL to the then Minister of State for Defence Production & Supplies (since non-placement of orders for Milan-2Ts would result in redeployment of BDL’s workforce and already procured materials common to Milan-2/-2T would have to be junked), it was decided to procure a minimum required quantity of Milan-2Ts in May 2008 by amending the GSQR in August 2008 for the Milan-2T with 1,850 metres range and with the waiver of in-country firing-trials, after considering the long lead-times required for procuring third-generation ATGMs, and the fact that the shelf-life of existing stocks of Milan-2 would expire by 2013. The revised RFP was issued to BDL in September 2008 as per the amended GSQR. The MoD concluded a procurement contract with BDL in December 2008 for the supply of 4,100 Milan-2T ATGMs at a cost of Rs.587.02 crore with a staggered delivery schedule to be completed within 36 months from the effective date of contract.

The RPO-A & C-90A LAW Procurement Sagas
The IA had, since the 1980s, never really embraced the idea of procuring one-man portable shoulder-fired, reusable anti-armour weapons (LAW) capable of defeating armoured vehicles, enemy bunkers and other reinforced positions. It was only in 1996 that LAWs were procured in small quantities and this was followed in June 199 during OP Vijay, in an effort to meet its urgent requirements, by the Army HQ proposing the procurement of 1,800 disposable bunker-bursting LAWs (600 RPO-A Shmels from Russia’s Rosoboronexport State Corp and 1,200 from Spain’s Instalaza SA). The proposal also indicated that 600 more LAWs were required under the 9th Army Plan. In response to the MoD’s enquiries, Russia’s KBP Tula offered to supply its RPO-A Shmel at a unit price of US$3,600 for an order of 600 and at the rate of US$3,500 for an order of 1,200 units. The MoD urgently concluded a procurement contract in June 1999 for 1,200 RPO-As each priced at US$3,500 with a delivery schedule in two lots of 600 pieces each, thereby aggregating US$4.2 million (Rs.18.22 crore), with deliveries commencing within two months from the date of contract signature. A delegation of the IA had witnessed a live-firing demonstration of the RPO-A as early as in September 1995. In its evaluation report, the delegation had observed, among other things, that target engagement could not be analysed beyond 350 metres vis a vis the 1,000-metre range claimed by KBP Tula in its technical offer; the firing could be conducted only during daylight as no night-sighting device was developed; and the thermobaric warhead’s terminal effect could not also be assessed as there was no incendiary effect. The then Chief Scientific Adviser to the MoD had also brought to the notice of the MoD in November 1995 that the DRDO representative in the delegation had reported that during the demonstration of September 1995, 14 RPO-As were fired at a range of 200 metres and none of the shots hit the targets at that range. However, the delegation recommended procurement of the weapon only as a one-time buy, suggesting that future requirements be met indigenously by the DRDO and OFB. Accordingly, 300 RPO-As were procured in September 1996 as a one-time buy. Against these recommendations of the delegation, the MoD at the instance of Army HQ once again decided to go ahead with follow-on procurements of another 300 RPO-As at a total cost of Rs.18.22 crore even though it did not meet the end-user’s operational requirements. Deliveries commenced only after August 1999.
The MoD concluded a procurement contract on June 30, 1999 with Instalaza SA for the off-the-shelf supply of 1,200 C-90A LAWs worth US$1.66 million (Rs.7.15 crore). As per the terms of the contract, Instalaza SA had to offer the C-90As for inspections at its premises within six weeks from the date of contract signature, and immediate delivery and transportation by air-freight in one lot thereafter. Two days after signing the contract, Instalaza SA indicated that the consignment could be despatched by air and it would extend all co-operation to deliver the goods by air after receipt of instructions from the MoD. Accordingly, the MoD amended the clause regarding the mode of despatch from ‘Ship’ to ‘Air’ on July 8, 1999 Instalaza SA intimated its readiness to despatch the consignment after it was duly inspected by its authorities in August 1999. However, Instalaza SA expressed apprehension on airlifting the goods as they fell under the ‘dangerous category’. The freight agent also intimated the MoD by September 1999 about its inability to obtain requisite airspace transit clearances from the country of origin and the other countries involved. Consequently, the MoD amended the contract clause relating to the mode of despatch on October 7, 1999, reverting back to ‘Ship’. Eventually, the C-90As arrived on December 11, 1999, four months after being ready for dispatch, while the MoD had in August 2000 claimed that the delay occurred due to factors beyond its control.
Which ATGMs For Rudra & 
LCH Helicopters?
Any Takers For SAMHO?
Further Force-Multiplier Accretions On 
The Way
The ELM-2138T C-RAM is a mobile, autonomous system designed to respond to evolving light artillery threats in land operations, and support a variety of ground forces missions, including force protection, fast-response to enemy-attack, and friendly-fire correction. Installed on all-terrain vehicles (ATV), the system comprises a dual-band radar to acquire and track trajectories of ballistic munitions such as rockets, artillery and mortars. The ELM-2138T calculates the launching point and predicts the point of impact. Whenever a threat to friendly forces is detected, a warning is sent to the area’s control centre and to the interception systems to respond to the threat and its source.
Elbit Systems Electro-Optics’ Long View CR, weighing less than 12.5kg, combines a very long-range continuous optical zoom FLIR, long-range day cameras, integral eye-safe laser rangefinder, GPS and a magnetic compass all in one, compact configuration. For dismounted operations, the Long View CR is operated on a miniature electronic goniometer enabling high azimuth and elevation accuracy. It can be carried in a backpack or mounted on a vehicle, making it especially suitable for long-range intelligence-surveillance-reconnaissance (ISR) missions performed by special operations forces, or forward observers (FO) in stationary observation posts or reconnaissance vehicles. With its proprietary algorithms and technologies, the Long View CR has the unique ability to acquire long-range targets or to observe small targets, such as enemy combatants, in high spatial resolution under severe visual conditions day or night.
The XVII Corps will in future be equipped with two force-multipliers: the  TAC-4G broadband fourth-generation cellular network, and the Real Time Intelligence Center (RICent) multi-sensor modular Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance (ISR) system—both from ELTA Systems. TAC-4G is based on a flat-IP network architecture which provides flexible and fast communications between many users. This includes fast-and-secure communications between different points and support of concurrent running of multiple applications, many of which require high bandwidth. The high flexibility of TAC-4G along with additional inherent capabilities such as information security, on-the-move network infrastructure, and support of multiple applications, positions the system as an optimal solution for addressing the complex military communications requirements. 
TAC-4G also supports a wide variety of multimedia applications and allows quick and easy addition or removal of applications. It also implements the ‘network-centric warfare’ principle; allows various-level commanders the highest level of control and effective activation of various warfighting, logistics and maintenance forces; allows, real-time battlefield management and control; uses the cost-effective commercial cellular network providers’ infrastructure, which allows shorter implementation time and fewer risks in comparison to other alternatives that are not based on COTS infrastructures.
RICent is designed to produce 24/7 all-weather geo-spatial  imagery intelligence (IMINT) through the real-time processing and integration of images generated by a variety of space-based, airborne and land-based IMINT sensors. RICent’s multi-sensor exploitation and intelligence dissemination processes employ a variety of automatic and semi-automatic tools essential for quick detection, acquisition and identification of time-critical targets, extracted from the huge volumes of imagery data. Its field-proven capabilities for very high-throughput automated geo-spatial image intelligence processing are also essential in effective wide-area environmental monitoring and for responding quickly to natural disasters.
For further improving command-and-control connectivity for those IA and ITBP detachments responsible for both manning the LAC and undertaking long-range reconnaissance patrols, the fast-track acquisition of up to 80 lightweight ELK 1895 manpack tactical SATCOM terminals has been approved. The IA presently has 280 briefcase-based SATCOM terminals built by ECIL, but they are getting outdated technologically. The ELK 1895 manpack SATCOM terminals with Ku-Band transmission/reception capability for almost unlimited ranges will thus be welcomed as a vital force-multiplier. Each such terminal will include two-three suitcases to hold an antenna, dish and other equipment. The first 40 ELK 1895 terminals are meant for the IA’s Northern, Central and Eastern Commands, which together cover the three sectors of LAC—western (Ladakh), middle (Uttarakhand, Himachal Pradesh) and eastern (Sikkim, Arunachal Pradesh). 
MoD-Owned Goa Shipyard Ltd Building Two Wholly India-Financed 75-Metre NOPVs For Sri Lanka Navy, Bags Contract For Supplying Four More To Vietnam
China’s Border Infrastructure Landmarks
ITBP At Chumar
NORINCO’s NLOS Anti-Armour Missiles

251 comments:

«Oldest   ‹Older   201 – 251 of 251
Mr. RA 9 said...

Regarding the FGFA, why the concerned Indian authorities could not feel in advance that the twin-seat option would reduce the stealth features and add weight as well as make the fighter much more expensive.

Anonymous said...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dPqvVvhnZE

Anonymous said...

Hello Prasunji,

You have mentioned above about books being written by Indian engineers and naval architects. Pls could you provide a listing of such titles.............it will be very much appreciated.

Thanks,
Dan

Samant said...

Hi Prasun,

Is it true that the popularity of BUDDHISM is steadily rising among Middle Class Indians and by 2050 almost 30% of Indians will be Buddhist? I read this in FT but cannot find a URL for it.

Thank You

vishakh said...

Hi

1) China has shown model of P 800 Onyx copy missile . Is this incapability similar to Brahmos ??

2) China M3000 Tank on offer to pakisthan is it comparable to T90S and Arjun MK2

vishakh said...

Sir

As per your 2012 post VIxen Aesa would be selected not 2052 AESA for Tejas Mk2 .

Can you please specify which is finally selected and what are qualities of those radars specially if its 2052 as no literature is available

Arvind said...

http://www.frontline.in/the-nation/no-flight-of-fancy/article6541263.ece?homepage=true

Please read this. It is clear that the Nirbhay tested last month was allowed to fly on till its fuel got used up and then the missile fell into the sea. The missile was not aimed at any targets. What was tested was just the turbofan and the navigation system. The missile did not carry any TERCOM equipments or any seeker.
What is there to tom tom about this recent test. Turbofan can be tested even in the lab. Navigation system too can be validated through bench tests or by flying them in a test aircraft. For a country like India, building a turbofan and navigation system is next to nothing. If the missile had successfully flown over land using TERCOM or used a seeker to take out a target, then we can feel proud.

Deepak Gowda said...

Mr.Prasun
Appreciated that u have taken your time to respond on my queries. But same time i find It is entertaining & hilarious to hear your explanations on my query about 'China Threat'. Well most of my question went unanswered & mostly was went out of topic such as Two-front war threat from Pakistan. Well it is remarkable n miraculous to hear Chinese troops withdrawal during '87 incursion or border skirmish due to natural cause such as cholera instead of IA resistance. I find it is lackasaidical to think the threat is not imminent on invasion by China. So to think China will be a passive cat towards Himalayan theater fearing an Mighty IA or Natural Disease such as Cholera or whatever shows how much the person needs a shrink's assistance or living in utter foolishness or ignorance. Well i know ignorance is bliss but this is totally stupid. The world has been watching what China is doing with Paracel Islands in Philipines & Spratlys Islands in Malaysia is a clear example & pattern whats happening sporadically happening along Chinese borders. If u think that Chinese invasion is impossible, take a look at Chinese spending billlions in transport & building roads in Indo-Chinese border for logistical purposes. Why would a country invest heavily on military logistics in autonomous border region for? Is it for fun? Maybe i will take your answer as yes after looking at your views on Chinese Invasion as a joke. As J.Nehru had this attitude of Hindi-Chini Bhai Bhai brought the nation to shame with Chinese troops penetrated deep into Mother India. To hear that u were strucked with wonder n admiration on Chinese propaganda in Indian territory is indeed interesting. Yes its ok to disguise a shame with wonders. But i do agree if there is two way incursion is happening in both sides. But to say its ok thats just a border incursion its a utter stupidity n lack of self respect. The world world watched when Chinese Prez was here in the same time the incursion happened in with the Xi's command. The world know how India is vulnerable n can be bullied by tyrannies. Whoever feel this is nothing, i believe they were lack of self respect or no honor. Anyway thanks for the lengthy explanations on how is IA tougher n superior to chinese army. These really shows that whoever have this view is living in delusional world n with self aggrandizing. Maybe its tine for them to get their head checked. TQ

Deepak Gowda said...

Cont..d
Yeah one more thing, when u said it is impossible for PLA to stage same thing what they do in 1962 due to the level of training they have now. Nice joke buddy. A vountry with 4 times the defense budget as India, twice the size of IA standing army, 4times bigger than the size of IAF & lastly a country with Stealth J20 bomber has less training quality they had than they had in 1962. Wow, i am impressed with your sense of humour. U r the best defense analyst. Bravo.

Pankaj said...

Dear Sir

MANY thanks for telling us about
NLOS Fibre Optic Guided Missiles

And frankly I did not even know
that such missiles EXIST

Now that China has them How will India Counter such a threat


Sir my second question is

Can we use Artillery assets
such as BM 21 and 130 mm guns for
Targetting Enemy TANKS since we
DO NT have such LONG RANGE NLOS ATGMs

Anonymous said...

@Deepak Gowda,
China has also 3 times more land to defend, not to mention its enemies including 1 superpower, 2 big powers (Japan, India), 1 big power not so good friend (Russia), 2 regional powers (Vietnam, S.Korea) and distrustful neighbours (philipines, malaysia, taiwan). All these with no real ally around (yeah ofcourse Pakistan and N.Korea for that sake if you want). China is not sitting on an enviable position either. So with defense budget 4 times bigger than India, it has to keep all its enemies on track, and Asian countries are by default not inventive in nature, so technological superiority wont be any time soon possible vis-a-vis West. Given that India is not the sole enemy of China, there is as much what it can provide against us.

Sreenivas R.

Deepak Gowda said...

Replies to Sreenivas R
Well i do agree about "no country is perfect" notion. But im not living in China neither i am a Chinese to ponder about them. As an Indian, I am concerned about the welfare & the pride of my Indian civilization which is going down to drain when others are making use of our vulnerability n progress. Not to mention the trade imbalance China which favours them most. Basically we are selling our crude & fresh resources such as steel & iron ores in cut price & we buy back from them the ready made products under 'made in China' tag. Basically money is flowing out our nation when we ourselves can make those simple things like soap holder or your smartphone cover. Even for a ATGM or tank munitions we have to rely on Russians or even much smaller nation like Israel. A country of billion brains still need outsiders help to do our cleaning. Its like having our own kitchen and tools but asking our neighbour to cook for us & paying them a fee. Shows how lazy or unreliable we are in the eyes of the worlds. Really pathethic. But anyway I am saying this as a concerned Indian. TQ

Oman said...

Sir, I saw again today that the PM flew in a bog standard IAF Mi-171 when visiting to Varanasi.

I'm glad PM Modi has decided to put the AW-101 fiasco to bed and that the signal is clear- he'll fly on the Mi-171 happily and that the Mi-17s are up to the job as good as the AW-101 and S-92. In light of this will the 3 AW-101s in India be sent back to the UK or can we sell them to a third party ourselves?

VP said...

Sir
Is Kestrel project for the IAs FO V project as precieved by many,i dont think so as
a)the project is done with DRDO and not fully privately
b)i dont think army would be looking to replace their tracked infanty combat vehicles with wheeled ones
b)the army has a large number of Wheeled amphibious infantry carriers which are very old and needs replacement
What is the real purpose of the project?
And what about the FMBT project There was also news that DRDO was developing an 1500hp engine for use on Arjun mk2 ,although the tank still uses the old 1400hp engine ,Any new info about these projects.
And plz any new infos about AURA,and weponization of KALI.
PLZ reply.

Anonymous said...

@Deepak Gowda,

as per the laws of economics, if some one has a demand there will be supply. And who ever supplies it cheap wins all. If we can make the things so cheap as the chinese do, there was no question of trade imbalance, but alas, that is not the case. Patriotism will not replace the economics, i see no issue with chinese products, because of that so many of our own country men are able to afford LED lamps (for vendors), flash torches, electrical accessories and mobile phones (yes i agree on the quality, but that comes at price). Instead of envying their capability, it is always possible to make use of these cheap resources to improve our own products (including sales, apparels, shoes, agriculture and what not). These improved products can cater to our own and other nations. That is a smart business strategy. Since they have an ecosystem on mass production, it is quite uphill task to bite into their share easily. Simplest example is jewel cutting in surat, with diamonds mined in south africa, sourced through belgium, cut and polished in India, catering to Europe/West (hardly any diamonds are mined in India, but 90% of finished ones moving through the country). Same way, softwares demanded by West, outsourced to India, goes again back and caters to world. Finding opportunity is what business is...
Same goes with our natural resources, which are still not yet properly mapped and without clear policy on using them.

Sreenivas R.

Gessler said...

Prasun ji, China has showcased it's new CX-1 anti-ship cruise missile, which looks every bit like a BrahMos-1/P-800 Oniks.

http://idrw.org/?p=46398

Could you provide any info about the CX-1 that you know? From what I can gather it has similar specs as BrahMos-1. However it's interesting to see the Chinese producing now such missiles as we tested first in 2001.

Do you think this missile is for export to countries like Pakistan or Indonesia? If they can offer a missile with similar specs at lower price, it's very unlikely the BrahMos itself will receive any export orders.

Reddy said...

many facts from authentic sources:

http://www.thehindu.com/news/national/dcns-hopes-to-expand-footprint-in-india/article6575582.ece?homepage=true

Deepak Gowda said...

@Sreenivas
Exactly. U got my point. Well its always easy n convenient to buy ready made products, but sad to say, you are directly or indirectly financing Chinese Warmachines & RnD. The more penny v spend on buying imported goods instead of our own, more money flows out of our nation. Well thats what Law of Economics says too fyi. We all blame most our politicians for flowing out black money in Swiss bank or somewhat. But we dont realize that we are part of this in our daily life. Well business can boom anywhere if u want to attract investors. Chinese had realize this & done this reform in 1960s. They followed the footsteps of US during 1900s which done the similar thing. Its not too late for India to this. Instead of thinking how to flow out money overseas think about how to attract into our nation. Its easy being a moth, but its always better to be the Flame.

Anurag said...

@Deepak Gowda,

Before moving to a discussion with you regarding the possible threat emanating from the PLA and all,I would like to (in fact need to) ask you a couple of questions.

1.Have you read any books (or materials other than Wikipedia) on this subject matter you have been asking questions,that 1962 conflict??

2.Have you visited the frontier regions of the North Eastern LAC??


And lastly,cut the sarcasm a bit,no one likes that here.Just a friendly advice,Thanks.

Deepak Gowda said...

@Anurag
1. Yes 2. Yes 3. Thats is my point of view but if personally if u take it as a sarcasm maybe u have start to see the light here. So tell me have u researched about these PLA or Chinese Threat or been in the LAC instead comfortably sitting on computer screen n reading it in Wikipedia or in this thread? Just a friendly reminder,maybe well for a start to open your mind & think before giving your fingers a work on your keyboard. Its easy to be judgemental than being receptive with a open mind. No wonder country of a billion is importing simple stuffs instead making it here. God has given the ability, but capablity comes from practice. TQ

Anil said...

Hi Prasun,
Some interesting developments regarding Bangladesh.....(related with India)
1) idrw.org/?p=46428
2) idrw.org/?p=46424

Liang Xi Hong said...

Paranoia - not pragmatism is what I call this Deepak Gowda is suffering from. China is not poised to attack India but the military build up is very much like a strong man building his muscles to defend and let his enemy know that they are dealing with a strong man. China aspires to be a super power don't doubt that - but China also believes in pragmatism. It will do what it needs to do to get what it wants, but it is no fool to give away leverage either. It is a fact India can not fight the might of China but what Mr Sengupta is saying is that India is not in that shape or position as in 1962 and it is highly unlikely China will engage in a full blown war.

Deepak Gowda said...

Well paranoid or pragmatic it depends on the person how they perceive it. Well speaking about Chinese pragmatism, is what tickles my laughing buds. In 2007, China did a ASAT test which is clear sign of weaponisation of space. So tell me LXH, if a country is so desperate to stage an ASAT test does it shows pragmatic or paranoid? Well I believe if muscle man doesnt need to show he is strong as people with clear mind n eyes knows he is strong. So why does he desperately needs to show he is strong? Well the answer i guess u have already known, PARANOID of other might harm him. Anyway thanks for clarifiying n affirming my understatement on PLA intentions & effort. TQ

Pintu said...

Liang Xi Hong,

Thanks for your comments, at least I thought you are among the ones who argue but does not engage to troll, however, I should say as what meant by Prasun Da, is that it is not 1962, i.e. Indian Army is not in position like as it was in 1962, and China is not in position to launch Border conflict against India, as it started her offensive in that time, at this juncture, so your point that India being unable to fight China's might, is not correct.

2)Both side is showing pragmatism as for now, so there is no need of any leverage to bestow neither, I feel, no scope for Superiority or Inferiority Complex.

rad said...

to Liang

Pragmatism in your words is taken by other countries as bullying and intimidating and all it is doing is bringing countries together against china. It will realize its folly if it tries some sort of aggression . Your idea that India cannot match china militarily is may be an idea of the chinese , but in reality things will be different . The Vietnamese were no match for the Americans, but look what happened at the end. Even China could not do any thing much in Vietnam as they hit back. You will agree that we are not Vietnam either nor are there fools like nehru leading this country like in 1962.
There is one thing you cannot match India and that is democracy and freedom !! . You see i have Called Nehru a fool because i live in a democracy.Why dont you try calling Mao or his followers today fools who killed so many innocent chinese in the name of revolution in the middle of Tienanmen square! Its not that your present day rulers are angels . My friend you will go to prison or be shot !!. You may have all the riches in the world but you chinese dont have the most valuable thing in life called freedom.!!

Deepak Gowda said...

Chinese submarines docking in Sri Lanka
http://idrw.org/?p=46368
Imagine what happens if Indian submarine docks @ Taiwan?
Its will be hilarious.

Deepak Gowda said...

To Liang
Well let the universe comes up for an equation of Chinese superpowerdom quest. I can guarantee its not a peaceful one. In the past 5000 years of Indian history, no at once India has sent its soldiers to China to conquer or invade. But indeed we have sent out Bodhidharma n other buddhists monks n emissaries who brought well beings to your people n culture. Thanks to Mr.Mao & our foolish Mr.Nehru, Chinese sents waves of troops into India in 1962. Gave Pakistan the nuke technology to keep India preoocupied with regional tensions instead of aspiring into be in a global stage. Well we kept our peace n Chinese keeps bringing chaos. Whatever happens if India happen to be a Superpower in future, I dont think we will do what China is doing now. We have a long tradition of peace & knowledge which we have brought to light many civilizations in the world including yours. TQ

Anurag said...

@ Deepak Gowda,it is now crystal clear to me that you are just another of those paranoid lot,there is simply nothing to debate or discuss with you in this matter since you think you have already figured every thing out.You are telling me not to be judgmental yet you have done the exact same thing.Very well,I won't waste my time or energy over a filth like you.Enjoy your slow descend into paranoia.

Pintu said...

^^^^ Keeping Civility during discussion is most desired.

Prasun Da, what do you think about the performance of CX-1 ?

Anonymous said...

@Deepak Gowda,

India fought infact aggressively many wars in '5000' years. Wherever the geography was known, all kingdoms, with all the wherewithal available, tried to conquest. Infact it was considered 'Rajdharma' to do 'Ashwamedham' a form of benign (or aggressive if benign doesnt work) conquest for supremacy. If china (or central asia) was not conquered, it was because of inaccessible Himalayas. Calling the known part of the world as Bharat varsh, and then conquering each other does not entitle the term peaceful. Of course that was not match for some of the more violent wars in Europe/ central Asia is more apt. And fortunately save for a Chola kings most of the subcontinent kingdoms were wary of seas and hence no naval conquests (due to a deep rooted belief that crossing seas will make you loose your dharma). And when ever there was opportunity, Indians indeed fought (some of them would today be mercenary) wars abroad, as in China's boxer rebellion and opium wars, in middle east in first and second world wars. Rise of world powers are often associated with some form of aggression and imperialism. China was a sick-man among great 5 (rather a gifted position to Gen Kai shek) till late 80s. Now they have taken a more aggressive position (since power is taken and never given). That does not mean that they are going to war on every other opportunity, but a calculated risk taking and intimidation (by all means including weapons, technology, military, trade, or tit for tat response diplomacy). Empires (or hopefuls) always try to desist getting involved in war, unless that is a decisive one, because that will mean losing their hard earned power in fights. As with Chanakya philosophy, earthen-pot should not fight with stone, earthen pots should not fight among themselves, only stones should fight with earthen pots. And the simple way of avoiding any fight is not to become earthen pots. That does not mean you have to read all the intentions of a mighty neighbor with suspicion or ill will. Just make sure that you are using every opportunity to grow and become the 'stone'. Because in international relations today's enemy might be tomorrow's best friend (UK and France and now Russia and China), it is always better to mend the fences with neighbors.

Sreenivas R.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To GESSLER & PINTU: LoLzzzz!!! The answer to the CX-1 is staring right in front of your eyes: Notice the twin long straplines on either side of the missile? They are self-destruct mechanisms that are not to be found on any operational LACM or ASCM. Instead, such strap-on fitments are found on satellite launch vehicles & target-drones. Therefore, the CX-1 is nothing but a supersonic ASCM simulating target-drone meant for simulating the cruise performance of missiles like BrahMos-1 & Vietnam’s Bastion.

Millard Keyes said...

India has plenty of television very little vision. If opportunities were utilised and leaders thought a bit more about the future than their pockets today the world would look at India as a superpower and not the US. Why, despite having the Khajuraho temple sculptures it was Hugh Heffner and Larry Flint that put that stuff in print and cashed in-not any Indian! It was this lack of forward vision that created Pakistan, caused enmity with China and made enemies of all the neighbouring countries regardless of how puny!Indian leaders have a penchant for attempting the impossible instead of pursuing what is doable. It's like trying to invent a soap to make the butt smell free. Take for instance the DRDO - they are so busy being the Q branch that they miss the basic things that are taken for granted elsewhere. What's the point inventing a cigar that fires a single bullet when basic weaponry is still being imported? If Nehru did not sell the country out to get the Pmship India would be in a totally different position and entente. Sreenivas said it perfectly. India is expecting respect without earning or deserving it. Hey arranged marriage might work in some cases but better woo the one you like to marry!

Gessler said...

But sir ji, they also displayed posters saying that it's a weapon system (see URL below)-

https://farm4.staticflickr.com/3940/15114956083_1b7b3b0f96_b.jpg

Also read this Russian link with translate -

http://www.militaryparitet.com/ttp/data/ic_ttp/6985/

Maybe you are indeed right - PLAN might use this only as target drone to study strategies for countering BrahMos/similar missiles or just for aerodynamic research - but don't you think there is a possibility that the weaponized version of missile can be exported?

Pintu said...

Prasun Da, thanks for your reply, so can it be concluded that PRC is coming up with some thing comparable to PAAMS system to protect their shore based facilities from any future type of attack, or if any laser based system depending upon their R & D efforts, and possibility of their future deployment in Tibet ?

2) Does DRDO employ 3D Print Technology ? as well as 3) is there any GoI Funded project going on or planned by the new Government for R&D in this field (3D Print) for its applications including Space & Defence ?

Thanks in Advance.

Gessler said...

1) Also Prasun sir, you have said previously that the future IN destroyers would be similar to the DD-21 concept in terms of design. Does this mean we will also adopt a similar VLS farm-type installation with 192-256 VLS cells in total?

If not, then what type of weapon launch system (how many VLS cells) do you think it could have? I mean what does our requirements call for?

2) Also can you state your opinion on what weapons could be fitted onto the future destroyer? Besides BrahMos-II, Nirbhay, Barak-2/2ER?

3) Any plans for ship-based BMD with VLS-launched versions of AD-1/AD-2 interceptors? Do you think we could head down that way in future?

4) It was said by some online friends I know that BrahMos-2 itself could end up having 600-1,000km range. Is this true?

VMT in advance, sir ji!

rad said...

hi prasun
1) you mentioned that india was building a sat tracking ship like the chinese yuan wang series . can you give more info on that. I believe no one will help china in tracking its sats apart from pariah states and those like pak who are its beggars. But how can it used to help ballistic missiles as they are self contained nav systems?.
2) if the cx-1 was only a drone target then it does not take any effort to make it into a real weapon. Why does russia act in a spine less way when china copies every weapon made in russia? They could always transfer it to pak and russia will keep quite.
I think we should be care full in future to buy russian arms as they sell it to china and china duplicates them and sell it around the world. Example kilo subs -su-27,smerch, missiles etc.

Anonymous said...

@Anurag
If u have nothing better to comment or to have a better adult conversation better sit back & watch the soap operas jn your TV. Calling others filth shows how childlike u are which in return doesnt make sense to argue with neurotic people like U. Didnt your mother taught u how to keep civility in adults blog? Lol

Deepak Gowda said...

Mr.Sreenivas
I like your observation on this. But i dont agree in Indians not conquered past Himalayas. There is this empire called Kanishka Empire which was vast East Turkestan in the North till Deccans in South. Its capital was Patna. Have a look on this.

Pintu said...

http://idrw.org/?p=46486#more-46486

Prausn Da, as Gessler states, it appears that CALT- China Academy of Launch Vehicle Technology has test fired this Missile,

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-4oNJfe0p9k0/VF7F_M4b1MI/AAAAAAAAPgU/ZHerC1uyke8/s1600/Test%2Bfire%2Bphotos%2Bof%2BCX-1%2Bramjet%2Bmissile%2B-%2Bthe%2BChinese%2BBrahMos%2B1.jpg

and it appears that since PRC employs CJ-10 Missile, as it gained from Ukranian Korshun Technology, and further having differrent version depending upon launching Platform, hence, can this missile be of dual purpose, i.e. Supply of the same to China's possible customer i.e. in South America or Africa, Iran, or Pakistani Navy, keeping pressure on the same way as India offerring Brahmos to Vietnam and 2) At the same time using the design as Target Stimulation by bolstering its air defence capability against such types of missiles if needed at the time of hostality, since CALT is known for development of Launch Vehicle family widely for space based application as such Long March Family of Rockets, 3)The report also states that China brought the Technology from NPO Mashinostroyeniya associated with Development of Brahmos, reperesntative of it did not offer its comment, so what may be actual purpose of Chinese testing it ? Or will it be in use by PLAN ?

Anonymous said...

Prasun Said

To GESSLER & PINTU: LoLzzzz!!! The answer to the CX-1 is staring right in front of your eyes: Notice the twin long straplines on either side of the missile? They are self-destruct mechanisms that are not to be found on any operational LACM or ASCM. Instead, such strap-on fitments are found on satellite launch vehicles & target-drones. Therefore, the CX-1 is nothing but a supersonic ASCM simulating target-drone meant for simulating the cruise performance of missiles like BrahMos-1 & Vietnam’s Bastion.


i just found offical poster here

http://goo.gl/ViBLfj

Take a look at what its producer has to say

Pintu said...

@Anonymous 4:56 PM , the missile is manufactured by CASA , and with its VLS Tube, better to wait for Prasun Da.

Anonymous said...

china's and US's industrial espionage is un matched and un paralleled in this day and age.

do not get surprised if they were able to get all the documents from brahmos hQ's servers or from russian r & d firm's servers and india and indians can sell themselves for money and women. kerala journalists and churches are notorious in working for foreign govts.

modi's recent expansion says a lot about his abilities on the other side of the coin. most of his ministers are just fools and have no education and have no understanding about how to run the govt and what it needs to provide services to 1.2 billion people and counting.. either in direct services or in providing infrastructure..

I have a very good idea to change india in 3 years in one of the aspects.

BAN AND REMOVE ALL SHOPS ON EITHER SIDE OF THE ROAD and ESTABLISH 100 HECTARE SHOPPING PARKS WITH CAR PARKS, BUS STANDS AND LOCAL TRAIN SERVICES.

This serves below purposes:

1. ROADS WILL BE CLEAN
2. roads won't be congested.
3. no parking on the roads for shopping
4. roads are just used for travelling not for parking.
5. no garbage on roads due to no commercial activity.

clean india will emerge out of no where

modi's present clean india goes no where with current ideas he is following.

we need the following;

1. sewage is not allowed to mix into open waters and open drainages, rivers, canals etc

2. every house and shop must have bins with removable bin bags

3. contracts must be awarded to professional waste treatment companies to collect and process/destroy/landfill/treat waste and local indian councils have no idea or expertise what this means

4. ban all hand held brooms and employ truck driven vehicles to broom roads

5. if dust is an issue anywhere lay proper roads

see these sites:

http://www.biffa.co.uk/

www.veolia.com/en/

http://www.manchester.gov.uk/info/200084/bins_rubbish_and_recycling

These are the workable solutions and NO POSING TO CAMERAS WITH BROOM WORKS.

am spending my time and energy on all these things to direct or educate people to see a clean india other wise I have no business there as am not living there anymore.

just close eyes and see a congested road in india and if we implement my shopping suggestion imagine now how congested roads with humans, and traffic vanish and empty roads emerge in your thoughts.
now you see empty roads but with garbage, now again see my second batch of suggestions and see now in you closed eyes how garbage get vanished..

am not presenting you a magical world but this is how things should work..as we see in the western world..

-- a regular visitor

Anonymous said...

Prasun Said

To GESSLER & PINTU: LoLzzzz!!! The answer to the CX-1 is staring right in front of your eyes: Notice the twin long straplines on either side of the missile? They are self-destruct mechanisms that are not to be found on any operational LACM or ASCM. Instead, such strap-on fitments are found on satellite launch vehicles & target-drones. Therefore, the CX-1 is nothing but a supersonic ASCM simulating target-drone meant for simulating the cruise performance of missiles like BrahMos-1 & Vietnam’s Bastion.

Take a look at

C802A and C705A

http://goo.gl/tqSKZ0


http://goo.gl/4XTggm

both have twin long straplines and both are real weapons not just targets

Anonymous said...

Guys, Its True. CX-1 is functional prototype & open for export.
http://idrw.org/?p=46486#more-46486
The question is shud India continue to funding BM2 Hypersonic as Pariah Russians will still sell it to Filthy Chinese. Where is our advantage in tactical warfare or surgical strike?

Deepak Gowda said...

This is what im have been saying, a country of billion people paying foreigners bulk of cash just to outsource their R&D effort without using their own brains & end up being a loser as foreigners making money out of this nations stupidity. Why not invest the same cash into our R&D? The Russians have made use of Indians stupidity & slothiness. After all this funds all from our tax payers pocket. We let people use our money to gain leverage for their own gain. We are not so rich country to invest or fund other nations R&D. Wake up people. As a citizen, all have the rights to question the outflow of our funds to foreign land.

Anonymous said...

Continuing...

What I mean by dedicated shopping complexes (Not supermarkets or Shopping Center Building)

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.265473,-2.879437,17z

https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.4653407,-2.3471415,17z

VIKRAM GUHA said...

@ Pierre Zorin - I want to upvote your comment not once or twice but several times.

PrasunDa,

Arun Jaitely said today that MoD will purchase 440 helicopters most of them coming from HAL, so where is the room for Private players?

http://www.financialexpress.com/article/miscellaneous/armed-forces-to-acquire-440-helicopters-arun-jaitley/

Thanks,

Vikram

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To Anon@6.21PM: FYI C-802A & C-705 have NEVER entered service with the PLA. Show me even a single photo of an operational ASCM from any country being fired, which has such straplines. Furthermore, CASC & CASIC are both trading companies that deal with exports ONLY. Also to be noted is that the CX-1 features an IMU using a MINGS like that on the C-602, & does not have any RLG-INS on-board. All ASCMs minus the C-602 showcased at expos in Zhuhai thus far over the past 6 years feature such strap-ons, meaning they’re all practice rounds with self-destruct mechanisms. Fully operational missile configurations are never shown at such expos.

Bottomline: Never judge a book by its cover.

Mr. RA 9 said...

Is it possible that due to dozens of logics and concrete reasons available, China has ultimately understood that now it can not fight and win any war with India or any other of its neighbors without a severest catastrophic exchange on both sides. So in order to reassert its projected Dadagiri position, now it has again started applying the various stratagems over others and specially India.

Anurag said...

@anon November 9, 2014 11:45 AM

And didn't your father teach you not to use 'anonymous' handle while commenting on an adult blog or is your father is actually anonymous to you??!!

Anonymous said...

@Anurag

No, your mother taught me to keep anonymous. Do u want more?

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