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Friday, August 15, 2014

Fitments Of Project 15A DDG INS Kolkata D-63

Official press-briefings of the type given by the Indian Navy (IN) on August 13 regarding the INS Kolkata D-63—the first of three Project 15A guided-missile destroyers (DDG) on order for the IN—are always important for two reasons: for what is disclosed, and for what is not. For instance, while the IN stated that INS Kolkata is 90% indigenous by cost, it never went beyond that (thereby repeating history, for, on April 29, 2010, the IN had claimed that the total indigenous effort accounted for 60% of the cost of producing each Project 17 guided-missile frigate (FFG). My personal estimation is that in terms of hardware, INS Kolkata can boast of less than 50% indigenous content. And each Project 15A DDG’s acquisition cost is almost US$950 million (Rs.38 billion), while that of each Project 17 FFG is US$650 million (Rs.26 billion). The cost escalation in these two shipbuilding projects has been about 225% for Project 15A, about 260% for Project 17, with the main reasons contributing towards cost escalations being: delay in supply of warship-building D-40S steel by Russia, escalation due to increases in expenditure of the services rendered by Russian specialists on account of inflation during the build-period, impact of wage revisions due from October 2003, and finalisation of cost of weapons and sensors. 
INS Kolkata, whose keel was laid down on September 23, 2003, was launched on March 30, 2006. Therefore, detailed design of this class of DDG (using TRIBON CAD software) by a joint team comprising the IN’s in-house Directorate of Naval Design (DND)—which celebrates its 50 years of existence this year—and the MoD-owned shipbuilder Mazagon Docks Ltd (MDL), should have been concluded by mid-2002. But this was not to be, since the weapon-and-sensor fitments were yet to be selected at that time. It was only on January 27, 2006 that India’s MoD-owned Defence R & D Organisation (DRDO) and Israel Aerospace Industries (IAI) inked the Barak-2 LR-SAM’s joint five-year joint R & D contract—valued at US$556 million—following 17 months of exhaustive negotiations. And the follow-on US$1.1 billion procurement contract for Barak-2 LR-SAMs and the three EL/M-2248 S-band multi-function search-and-target acquisition radars (MF-STAR)—the first naval active phased-array radars to become operational with a navy of the Indian Ocean Region (IOR)—was inked in April 2009. As a result, it can be safely inferred that the DND had finalised only about 70% of the DDG’s design by 2003. 
What cannot be denied, however, is that the IN’s DND and its captive centre of excellence—the Weapons & Electronics Systems Engineering Establishment (WESEE)—along with MDL, have succeeded in fabricating and delivering an engineering marvel, despite several institutional handicaps. For instance, designing and building the main mast housing the EL/M-2248 was no small achievement. This APAR comprises four 3 x 3-metre fixed-array faces (each weighing 1,500kg) based on a modular tile-array architecture providing full 360-degree coverage. Liquid cooling is used to dissipate heat at the arrays. The EL/M-2248’s on-board processors and power-suppliers together weigh 900kg and are housed within six cabinets--two for the processors and four for the power-supply hardware. The entire MF-STAR suite thus weighs 6,900kg. In addition to 3-D long-range airspace volume search, the EL/M-2248 simultaneously provides ASCM approach warning; target classification; maritime surface surveillance; active and semi-active SAM support; fire-control for the OTOBreda 76/62 SRGM; and multiple targets engagement capabilities. It can detect a combat aircraft flying at high altitude at ranges of up to 250km, while an incoming ASCM can be detected at ranges of up to 25km.
The INS Kolkata’s CMS-15A combat management system (CMS), developed by the WESEE, includes the IAI-developed  Weapon Control System (WCS), which performs threat evaluation and resource allocation functions, thereby optimising the capabilities of the CMS. The WCS thus provides simultaneous long-range volume search, threat alert, target verification/acquisition, target classification, track-while-search, and dedicated track, multi-long-range intercept support, and kill assessment capabilities. It is also characterised by:

* Wide intercept envelopes against a wide variety of targets.

* Quick reaction, short response time and minimum intercept range, these being crucial in scenarios of late target detection, high-speed attacking weapons, and restrained response policy.

* Long-range area defence.

* Effective against targets from low-altitude to their maximum operational flight altitude.

* Simultaneous multi-target engagement capability and multi-missile co-existence capability for ensuring effectiveness against saturation attacks. 

* De-confliction and coordination capabilities in dense and complex scenarios.

* Advanced ECCM features.

* Built-in threat evaluation, resources allocation and engagement coordination with other on-board defence systems.

* 2-way data-link with LR-SAMs (housed within eight 8-cell modules each weighing 1,700kg) increases mission success and target selectivity by providing the missile with real-time in-flight targetting updates, and providing real-time kill assessment to support shoot-look-shoot operations.

* Multi-system interoperability (task force-level as well as carrier battle group-level operations), under which each system may operate either as a standalone unit, supported by own sensors for engagement and guidance; or integrated in a multi-warship task force. Joint task force-level operation enables coordinated engagement of threats, mission optimisation (engaging each target with the optimal interceptor, in the optimal time) and resource sharing.

* Advanced Net-of-Nets architecture to ensure interoperability with other air-defence assets, such as remote/airborne radars mounted on aerostats) and external command-and-control centres).

* The Barak-8 LR-SAM’s flexible dual-pulse motor propulsion system provides high manoeuvrability at target interception range throughout its wide envelope.

* High-performance missile warhead specially designed for catering to a wide variety of airborne targets, and which guarantees robust target destruction.

* Built-in fratricide avoidance for undertaking safe air-defence operations near friendly air-traffic.

* Gunnery support capability, including combined missiles/gun engagement.
Expected To Go On-Board In Future
Though it was way back in late 2007 that the IN was introduced to the concept of operating remote-controlled RHIBs equipped with dunking sonars, it was only in late 2011 that the IN decided to acquire such systems since, unlike active/passive towed-array variable-depth sonar, the dunking sonar-on-a-RHIB can be operated in both shallow and deep waters (up to an operational depth of 300 metres or 985 feet), are easily and quickly deployed, are much cheaper and impose no restrictions whatsoever on warship manoeuvrability, especially in situations when a warship is being engaged by wire-guided heavyweight torpedoes. It is for all these reasons that the IN in early 2012 refused to order either the NAGAN active/passive towed-array variable-depth sonar that was being developed by the DRDO’s Naval Physical & Oceanographic Labs (NPOL) or the ATLAS Elektronik-developed ATAS, which had earlier been selected after competitive bidding for the three Project 15 DDGs and three Project 1135.6 Batch-1 FFGs. The IN now plans to acquire a few ROVs from Textron Systems and equip them with the NPOL-developed LFDS, with all structural and systems integration work being done by a joint team of personnel hailing from NPOL and WESEE.
But what accounts for the long delays in commissioning INS Kolkata? Obviously, MDL cannot be blamed since it is the IN’s DND that was unable to freeze the Project 15A DDG’s design concept well before the commencement of hull construction. Another reason for the delay has been the WESEE’s inability to build either a dedicated shore-based facility for undertaking weapons-and-systems integration R & D, or to acquire a test vessel for on-board tests-and-trials of various sensors, weapon systems and propulsion sub-systems. Contrast this with what China’s PLA Navy (PLAN) has done for undertaking similar activities: at the PLAN’s Wuhan Naval Research Facility at Huangjia Lake southeast of Wuhan, a giant full-scale replica of the top-deck, island and citadel of the PLAN’s first aircraft carrier (Liaoning 16) was built, and a similar effort is now underway there to build a full-scale mock-up of the citadel and integrated mast of the PLAN’s futuristic Type 055 DDG.  
In addition, since March 1997, the PLAN has acquired at least three test vessels, with the first of these being the 6,000-tonne Dahua-class vessel (Shiyan 891) that was built by Shanghai-based Hudong-Zhonghua Shipyard and became operational in January 1998. The second such vessel—Hua Luogeng 892—was commissioned in August 2005. The third vessel—893—was commissioned in November 2011. It features a raised-bow breakwater to reduce water over the bow and a never-before-seen 30-feet-tall, 3-feet-diameter SATCOMS antenna on the forecastle. The ship has an enclosed foremast instead of the latticework mast structures found on 891 and 892. The foremast’s three yardarms feature new paired round flat-faced ESM antennae, plus radomes housing weapons targetting Ku-band and UHF-band data-link antenna. 


Biswajit said...

"HAPPY INDEPENDENCE Prasun Sir & to All My INDIANS"......

Sarath Kumar said...

Mr. Prasun, what is the missile in the last picture? Sorry I cannot see the image description as I'm on iPad.

sumit sen said...

dada.. Varunastra is operational on ins kolkata?? If yes how would u compare it with current wire guided torpedeo like black shark and sea hake mod4?? And any update of multi caliber rifle of drdo?? And msmc carbine??

Tappu said...


Why ATDS and RBU-6000 both in the same ship? Do they serve different purposes?

Thanks & Regards

rad said...

hi prasun
the pinaka 2 seems to have a range of 60 km ie 50% more ,while keeping the same dimensions of the original pinaka , how is that, does it have TCS.
The smerch has a piff paff correcion sytem in the front evident from the firings videos , are we following the same path in the pinaka 3 . what are the correction systems on the chinese equal?. gps?. In That case we can also do the same as we seem to have the inertial system that has a 3 meter accuracy, comment please.
why are russians ships the only ones equipped with anti torpedo rockets along with indian ones..Arent they obselete with todays torpedos defenses like mareech and decoys?.
How are targetting info fed to ships that do not have helis to fire brahmos missiles.
THe kolkatta class seems to have all the sonars that are indian made, can we say they are equal to European ones especialy the low frequency towed array.why are we then still trying to import german ones.

RD said...

Why did India on first hand went for joint development of Barak with Israel. Also how much optimistic u r about this project with regards to time of induction & success rate of destroying targets.

The Indian Navy was already using Shtil, a variant of BUK missile & several of its local variants are in service with Belarus,China & Iran. We should have jointly developed it with Russia like Brahmos to extend its range to qualify as LRSAM.

rad said...

HI Prasun
I remember you saying that 2 OTH radar are being constructed in the east and west , who is supplying them and what is the position now

Vikram Guha said...

PrasunDa ,
1) According to this report INDIA is buying 3more A-50 . Is it true ?
2) Will 6 , A-50 be enough for India ?

3) The Telegraph reported that INDIA and Russia plans to trade in rupee and rouble . Is this news correct ?

Many Thanks,


Prasun da,

C 148 cyclone with 13T MTOW and 7T empty weight will be the best choice for NMRH and will be in required folded dimensions of 15.5m by 5.5m and is also likely to be cheapest when compared to EC 725 and NH90.

Present Mi17 acquired between 2000-15 by IAF will be retired between 2030-45 and will be 179 nos and IA requires minimum 80 nos Mi17 type helicopter i,e. 260nos.

Now HAL IMRH will be based on present tested helo engine and transmission system with new airframe and 5 blade main rotor system.

So C 148 with 3000hp twin engine will be the best choice for HAL co development where width of cabin is increased from 2m to 2.34m of mi17 and production @16/year from 2025-45 can replace mi17 of IAF and fulfill requirement of IN and IA as well.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To BISWAJIT: VMT, but August 15 should be more about introspection & reflection. Will swell more on this later today.

To SARATH KUMAR: Kongsberg of Norway’s NSM/HSM anti-ship cruise missile.

To SUMIT SEN: Varunastra isn’t yet cleared for service induction since its user-trials have not yet begun.

To TAPPU: Marreech is a soft-kill system whereas the RBU-6000 is a hard-kill system. Both are required.

To RAD: Pinaka-2’s range increase is through the usage of higher-energy propellants, just like Akash-2.
It is supposed to have TCS, but from where no one knows as yet. Pinaka-3 will be almost identical to Smerch-M’s rockets & maybe the Russians know only too well that India will end up reverse-engineering the Smerch-M’s rockets & that’s why they have refused to give ToT to OFB. MBRLs from China are comparable to their Russian counterparts in every way. Several non-Russian warships continue to employ ASROC/SUBROC systems like the RBU-series anti-torpedo rockets. For BrahMos-1 target acquisition, the Garpun Bal-E radar is employed. The OTHR reqmt has not yet been tendered out.

To RD: Shtil-1 is a full generation behind the Barak-8 LR-SAM/EL/M-2248 MF-STAR combination.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VIKRAM GUHA: It is absolutely true. The IAF requires at least 12 A-50I PHALCON-type platforms. The Rupee-Rouble trade is being actively considered because India will in future be buying Russia-supplied gas. Aware that it could lose market share in Europe within 10 years and that North American natural gas from the US & Canada could ship to Europe--Russia has been looking to Asian and East Asian markets, where demand for energy imports is rapidly growing. Russia and India have been negotiating to build a US$30 billion oil pipeline, which would be the world’s most expensive due to its proposed route through rugged terrain. The so-called Silk Road Pipeline would link Russia’s Altai Mountain region to the Xinjiang province of China and northern India via Uttarakhand. Russia began planning this project around the same time that China and Russia began discussing a gas pipeline. The then Indian Prime Minister Dr Manmohan Singh and Vladimir Putin issued a joint statement from Moscow on October 21, 2013, which confirmed that the two nations are collaborating “to study the possibility of direct ground transportation of hydrocarbons.” This statement reaffirmed a joint commitment made in 2010. A year earlier, the foreign ministers from Russia, India and China had agreed to enhance energy cooperation among the two countries, and at the end of 2012, Oil and Natural Gas Corp (ONGC), confirmed its interest in the pipeline from Russia, calling it “appropriate.” Talks about the pipeline's construction are expected to conclude by the end of this year, with a completion date of 2020-2022. China too is anxious to get this project to succeed since it will use this same pipeline for supplying gas within TAR & Chinese President Xi Jinping wants this to be a flagship project aimed at boosting economic growth within TAR—this being in line with China’s ‘Look West’ policy. That’s precisely why we nowadays are witnessing increasingly serious calls for resolving the LAC issue permanently.

Sarath Kumar said...

But sir, why would the Kongsberg NSM go on board Kolkata? Isn't BrahMos enough?

Vikram Guha said...

Prasun Da ,

(1) Why is the IN repairing 5 IL 38SD when it can very easily purchase more P-8I ?

(2) Vishnu Som published this report today about the INS Kolkata and it seems that IN has launched a half-baked product . A couple of the shortcomings reported are :

(a) Barak-8 still under development

(b) Absence of a primary sensor to detect submarines

( c) Absence of a Long Range Towed Array Sonar

(d) Concerns about supply of spare parts from Ukraine for the Zorya M36E gas turbine plants

( e) IN wanted a 100 mm Gun but got a 76mm gun

( 3) Is the MF-STAR is in the same class as the US Navy's Aegis combat system and AN/SPY-1D radar antenna ?



S Nair said...


Is Project 15A comparable to similar ships operating in Europe?
Crew size of UK and French counterpart is <200. In our case its like 300+. Isn't this an indication of crude integration and lack of automation ?

Rajeev Chaturvedi said...


Which parts of Brahmos Missile is being made in India and in Russia? In addition, which parts of Brahmos Mini is being developed by both countries?

Is it a model joint venture which is being talked about?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAJEEV CHATURVEDI: Are you suffering from some kind of post-August 15 hangover? Because the data you’ve asked for on BrahMos-1 was uploaded in this thread:

Thus far, this blog is the only one to host such data & no one else either in India or elsewhere will ever get to upload such data.

To S NAIR: Project 15A is larger than its British, Dutch, Italian, French or US counterparts. On top of that IN personnel are—in vocational terms—not trained for multi-tasking. Lastly, while European & North American warships have heli-decks for housing only one NMRH, the P-15A DDG is made for housing two NMRHs. Then there are the extra hands for cooking, cleaning toilets, etc. All these tend to inflate the crew complement numbers of indigenously built IN warships. Even since 1969, all warships of the IN of Soviet origin had on-board crew which numbered more than what had been specified by the Soviet Navy itself.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SARATH KUMAR: NSM’s helicopter-launched variant is the HSM, which has nothing to do with BrahMos-1. Every 12-tonne or 10-tonne shipborne NMRH is nowadays armed with HSM-type ASCMs. Even the Sea King Mk42Bs of the IN once sported MBDA-built Sea eagle ASCMs.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Listen to PM Narendra Modi's speech on the occasion of commission of INS Kolkata:

The PM ought to come down heavily against whosoever in the PMO or NHQ told him that India's first navy was raised by Chattrapati Shivaji. This type of myopic viewpoint can only originate from those residing in those areas of India that are above Nagpur. In reality, India under the Cholas had navies equipped for expeditionary warfare & by consequence had both sea-control & sea-denial capabilities, as evidenced by the links below:



Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VIKRAM GUHA: Wasn't it shameful that the CM of West Bengal wasn't present at the commissioning ceremony of INS Kolkata? And if I'm not mistaken, the CM of WB is one of the few who has yet to officially call on the new PM in Delhi. As to why such a state of affairs, your guess is as good as mine.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VIKRAM GUHA: LoLzzzz! As they say in Bengali, ‘Bawlodher bawldaamipaanaar kono sheema nai’ (there’s no limit to the idiocracies of idiots), irregardless of whether it originates from NDTV or Headlines Today or Times Now or Business Standard. Let’s follow-up with a few examples:

Claim: In fact, the Kolkata is not fit for battle in its present state. Consider this: the surface-to-air missile suite of the Kolkata, the Barak 8 missile, is still being co-developed with Israel.
Reality: Israel Aerospace Industries' Barak 8 is not only fully developed, but it won a technological innovation award that was presented at the International Aerospace 2014 conference held July 7, 2014 in Tel Aviv. According to the judges, the Barak 8 displayed a definite advantage in two leading areas: the project embodies breakthrough technologies, innovation, pioneering and creative thinking.

Claim: Neither is the INS Kolkata equipped with a primary sensor to detect submarines, a towed array sonar.
Reality: Primary sensor for detecting submarines is the bow-mounted panoramic sonar, & NOT a towed-array sonar.

Claim: Another area of huge concern is the primary engines of the Kolkata class…. but with Ukraine being in a state of war, there are concerns that the long term supply of spares could be an issue.
Reality: Ukraine isn’t in any state of war, but just facing a separatist insurgency. It does not face any existential threat & is being FINANCIALLY backed up by the US & EU. Furthermore, all VK-2500 engines of the IAF’s Mi-17V-5s are being supplied by Ukraine’s Motor Sich JSC via Tartarstan-based Kazan Helicopter Plant without any glitches, as are hundreds of Ukraine-built components for the Su-30MKI via Rosoboronexport State Corp. Upgrades of the IAF’s An-32Bs are still on-going without trouble.

Claim: At the moment, she is designed to carry only 32 Barak surface-to-air missiles
Reality: The number 32 refers to ONLY those Barak-8s that are loaded in ready-to-fire configuration & does not include the four VLS cells held in storage internally as reloads.

Claim: Another area of excellence is in the integration of systems from around the world. This is an area where the Mazgaon Docks Limited (MDL) has made an enormous mark.
Reality: Firstly, it’s Mazagon & nor Mazgaon. Secondly, systems integration isn’t MDL’s job, but that of a team of technocrats from the IN’s WESEE & the DRDO.

Claim: Russian-built Talwar class frigates carry 64 missiles (24 Shtil-1 and 40 9M311 missiles.
Reality: Not 64, but 24 & the SAM system is called Shtil-1, while the entire on-board air-defence system is called Cashmere. The Shtil-1 system comprises the 24 rounds of 9M317M SAMs, a 3S-90 missile launcher, four MR-90 Orekh target illuminators, and the Salyut FSUE-built E-band MR-760 Fregat M2EM 3-D radar.

Claim: With the navy running out of its vintage Sea King helicopters, INS Kolkata has been equipped with single-engine Cheetahs.
Reality: Not Cheetahs, but Chetaks.

Claim: Meanwhile the failure to develop or import an ATAS, means that the Kolkata remains a sitting duck for enemy submarines that can hide behind the peculiar temperature gradients in the warm, shallow waters of the Arabian Sea. The Kolkata shares this vulnerability with every one of India's warships built since 1997.
Reality: Even in 1971, the IN never employed DDGs & FFGs for patrolling shallow waters. They were always out in the deep seas constantly on the move. Shallow water ASW sweeps were & are always done by ASW corvettes & shallow-water FACs fitted with ASW gear.

sumit sen said...

dada... Is hashimara afb still operating mig27ml?? Or they have been converted with su30mki squadrons??

rad said...

hi prasun
how true is the report that india has ordered 2 amur class subs strait away , and china is also ordering them to counter india.I dont understand why they need amur class to come all the way from china to patrol the coast of india as they dont have such endurance unless they are bunkered in srilanka or maldives. Can they be replenished in the mid ocean by sub tendering ships , in that case they will have the capacity
Is it not a good idea to buy the rafales from france direct and save money to buy more rather than buying a craft that costs more than a stealth ac when we build it here .The main concern is we dont have the scientific base to absorb the hitech coming as ll know ,and ultimately the irresponsible hal will do a hash job of building the ac
Agni 3 warhead rolling off a flat bed trailer !!! show how much concern and responsibility is there by people .What stops a jihadis from hijacking the trailer???

vishakh said...


China is buying LADA class submarines. Is this report true ?? Does that means its problems are over ??

For India P75A project for Land attack submarines which submarines are frunt runner??
1) Scorpene are not Sea Going design.
2) U216 is paper design.
3) S-80 is facing design issues
4) U214 Has performance issues.

India needs 2300-2800 tons sub design , which submarine fits this ??

5) When is india's new MCIWS goign for trials??

Rajeev Chaturvedi said...


Let me give you some context on my question on Brahmos. Several recent news reports coming from Russia mention that India is going to do a quick buy of Amur Submarines and now even Chinese have joined in to buy the same. In addition, Russians are also talking about Brahmos type JV in other various areas of military production. Americans are also looking for a similar kind of joint venture.

However, in a recent interview, the current head of Brahmos Ltd became bit uncomfortable when he was asked about the seeker, engine and other crucial parts of Brahmos's indigenisation. Your post details how many Indian companies are involved in Brahmos but it doesn't say which Russian companies are involved and which products are still coming from Russia.

Hence, the question arises is whether Brahmos JV is "THE" model JV which India should be looking for? Please elaborate.

J Rao said...


These A-50 AEW&C aircrafts, which India is going to buy from Russia, will have Israeli radars or Russian radars?

Reddy said...

Thanks Prasun for explaining us in clear terms whats happening and what should and should not happen in defence front.

Govt, Armed Forces, Navy, and people like you must write a open letter to the print and electronic media to improve their professionalism in all fronts especially in their knowledge on the topics they are reporting, image policies, audio and back ground score policies etc.

Thanks for taking time for this unpaid job, we all appreciate you as a true son of this land.

This week requests: Please write something on Modi Japan, China and US visits.

Vikram Guha said...

Prasun Da ,

Many thanks for the elaborate explanation .

Re our Chief Minister , she could not meet Modi because she is busy taking a bunch of Clowns to a circus in Singapore .


sujoymajumdar said...

Prasun Da ,

So why have the Indian Navy not installed the Barak-8 on the Kolkata Class destroyer ?

Azerbaijan has already installed the Barak -8


Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SUMIT SEN: Only MiG-27UPGs are based there.

To RAD: These canards are being spread by the very Delhi-based vested interests who are spreading similar disinformation about the Eurofighter EF-2000’s chances of being procured for the IAF. The Russian Navy has already rejected the single-hulled Amur 1650 SSK in favour of the double-hulled Type 636 SSK design & the IN will therefore NEVER even consider the Amur 1650, leave alone procuring them. The PLA Navy, on the other hand, is interested in buying the entire IPRs of the Amur 1650 since the PLAN wants to acquire single-hulled SSKs in large numbers, i.e. more than 30 for littoral warfare within the South China Sea. Therefore, in light of all of the above, the IN will never go for any procurements of Amur 1650 SSKs. And in any case, such SSKs will take at least another four years to be series-produced, be it in Russia or China, by which time the IN’s Scorpene SSKs will start becoming available.

To VISAKH: Not true. But the PLA Navy, on the other hand, is interested in buying the entire IPRs of the Amur 1650 since the PLAN wants to acquire single-hulled SSKs in large numbers, i.e. more than 30 for littoral warfare within the South China Sea.

To RAJEEV CHATURVEDI: From the Russian side, the only involved OEMs are NPOM & Granit JSC. It is these two that have progressively transferred manufacturing know-how to all the participating Indian companies. The existing SGH X-band seeker will be replaced in future by a locally-developed one.

To J RAO: Russia isn’t even close to manufacturing such AEW radars. The AS-50I PHALCON’s complete avionics suite is known as the EL/W-2090.

To REDDY: VMT. Will try.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VIKRAM GUHA: Just hope those ‘jokers’ aren’t caught red-handed while jay-walking. Punishments in Singapore are quite harsh for such offenses. A few spanking strokes of the ‘rotan’ in the buttocks always leaves a permanent scar, even after the wounds heal. Now let’s revert back to the INS Kolkata issue. Since security was extremely tight prior to the commissioning ceremony, NO civilian was allowed to go on board the DDG prior to the commissioning ceremony. That’s why, not a single ‘desi’ journalist was allowed to go on board & after the commissioning ceremony these ‘desi’ journalists in any case didn’t have the stomach to stay back. It so happens that since I’m presently writing a semi-official history of the IN’s WESEE (to be published later as a book), a walkabout was arranged in the late afternoon. The bridge of INS Kolkata is breathtaking indeed & features three large AMLCDs sourced from Belgium’s BARCO on which the DDG’s CO, while present on the bridge, can be shown the entire land, sea & air situational awareness projections all at the same time, i.e. the very same projections available at the combat information centre (CIC). This was a concept the WESEE had designed & co-developed with the DRDO after it had done a comprehensive study of the US Navy’s AEGIS system. The Indian version, though, is not as advanced as the AEGIS since the AEGIS makes use of data available from a host of space-based & airborne platforms (i.e. the cooperative engagement capability) the kind of which is not yet available to the IN. But the incorporation of the LINK-3 data-link operating in the L- & Ka-bands (the latter with the help of GSAT-7/Rukmini) has improved the IN’s at-sea situational awareness by leaps & bounds.

To SUJOY MAJUMDAR: As I had already explained in a previous thread, the DRDO had inked the contract for only integrating the Barak-8 LR-SAM with the EL/M-2248 MF-STAR, & had totally forgotten about integrating the EL/M-2248 MF-STAR/Barak-8 combination with the DDG’s CMD-15A combat management. Consequently, IAI was contacted only at a later date for developing & supplying the interfacing algorithms. That’s what has caused the delay. And the DRDO’s readymade excuse: it was an unintentional oversight since the DRDO has never before been involved in a joint development venture of this nature!

Anonymous said...

Hi Prasun,

What is your take on this artical

Best Regards

rad said...

hi prasun
we would love too see pics of the kolkatta bridge with all those amlcd from barco , but i think
in the interest of the nation we have to contend with not asking for them .
you talked about datalink 3 , please explain the various data links in the army, navy and airforce,are they contemprory like the link-16, 11 , etc do we have a equal to that and how secure ?.
in times of war the sat data link can always be jammed what do we do then?.

rad said...

hi prasun
what is this talk of redesigning the nirbhay missle , have they screwed up again . Is it the cause of this enormous delay in conducting the next test flight . why dint we put an aesa secondary radar on the kolkatta rather than the conventional radar.
are smaller india warships going to be equipped with the barak 8 combined with aesa radars

Messenger said...

Since chinese mastered the art of hacking sophisticated US networks leave alone Indian, how can India make it safe the so called network centric warfare capabilities?

After all TCP/IP hacking at the network layer level in the OSI or at the physical layer level can be done given almost all of the communication and network equipment comes from chinese huawei like routers, switches etc.

Why India not making these things locally? Why India and Indians afraid of making R&D in these critical hardware areas?

sujoymajumdar said...

Prasun Da ,

Many thanks for the detailed information .

Also it’s good to know that the IAF is going for the EL/W 2090 on the A-50 .

(1) Why is it that the Ruskies are unable to develop systems like the EL/W 2090 ? Ruskies dominate IT competitions like TopCoder and Code Jam whereas the Israelis are nowhere to be found in these IT competitions . I am unable to connect the dots . Please do shed some light on this .

(2) Was it a correct decision on the part of the MoD to develop the MTA with Russia instead of looking for a partner in the West ?

Thanks again ,

Messenger said...

Prasun da,
By reading all the news papers and news articles written by different reporters, people can easily identify who are all the reporters working for different external countries, agencies in our country.

Once such a list is made, our intel agencies can track all their bank records, travel records, purchase records, events they attended etc and can come to a conclusion who are all the reporters working for other nations and their agents.

Does our agencies routinely do all these activities even in peace time or do only when a major thing happens?

Also of the reports that we have hell a lot of number of people staying in our country even after their visa expires makes me feel sick.

can any one know what all those pakis with expired visas doing in our country? are they giving training to do bad things in our country? motivating people? what business they have here?

kerala and TN becoming/ in some parts of those states already became anti-hindu and anti-india regions... i do not know what our police and intel agencies are doing?

vishakh said...


1) What is status is Rustom 1 and Rustom 2 UAV ??

ID DRDO looking for new engine for Rustom2 ??

When is india planning to induct Rustom 1 and in what numbers??

2) What is status of MCIWS of DRDO ??

3) What is status BEL developed communication suite /radio for soldier under FINSAS??

vishakh said...


Denel of south africa is finally un-blocked by DOD . Can we axpect same for ST of Singapore .
1) Can Bhim project be again be revived ??
2) What new project can take place with Denel and ST ??


Will the de-blacklisting of Denal mean the Bhim project will get back on track sir?

THE SPONGE said...

What is being done to address the fact one of the most advanced warships ever created (P-15As) are having to sail with vintage Sea Kings and Chetaks?

This is the real issue with its combat capability-not the Barak-8 issues which will be addressed shorty.

Is the NMRH deal being moved forward in any tangible way? It has been in stasis for how many years now? And it is not even mentioned when the likes of the Apache and Chinook deals are moving closer to being signed....

When will the S-70B/NH-90 be ordered? You have contacts in the IN/MOD surely you are able to impress upon them the urgent need for such helos.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VISAKH & LOST PATHFINDER: Why this uncalled-for obsession with the Bhim/T-6 155mm/52-cal tracked SPH? Looks like you guys haven’t yet absorbed what I have repeatedly been explaining for the past two years: the days of total war & overwhelming military responses ended for good after May 1998 & the focus is strictly & only on limited high-intensity conflict & that too only along disputed lines of control like the LoC & LAC, meaning wars will not be fought along international borders. No more desert warfare & no more warfare on the plains of southern Punjab. Instead, high-intensity wars, IF FOUGHT, will be of short durations lasting not more than 2 weeks & will mostly be fought over areas stretching from the Sialkot-Jammu salient all the way up to Turtuk against Pakistan, & when it comes to China, the decisive land battles will be in the Aksai Chin & Sikkim sectors, nowhere else. This automatically means that field artillery assets will have to be lightweight & quickly deployable along roadways that will not exactly be of the MLC-70 category & consequently, motorised 155mm/52-cal howitzers (mounted gun systems) will be in great demand & NOT the far heavier 50-tonne-plus tracked SPHs, be it in J & K (inclusive of Ladakh) or Sikkim or Uttarakhand or Himachal Pradesh. Since this will be the definitive land warfare scenario of the future, counter-battery/weapon-locating radars over such terrain (to due mountain clutter & terrain-masking) will be totally useless & therefore target acquisition will have to be done exclusively by UAVs. Coming now to motorised 155mm/52-cal howitzers (mounted gun systems), between the Caesar being offered by Nexter Systems/Larsen & Toubro/Ashok Leyland & the one from TATA Power SED/DENEL Land Systems, the former is anyday a far better choice due to its superior engineering design & proven track record in the global export market as well as in France. The later product still has no customer either in South Africa or abroad & will therefore be much more expensive & the IA does not want to become a guinea pig by procuring a system without a proven track-record.

To VISAKH: 1) Still under development. Rustom-1 was supposed to be have been delivered in its final operational configuration last year. Therefore, obviously the DRDO screwed up. The Rustom-2’s maiden flight will take place during the fourth quarter of this year bit it will only be a technology demonstrator vehicle with no on-board payloads. DRDO wants the Rustom-2 to be powered by twin diesel engines, which is a good idea. 2) Same as that of last year. Technical trials under various operating conditions over various types of terrain are underway. 3) Still under development.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To MESSENGER: It’s not about them being fifth columnists. Instead, it is just a sickening mindset that’s responsible for this gigantic mess & mis-reporting. In case of INS Kolkata, it all started with a report in MAIL TODAY written by a bandalbaaz, which was then repeated in HEADLINES TODAY, & this virus then spread to NDTV, then to TIMES NOW & finally to BUSINESS STANDARD. And NONE of the ‘desi’ reporters on-site in Mumbai actually stepped on–board the DDG. All their news broadcasts show them either standing on the jetty or pretending to walk down the gangway. Take for instance all this needless banter about a deficiency of on-board SAMs. During wartime any aircraft carrier of the IN will be accompanies by at least four escorting DDGs & FFGs & therefore, between them, more than 150 MR-SAMs & LR-SAMs will be available for immediate usage. Furthermore, which of India’s likely enemies will ever be able to muster successive flights of combat aircraft or successive salvoes of ASCMs in numbers exceeding 30 at any given time? Let’s therefore be realistic & not be carried away by scenarios of the type one gets to play with Xbox or read in the late Tom Clancy’s novels!!!

And as for resident non-Indians on Indian soil, the largest numbers are neither from Bangladesh nor from Pakistan, but from Myanmar. More than 100,000 are staying as refugees & without any kind of paperwork throughout Mizoram & Meghalaya. I hope this puts an end to all kinds of speculative hype about Bangladeshis staying illegally in India.

And don’t confuse network-centric warfare with cyber warfare. Can’t compare apples with oranges.

To SUJOY MAJUMDAR: 1) Ruskies lost an entire generation of scientists/technocrats during the years of upheaval between 1991 & 2001 when the military-industrial capabilities of the former USSR were systematically either dismantled or reduced to the very few. Israel is the world’s No.2 in all spectrums of EW after the US. It’s just that the Israelis don’t blow their trumpets in such areas. Like I said a few times before, there are close to 6,000 PhD-holders in Israel who specialize in GSM technologies alone. So just imagine what the numbers will be when it comes to various areas of cutting-edge EW R & D. Russia doesn’t even come close to such numbers. 2) The other choice was Brazil’s Embraer. But teaming up with Russia for the MRTA was a good one PROVIDED India gets a free hand to determine the MRTA’s India-specific avionics suite & turbofans of Western origin (most likely a member of the CFM56 family). Even if HAL had teamed up with Embraer, then too HAL would have become a junior partner since Embraer has tones of experience (compared to HAL) in developing both passenger aircraft & military transports.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAD: Not a re-design, but a minor re-engineering of the Nirbhay’s internal bulkheads & wiring harnesses. Ideally, the RAN-40L should have gone on-board the INS Kolkata, just like the 127mm cannon should have been selected instead of the 76/62 SRGM. The seven P-17A FFGs & four P-15B DDGs will have the same type of on-board sensors & weapons fitments as on the INS Kolkata. But only time will tell whether a further design revision is undertaken at a later date to incorporate new-generation L-band radars & 127mm cannons. As for the BARCO AMLCDs, just picture for yourself a standard-looking bridge, with the three AMLCDs hanging from the ceiling of the bridge behind the CO’s chair, plus one 20-inch AMLCD in front of the CO to display the IIR imagery. Right now, only the IN has long-distance two-way data-links operational (the LINK-2 & now the LINK-3) & they’re on par with the best that’s available from abroad. The IAF & IA don’t yet have such data-links in place. The IAF has tactical two-way data-links for use by combat aircraft that need to communicate with the A-50I PHALCONs, data-links for receiving air situation picture on the ground from the A-50Is, data-links for receiving recce imagery on the ground & in the battlefield from RecceLite pods, data-links for downloading on the ground real-time SAR imagery obtained from EL/M-2060P pods, & data-links for sending such data to a satellite from Bombardier Global 5000 equipped with EL/M-2060 SAR & then bouncing this data back to ground receiving stations in real-time. SATCOM-based data-links can only be jammed over the battlefield & not anywhere else.

To VIKRAM GUHA: LINK-3 data-link operating in the L- & Ku-bands, & not Ka-band as I had mentioned yesterday.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To THE SPONGE: Being done by whom? The S-70B Seahawk was selected as L-1 way back in 2009. For the delays, only A K Antony can provide the answers that will in any case be indefensible, just as is the case with the still-to-be-ordered DSRVs from Canada’s Ocean Works. In any case, once the ROV/LFDS combination is validated in the near future, the ASW gap will be closed to a considerable extent, leaving only the OTH targetting capability to be acquired. As an interim measure, the P-15As that will be escorting the aircraft carriers will make use of the carrier-based Ka-31s & Project 1135.6 FFG-based Ka-31s for OTH targetting.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAJ: My POV is that the author of that story suffers from a siege mentality, period. Tensions alomng the LAC & LoC are for totally different reasons. Along the LAC, China does not enjoy superior situational awareness due to its inability to lay hands on new-generation MALE-UAVs capable of flying over high-altitude mountainous terrain. All it has are locally-developed manually-launched CH-802 mini-UAVs like the Skylark. It is for this reason the PLA Border Defence Regiments regularly undertake long-range patrols (LRP) & transgress over India-claimed territory & such patrols never stay put for more than 4 hours. The IA too undertakes similar LRPs over China-claimed territory, albeit on a much lesser scale since the IA has access to a certain type of non-Israeli MALE-UAV (the US-supplied General Atomics Predator) that outperforms its Chinese counterpart (the CH-4A Wing Loong). Furthermore, unlike the IAF’s EL/M-2060P SAR pods, the PLAAF does not possess anything of this kind. All that the PLA can therefore field as early warning systems are about 10 ELINT/SIGINT outposts stretching from Aksai Chin right up to Num La. One such outpost (enclosed within a white radome) can be atop Zorawar Fort in Demchok here at 02.13:

To the west, the great bulk of the ceasefire violations since 2010 have taken place in an area (what Pakistan calls the Working Boundary) along the junction of the Punjab-J & K border, & not along the LoC. This is because the PA since 2009 has been trying to convince India to enact certain CBMs throughout the LoC that will: A) formalise the ceasefire that had begun since November 2003 based just on verbal commitments but which was never formalised on paper; & B) As a result of such CBMs, Pakistan wanted the IA to withdraw its medium field artillery batteries (the Bofors FH-77Bs) 30km away (lateral distance) from the LoC, which would have given the PA a degree of comfort reqd for the PA to start diverting the majority of its infantry formations from its eastern deployment areas to the west along the Durand Line. But India has refused to accept such CBMs, because if India were to accept them, it would have meant that Pakistan had succeeded in using state-sponsored terrorism as a negotiable instrument for buying peace with India. India’s POV has since 2002 been to totally neutralise this trump card of Pakistan (i.e. state-sponsored terrorism employed for proxy war within J & K) as time went by & it was after 2002 that India began succeeding in implementing this strategm after India's Defence Intelligence Agency (DIA) waged a highly successful covert war against Pakistan by actively rendering all kinds of financial assistance (and no other form of material assistance) to Balochistan-based separatists. But mind you, such covert warfare has not been waged by the Research & Analysis Wing (RAW), but by the DIA which generously funded Afghanistan's Riyast-i-Amniyat-i-Milli. At the same time, the PA cannot afford to undertake escalatory artillery fire-assaults along the entire LoC since India will retaliate & close the Muzzafarabad-Kel highway, which will effectively cut off the entire Neelam Valley from the rest of Pakistan. So, effectively, Pakistan is now in a bind & is desperately trying to attract India’s attention at a time when most Indians (apart from the likes of Mani Shankar Aiyar) want to abandon Pakistan in a state of benign neglect, much like how India distanced itself from Bangladesh from 1972 till the mid-1990s.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAJ: Therefore, don't for a moment take seriously any of those retired Indian diplomats that are frequently seen blabbering off in tangents on the national TV broadcast channels & saying everything except the naked truth. For instance, the likes of G Parthasarathy have consistently claimed that Dr MMS' summit meeting with his Pakistani counterpart Yousof Raza Gilani at Sharm-el-Sheikh was a total failure & great embarrassment to India, the truth is that by admitting that there existed a problem in Balochistan, Dr MMS was sending a signal to Pakistan that India was very much capable of initiating & sustaining a proxy war deep inside Pakistan through 'invisible hands', i.e. killing with a borrowed knife by using the services of Afghanistan's Riyast-i-Amniyat-i-Milli. In fact, many till this day suspect that the outcome of summit meeting at Sharm-el-Shaik in Egypt was secretly pre-choreographed between
the two PMs, since the then PPP-led govt at that time too desperately wanted the PA to be checkmated by reducing the PA's usage of terrorism to a worthless option. And in this, India to date has succeeded to a very large extent.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Watch the pathetic state of Ladakh’s infrastructure:

CREATION said...

Prasun sir,

According to you the P-17As and P-15Bs won't have the RAN-40L VSR as on the IAC-1? if so I am bitterly bitterly disappointed. This was something i had hoped would come on the P-15A or at least during their SLEP.

THE SPONGE said...

Sir, so when will the S-70B be ordered? AK Antony is out of office now isn't he? Time to move foreword and not look back.....

S-70Bs and a rpelacment NLUH for the Chetaks are the need of yesterday let alone tommorw. The IN is the joke of the high seas running sailing around with vintage Sea Kings and Chetaks on $1BN USD warships!

SEARCHER said...

How credible is th news the IAF is replacing their lost C-130J-30 sir?

Gulab said...

Asymmetric load testing on JF-17, halfway down the page, wait for the image. It seems they are really progressing fast and that the FCS is maturing fast. This fighter is becoming fully operational.

Gulab said...

US, Israel, UK, France are/were the masters of EW. China now though is beginning to dwarf everyone except US. Even in number of PhD students in EW, etc... EW is the new asymmetrical warfare!

joydeep ghosh said...

@Prasun da

as per your answers, here are my opinions,

1. what you said to #Vikram Guha about 'concept the WESEE had designed' makes me think that what IN warships will have in future is somewhat downgraded AEGIS

2. what you said to # VISAKH & LOST PATHFINDER makes me feel that
a. WLRs will be steadily become ineffective
b. its not the ‘Sialkot-Jammu salient all the way up to Turtuk’ but the CJ corridor which IA can target anytime it wants

3. what you said to #MESSENGER ‘India’s likely enemies will ever be able to muster successive flights of combat aircraft’ makes me ask what if anyone wants to go for a one way mission, remember a PAF commander boasted of a 1 way plan to take out nuke facilities near bombay

4. what you said to #RAD ‘The seven P-17A FFGs & four P-15B DDGs will have the same type of on-board sensors & weapons fitments as on the INS Kolkata. But only time will tell whether a further design revision is undertaken at a later date to incorporate new-generation L-band radars & 127mm cannons.’ makes me feel that after the current series of ships like P15b OR P17b are launched, the next series of ships such as DDGs will be 2k ton heavier & FFGs will be 1k ton heavier atleast to be able to launch both Nirbhay and Brahmos or larger number of any of the 2 missiles (32 instead of current 16 for DDGs and 16 instead of 8 for FFGs)

5. what you said to #To THE SPONGE, ‘the ASW gap will be closed to a considerable extent, leaving only the OTH targetting capability to be acquired’ makes me feel once OTH target cues are acquired the viability of torpedo tube fired Brahmos Mini becomes very much reality

Awaiting your response please


Joydeep Ghosh

rad said...

51hi prasun
during the cope exercises there was a talk about the indian su-30 data linked and passing info to each other , Is it indian or russian?. why cant we have out own stuff as it would have been compromised by the sale to china.
have we ordered the global express ac with Israeli avionics? or is it pending . when is it expected. Is there a larger version of the 2060 pod ?. Is it as good as the jstars? or the sentinel?I

Jaidev said...


Did you say that Indian Army is using MQ-9 Predator in recon and surveillance operations on India-China border? When did India buy Predators?

vishakh said...


IN refused to take delivery P15 of ATAS so that means that IN doen't need VLF sonars or LF sonars both not available with DRDO ??

With current fitments can it detect Submarines from CHina and pakisthan and engage them??

vishakh said...


DRDO plans to develope 100KM Pinaka 2 , what is expected date of developement ??

Will this system be better than Smerch ??

Anonymous said...

M K Bhadrakumar is a guy churning out anti india articles that costs foreign agencies around 10,000 Rupees for each article.

He can write any article for 10,000 and if you need him to use his name something like "Ambassador M K Bhadrakumar" you have to pay a little extra.

Vikram Guha said...

Yes , Prasun Da , you are completely correct about the Indian Media . They are more interested in BREAKING NEWS and not following it up . Media in India today has become as corrupt as their Political Masters . In the US there is this concept called Help a Reporter , where reporters can reach out to experts on various topics

In India too , the media should start such a concept and reach out to defense experts like you to clarify their own understanding instead of broadcasting biased news with the intention of fooling an already gullible public who routinely gets a KICK from such navel gazing intellect .

Meanwhile Japan is about to start construction on another Air-Capable Assault Ship . And unlike India they will complete construction in record time .

Thanks ,


Mayur M Manapure said...

Sir what do you think of Times Now Defence analyst Maroof Raza.....seems he was born to hate Pakistan....

abs said...

What do you make of the move to cancel Foreign Secretary level talks with Pakistan following the move of the Pak HC to talk with separatists?
Is it a much larger scheme to cut the separatists down to size and eventually kick them out of India?

Biswajit said...

Prasun Da have a look at this

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To CREATION: Not according to me, but according to BHASWAR in a previous thread. All that we know so far is that THALES has not yet announced receiving any follow-on order from BEL for THALES-BEL RAWL-02 PLN-517 L-band air-search radars, meaning the competition is still open.

To THE SPONGE: Unfortunately your line of thinking & enthusiasm isn’t shared by the new decision-makers in Delhi. Just ask yourself why is the same person in charge of both the finance & defence portfolios at this point in time? The answer is simple: the new govt-in-power is nurturing hopes of such a centralisation of power delivering some kind of clinching evidence of financial impropriety (i.e. corruption) conducted by the previous UPA-2 govt during military hardware procurement exercises over the past decade. All I can say now is that such hopes will definitely be dashed since no smoking gun will ever be discovered or be revealed or emerge from either the AW-101 deal or the selection process for the M-MRCA, despite the utmost efforts in chasing shadows of the ill-informed likes of Dr Subramaniam Swamy. In the meantime, procurement deadlines will continue to slip even further, rest assured.

To SEARCHER: The UPA-2 govt already inked the contract for a follow-on six C-130J-30s late last year.

GULAB: That’s an awfully looooong time for an airframe design to mature, considering that the Super 7/Super Sabre project was conceived way back in the mid-1980s. In sharp contrast, the Tejas Mk1 already possesses a fully validated digital FCS.

To JOYDEEP GHOSH: 1) There’s no AEGIS on-board any IN warship. Question of upgraded or downgraded version of AEGIS therefore doesn’t even arise. 2) WLRs will remain effective on the plains & not over mountainous terrain. 3) And exactly how many how many MRCAs will the PAF be able to muster for implementing this one-way sorties? Will it be the entire inventory of MRCAs available to the PAF? Like the annual national day flypasts over Mexico City for which all fixed-wing & rotary-winged aircraft of the Mexican Air Force are mandatorily required to take part in this one single flypast??? 4) Wrong. The P-15B DDGs & P-17A FFGs won’t be heavier at all since they will make far greater use of composites-built sub-structures of the type on board the third & fourth Project 28 ASW corvettes. 5) Wrong again. How exactly will the OTH targetting cues be transferred from a helicopter or warship to a submerged submarine? Submarines always operate in standalone mode & their locations are unknown even to friendly naval task forces or carrier battle groups.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAD: Not the IAF’s Su-30MKIs, but the RMAF’s Su-30MKMs. IAF doesn’t require such Su-30MKI-to-Su-30MKI data-links since the Su-30MKIs will be receiving tactical situational awareness updates in near-real-time from the A-50I PHALCONs. Two Bombardier Global 5000s retrofitted by IAI for broad-area border surveillance are already operational with R & AW’s ARC.

To JAIDEV: Long ago. Sometime between 2002 & 2005. Last year had already uploaded a photo showing a HAL poster shown at DEFEXPO 2012 which showed HAL providing the Predator’s MRO-related product support.

To VISAKH: How can the IN refuse to take delivery of the Nagan active/passive LF towed-array variable depth sonars when, in the first place, the Nagan failed to operate as specified & therefore that entire R & D project was declared a failure & terminated by the DRDO? Only the LFDS dunking sonar developed by the DRDO is showing positive performance results along with the HUMSA-NG bow-mounted active/passive LF sonar & therefore those two have been ordered. HUMSA-NG is already on-board both the P-15A DDGs & the four Project 28 ASW corvettes in a bow-mounted configuration—the first ever Developed-and-Made-in-India warships to incorporate bow-mounted panoramic sonars. Pinaka-2’s range will be 60km.

To Anon@7.47PM: A simple calculation involving a collation of all his predictions will prove that 99% of all that he had foretold has proven to be either false or imaginary. Shit happens once one becomes senile.

To MAYUR M MANAPURE: It’s a free country & everyone has a right to have his/her own POV. However, what can be said without any doubt is that 99% of those analysts & commentators appearing on current-affairs programmes aired by broadcast TV networks ALWAYS & CONSISTENTLY say everything except the truth while displaying the ‘zaroorat se ziada thekedaari’ syndrome.

To BISWAJIT: Baagla se pangga na lena—that’s should be the tagline of his fairy-tale storytellings.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ABS: Arey Bandhu, the real question ought to be why are these retired IFS officials appearing on the ‘desi’ broadcast TV channels & making a mountain out of an anthill? Well….there are quite a few reasons. Let me explain.

Firstly, it must be noted that if a panelist is interviewed from his/her residence, then he/she is not paid. If he/she goes to the TV channel’s studio for recorded or live interviews, then he/she gets paid a cash cheque of Rs.5,000 by a young, cute female guest relations officer clad in a tightfighting outfit. This tamasha is played day in & day out throughout Delhi & elsewhere in India in ALL TV channels. Therefore, had these bilateral talks gone through, then most of these retired diplomats & ex-military officers would each have earned an extra Rs.30,000 for appearing consecutively for the next four days. Now, since this will not happen due to the cancelled talks, the anguished would-be panelists are all shedding crocodile tears.

Secondly, wooly-headed nitwits like Mani Shankar Aiyar are still smarting from the dry sarcasm of NaMo during his ID speech (where he referred to the ‘apnapan with chaiwallah’), which was a highly embarrassing jab at the Congress & from which the Congress has yet to recover. That’s why this nitwit Aiyar has lost all sense of mental equilibrium, especially when he rattles off the names of Pakistani politicians he used to meet with during his days in Karachi as India’s Consul General (when K Natwar Singh was the High Commissioner in Islamabad in the mid-1980s). But what this nitwit doesn’t say is that all the politicians he had met in Pakistan then WERE NEITHER separatists or secessionists—but merely part of the opposition parties. In addition, he can never muster the guts to admit that during his diplomatic stint in Pakistan, he was NEVER allowed to meet any representative of Northern Areas/Gilgit-Baltistan. In fact, no Indian diplomat has ever been allowed by Islamabad to meet any political representative from Gilgit-Baltistan. This is how ex-diplomats with their own selfish agendas tend to hide the truth from their gullible Indian audiences.

Thirdly, it will be a grave fallacy to ASSUME that the May 27 meeting between NaMo & Mian Mohd Nawaz Sharif was bound to usher in a thaw in bilateral relations. That’s because the meeting took place due to a ceremonial event & did not in any way seek to change the supreme national interests of either country.

cont'd below...

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Fourthly, if Pakistan always wants to be treated as India’s equal, then Pakistan too should allow reciprocal meetings between Indian diplomats based in Islamabad & the representatives of the natives of Gilgit-Baltistan. Since Pakistan is not allowing this to happen, why should India extend a one-sided favour or concession to Pakistan?

Fifthly, today India is definitely holding more cards on hand than Pakistan WRT the J & K issue. What this means is that, in diplomatic parlance, India cannot commence negotiations towards a final solution of the J & K issue UNTIL all its national objectives/interests have been secured. For instance, negotiations on the Shimla Agreement began ONLY after Pakistan was soundly defeated & made to surrender unconditionally in December 1971. Similarly, the victorious allied powers began negotiating a peace treaty with Japan ONLY AFTER Japan’s unconditional surrender. Therefore, whosoever comes on TV & talks about result-oriented bilateral negotiations taking place WRT J & K everytime Indian & Pakistani diplomats is, to put it simply, either being emotional, or has no sense of reality, or is totally ignorant about what REALPOLITIK is all about.

And certainly the likes of M S Aiyar won’t have clue about realpolitik because Chanakya’s Arthashastra has never been taught to IFS probationers at the Mussoorie-based Lal Bahadur Shastri Academy of Public Administration, prompting K Natwar Singh to publicly remark recently that post-independent India has never practiced realpolitik. So, finally, how does Arthashastra define realpolitik? What Arthashastra says is that in order to finally achieve greatness, one must first have to be utterly ruthless & cold-hearted, before acquiring the taste for a civilisational existence. That’s why Asoka first had to become Chand-Asoka (Asoka the slayer) so that he could engineer his empire, followi9ng which he was free to do whatever he wanted to in order to become Asoka the Great. In other words, when your enemy is begging for mercy on his knees, all the very reason for you to kick your enemy’s testicles even harder so that your enemy never ever musters the strength to stand up, a remains condemned as a vegetable forever. This is exactly what the US did in Afghanistan, Pakistan & Iraq just because two of its three buildings (the Twin Towers in NY) had been razed to the ground.

Lastly, as for the APHC being a totally irrelevant entity, here’s what the APHC leaders themselves have to say about themselves:

So, in conclusion, I hope none of you all will ever again be taken in by all the bakwaas mumbo-jumbo that will be parrotted out over the next few days by the 'desi' broadcast TV channels on this issue.

Pawan said...

Dear Prasunji,

VMT for your POV on Indo-Pak Talk and P-15A.

only think I am not able to convince myself is that future war thrust will be on LOC in Pak case because Indian army always perfected the concept of strike in cholistan desert to cut Punjab-Sindh link and it will hurt the pak most.

I really wonder why our so called defence-analysts at BS and HT not able to deduce these kind of conclusions.



Jones said...

Prasun da, have you written this article, cause it say everything what you have been telling for a long time, like, " It has become increasingly clear that two squadrons of LCA Mk.1s will be employed as advanced/lead-in jet trainers, a psychological blow to the programme, but a practical one according to the IAF, which only sees operational sense in looking more closely at the Mk.2, powered by an F414 engine."

If not then how authentic is the source.
They havent given the authors name, just that its written by SP's Special Correspondent.

SS said...

Hi Prasunji,

Long back you had expressed the same views regarding AMCA (Your words: "I don't see what extra AMCA can do that FGFA can't do"). The below article concludes the same. If it is authentic and the air force is thinking in same direction. But how can a single seat version can be used as LIFT platform? :) VMT

joydeep ghosh said...

@Prasun da

a few things

1. 'a young, cute female guest relations officer clad in a tightfighting outfit' dont you think this is bit derogatory

2. I never said The P-15B DDGs & P-17A FFGs will be heavier, i instead said the ships to be launched AFTER The P-15B DDGs & P-17A FFGs will be HEAVIER by 2K ton for DDGs & 1k ton for FFGs

3. Heard GoI has asked to replace the crashed C130J, and LM wants to setup a unit in India to manufacture the C130J-SH, do you think buying C130J-SHs (whether or not to replace Avros) is better or making them in India is better

4. some reports say 'LCA Mk.1s will be employed as advanced/ lead-in jet trainers' this proves your prediction correct, then again how can just 2 squadrons be enough as LIFT jets

5. you said to #ABS 'if Pakistan always wants to be treated as India’s equal, then Pakistan too should allow reciprocal meetings between Indian diplomats based in Islamabad & the representatives of the natives of Gilgit-Baltistan.' do you think GoI will now look to press for that specific in return for Pak talking to APHC

6. Lastly i never said IN has AEGIS but the answer you gave to #Vikram Guha 'concept the WESEE had designed' made me think what IN will have in future is somewhat similar to downgraded AEGIS

awaiting your response


Joydeep Ghosh

Ranjit said...


Seems like IAF has been reading your blog because now it wants to use LCA Mk1 as the LIFT trainer. Also, it seems HJT-36/its alternatives induction talks seem diminishing. So congratulations on this.

Furthermore, I read someone's comments that IAF was going to buy used two Mirage fighters for replacing the accidentally destroyed ones. These used ones can only be bought from France, Qatar, UAE, Taiwan and similar countries. The guy also mentioned that UAE had few years ago offered to sell all of its 60+ Mirages to India. So why has IAF hesitated in this deal? Its a quick way to increase squadron strength with relatively new Mirages. Any explanation?

Also,has India ever thought or explored the option of buying American A-10 Warthogs? They would be good for combined arms doctrine of IA and effective anti-attack helicopter platform. Any willingness so far from IAF?

Please explain.

rad said...

hi prasun
please give us more info on the global 5000 sigint,sar,comint
esm capabilities. Is it as good as the jstars or the raytheon sentinel , wont it be better if we have more of these ac for deep surveillance of the borders to the north and west.
Why cant we bid for the uae mirages if the price is right, they seem to be the dash -9 version.

Vikram Guha said...

Prasun Da ,

(1) L & T is putting $400 million into a yard to build ships for the navy . However, L&T’s Kattupalli shipyard in south India has yet to receive any orders for warships or submarines despite being designed to do just that and despite past government pledges to build at least two submarines in private yards. So why are they investing in a new ship yard when there is no guarantee of any Indian MoD order ?

(2) Does India have the right to integrate Hellfire , Brimstone or any other air-to-surface missile on the Predator UAVs that it purchased from the US ?

(3) Is it true that INS Arihant is a generation behind other nuclear submarines like the Russian Borei Class and the US Virginia Class and the UK Astute Class ?

Thank You

vishakh said...


what is status of Tata NVG joint venture with german company for 3+ gen NVG for IA soldiers ?? Is it expected to get orders

sathead3 said...

Who is that in the third picture?

rad said...

hi prasun
a company called axis aerospace seems to have EW integrated comm EW , these are hitech stuff,is it local or are they doing a screw driver tech assembly.they seem to have optical trackers for various apps as well.
will go for the ATAGS sonar towed `system or make our own for the kolkatta.

Common Sense said...

The Germans have led an aggressive counter-offer on the EF-2000?

and we have Bloomberg saying this-

Which is one is true? Or is the Government/IAF encouraging this smoke-and-mirrors campaign to yank out concessions from the French

Anonymous said...

can you shed some light on china's activity on the northern parts of Sri Lanka.

Ex-Intelligence said...

@ sathead3

Israeli and Russian delegates

@ Common Sense

If the Government/IAF is encouraging this smoke-and-mirrors campaign to yank out concessions from the French like you say , don't you think that the Germans would have publicly REBUTTED those claims ? Government/IAF has nothing to do with this . Fact is the Typhoon consortium NEVER conceded defeat . One of the major reason why the Typhoon lost in MMRCA competition was because it hardly had any ground attack capability. That situation has improved now in the last 2 years . So they are bidding again . Which also explains why they displayed the Typhoon in this year's Defense Expo .

This is NOT to say that the Government/IAF is NOT corrupt . Far from it . They approved purchase of the useless C-17 primarily because of the kickbacks they received from CIA and US State Dept . As a reminder the C-17 can NOT be used in forward bases along the Indo-China border .

The Yanks / Brits have perfected the strategy of running with hares & hunting with hounds . That's why they pretend to support India.

Deep inside they have nothing but Hatred for India . Don't take my words for anything . Take a look at one of America's most popular forum to figure out what the Americans think about India

I supect this comment of mine will be deleted by the author if not Google .

rad said...

hi prasun
what do you make out of the article by saurav jha in idrw.
he seems to be talking as though india is on the breakthrough of total ISR network , how much is true and how much is is he wishing to be true.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Matterrs have now progressed just as I had predicted….the AW-101 procurement is back on track! The terms, which has been cleared by the Attorney General, state:
* All ongoing contracts will continue unhindered.
* All contracts related to spares will continue.
* Contracts with Russian manufacturers, where Finmeccanica group is involved in the back-end, will continue
* Finmeccanica will be allowed to participate in all tenders but if there are multiple options, the group will not be considered regardless of the competitiveness of the offer.
* However, where the group is the single vendor with no other firm providing options, the government is empowered to go ahead with the deal.

vishakh said...


IAF is planning to induct AWACS of DRDO . Has DRDO able to create AESA radar on its own ??

Can india use AESA of AWACS into other radars like rohini radar etc??

Who's radar tech we are going to use for AESA for Tejas MK2

Suvo said...

Prasun Da,
Mazagon Dock Limited (MDL), has stated that critical spares of Scorpene which were to be supplied by DCNS are yet to materialise despite the deadlines expiring.So, another delay is expecting in Scorpene building.
What is the new issue Prasun Da?

A subsequent agreement for the construction of 2 more Type209/1500 class submarines to be constructed at MDL was cancelled.This project should be restarted by Gov.