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Friday, March 20, 2020

Revisiting Mountain Warfare & Learning From Past Experiences

1965 & 1971 Period
Saga Of 7 Guards Battalion
Centrifugal Multi-Directional Attack Concept
Limited, High-Intensity Mountain Warfare Under Nuclear Overhang In 1999
Within the Indian Army’s HQ Northern Command, a committee headed by the then Chief-of-Staff of the Command, was constituted in 1999 to examine the planning and conduct of OP Vijay and collate all in-theatre battle accounts. However, this commuttee neither had access to any data concerning the planning and conduct of OP Safed Sagar from the Indian Air Force, nor was it able to interview any IAF officers. Similarly, any data concerning the the Indian Navy’s OP Talwar was unavailable to this committee. Moreover, this committee’s report has not been disseminated within the larger military community of India. Even today, the operational commanders who fought the war have rarely been invited to staff and war colleges, to discuss the broader lessons. And to top it all, India’s Ministry of Defence till this day refuses to publish the official history of this limited but high-intensity war. Consequently, what follows below are the best-available authoritative data collated from a variety of published sources over the years.
Lessons For Infantry
Perfidy At Turtok
Lessons For Field Artillery Fire-Assaults
Lessons For Rotary-Winged Aviation Employment
Lessons For Ground-Based Air-Defence
Battlefield Communications Challenges
Battlefield Logistics & Combat Support Arms Imperatives
From the above, the following inferences can be drawn:
1) High-Altitude Mountain Warfare of the type fought by the Indian Army (IA) and Indian Air Force (IAF) since 1947 is distinctly different from Highland Warfare and High-Altitude Plateau Warfare—a distinction often ignored by many.
2) Consequently, all the preparatory operational protocols of both the combat and combat-support arms of the IA and IAF will have to originate from the experiences gained only by both these armed services, since no one else in the world has either the intent or will to engage in full-contact kinetic operations at such forbidding heights.
3) As a result of the above, no one else in the world will either develop or offer to develop the kind of weapons platforms, weapon systems and combat-support hardware that is required for warfighting in the unique high-altitude operating environment and areas. For instance, the thin air at such altitudes (between 14,000 feet and 18,000 feet) requires larger-diameter parachutes for paratroopers and this in turn creates a greater opening shock. It is more than 13 G in Ladakh when using the 26kg HAPP, whereas the maximum acceptable opening shock for US paratroopers is 10 G and for Russian paratroopers is 13 G. Similarly, since the service ceilings of attack helicopters like the Mi-35P and AH-64E Apache are 16,100 feet and 20,000 feet, respectively, such platforms will be able to operate with only minimal offensive payloads (like standoff air-to-surface PGMs) between 14,000 feet and 18,000 feet, while homegrown platforms like the LCH (with a service ceiling of 21,300 feet) and the LUH (service ceiling of 21,300 feet) too will suffer from similar performance limitations (contrary to what these two clowns would want us to believe here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fJY4bFF6yI&t=2s). In addition, the ever-present threat from shoulder-fired MANPADS will ensure that no rotary-winged flying platform will ever be able to undertake straffing runs against hostile infantry entrenchments in mountaintops and ridgelines located between 14,000 feet and 21,000 feet ASL.
4) This then presents Indian industry with both a unique challenge and unique opportunity for developing suitable innovative solutions for the captive markets in arenas like cargo-carrying VTOL-UAVs, VTOL-UAVs for CASEVAC, development of lightweight, modular helipads capable of accommodating LUH-type helicopters, development of lightweight helipad lighting-markers and air-droppable POL/water storage bowsers, etc etc.
5) For facilitating sustained battlefield logistics support and life-saving CASEVAC, enormous investments need to be made for procuring light single-engined, light twin-engined, medium-lift utility and heavylift utility helicopters. Likewise, similar investments are required for procuring heli-portable ultralightweight field artillery 155mm howitzers and heli-portable weapon-locating radars.
6) For providing immediate air-support from standofff distances at altitudes between 14,000 feet and 21,000 feet, the IAF will need to procure slower-flying platforms like the Hawk Mk.132, which in turn will need to be made capable of launching lightweight, small-diameter guided-/gliding-PGMs like the SAAW (modified for carrying bunker-bursting warheads). This is because past experience has repeatedly revealed (during both 1971 and 1999) that platforms like the Su-7BM, MiG-23BN and MiG-27M, due to their higher cruising speeds, take a considerably longer time to acquire their targets and have often have had to make multiple passes over their targets before locating them, which in turn had caused the hostile AAA assets to be activated well in time and with devastating effect.
7) The infantry needs to be equipped with new-generation extended-range, hand-fired munitions fired from presently-available grenade-launchers. Presently, low-velocity 30mm/40mm rounds with 800 metre-range can be fired from hand-held grenade-launchers or under-barrel launchers, while high-velocity round with 2km-range are fired from tripod-mounted manportable automatic grenade launchers. While Raytheon has already developed the Pike guided 40mm grenade round, another solution comes from DefendTex, whose Drone-40 is a low-cost, programmable 40mm munition that is fired from a hand-held 40mm launcher in order to get it aloft. To attain flight mode, it deploys four helicopter-style rotors to stabilise, move, and provide lift for loiter. It offers 12 minutes of flight time and/or 20 minutes of loiter time. Cruising speed is 20 metres/second and range at optimum speed is in excess of 10km. It will travel to a designated target zone that was pre-programmed pre-flight. Operators will be able to cancel and self destruct the D-40 in mid-flight using technology like directed Wi-Fi signals.
(to be concluded)

227 comments:

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Buddha said...

1st documentary movie on the origin of CCP virus, Tracking Down the Origin of the Wuhan Coronaviru
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Le_rfTdayLs

Tejas Titans: Tarmak Talking with superheroes of HAL's LCA Division
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pNwF4VDaj88

Aap chronology samajhiye: Did Trump arm-twist Modi on Hydroxychloroquine in fight against Covid-19?
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=aScreHmQmu0

Modi Govt unveils a containment plan for when lockdown ends & the Bhilwara Model it’s based on
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=UFSuxQhURuU

Kaustav said...

Prasunda

A very dubious contradictory article. But, could you spell out logically, if there are changes to be brought about by COVID-19. Iran seems to be in a tight spot though. BTW, I find it hard to believe that Gen.Sulemani mattered so much, that it could bring about policy changes?!

rad said...


HI PRASUN
how is the mesma or the future AIP scorpene rated against the swedish gotland class sub that reportedly sunk a carrier in war games.? The US was shit scared after that i heard thye leased one of them . Again they were unable to find the gotland sub.
NOw the scorpene is a much later design and our phospharic acid AIP is a gen ahead of the mesma AIP. If the stirling AIP sub can be so quite then theroticaly our scorpene equiped with our desi AIP should be better?
the australian collins class that was based on the gotland was not very much liked by the australians? and and have given the order to Naval group.
How do you rate the latest chinese sub wiht AIP that is going to pakistan /

Kaustav said...

The aforesaid dubious article
https://www.thehindubusinessline.com/opinion/why-india-is-distancing-itself-from-iran/article31272949.ece
Your views, rather analysis please?

Kaustav said...

Prasunda,

Fact of the matter being, even MK Bhadrakumar seems to be turning to a more logical way of thinking & suggesting that the existing Ghani & Abdullah combine led Afghan government can better handle the Taliban than by surrender to the Taliban. Infact, the Taliban seems to be between a rock & hard space with the US not exactly helping the Taliban out, while securing it's bases, interests & a safe exit for frontline troops.

Meanwhile, India seems to be playing it's cards very well,😆😆😆😆 Professor Trump can ofcourse put his threats up his....👍 Although GOI has already made the exception & exports now allowed. Indian companies could actually make money from misconceptions. BTW, that was a media speculation & circus with POTUS merely replying to a question. Meanwhile India & PM MODI gets praised by POTUS as well as Brazil Pres. who praises & compares to Hanuman on Mahavir Jayanti. While every indication is, India has enough quantity of this, not so useful, drug, if needed inspite of criticism. https://theconversation.com/a-small-trial-finds-that-hydroxychloroquine-is-not-effective-for-treating-coronavirus-135484

Irrational behavior won’t help India reduce poverty but actually it's a chance for India to profit. A democracy, India will speak in many voices, all aimed at securing it's interests. Ofcourse, Govt of India continues to maintain good Economic & Diplomatic relations with PRC - Hindi Chini Bhai Bhai 😉 India looks forward to benefits from PRC🙏

PRC Arrogance & anti-Indian feeling can't really be suppressed with the Chinese irritated at the Calls to Boycott Chinese Products by Indians as it seems to be seeking “scapegoat” for India’s ineffectiveness in containing COVID-19.

https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1185003.shtml

I would be obliged, if you could express your opinion on the above two matters with respect to India's International Strategy both in near neighbourhood & with the world at large.

Anonymous said...

America has long relied on Pakistan for military and intelligence support in the War on Terror, but relations have grown increasingly frayed and may be approaching an open break. What could this mean for continuing American military operations in the region?
-CC Fair

asd said...

Dear Prasun,

1. When will IAF start getting Super Sukhoi? How will it turn the tide in favour of India. Please enlighten.

2. How will IAF fare against PLAAF in its current form?

Ashish Gautam said...

https://twitter.com/Amitraaz/status/1247886670139015173?s=19
Do you agree with this guy? Are we gonna get rifle with changes he mentioned? If yes then why?
Why not orignal Russian version? That seems better...

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To AMIT BISWAS: For the first 20 SP-series Tejas Mk.1, the subsonic underwing fuel tanks will have to be carried along with a centreline supersonic fuel-tank in the belly & this in turn will obviously lead to decreased warload & combat radius if the aircraft is operating from air bases in the hinterland, like Ambala or Jamnagar or Kalaikunda. If on the other hand the first 20 Tejas Mk.1s are to operate from forward air bases like Leh, Phalodi, Halwara, Adampur, Bhisiana, Amritsar, Hashimara & Awantipora for either tactical interdiction or defensive counter-air missions, then they will not be reqd to carry the 2 subsonic underwing fuel tanks. For the 20 FOC-standard Tejas Mk.1s, existence of inflight refuelling probes mandates the availability of IL-78MKI AAR platforms in order to do away with the external fuel tanks. If such platforms are not available, then these FOC-standard aircraft too will have to use the 2 subsonic external fuel-tanks. If the 40 Tejas Mk.1s or even the projected 83 Tejas Mk.1As are fully armed for air-to-ground strikes, then they will not be able to engage in air combat unless they first dump their external ordnance & the fuel tanks in order to achieve appreciable thrust-to-weight ratios. But thos principle applies to all other MRCAs as well.

As for the GSH-23 cannon, yes it has been installed on SP-21 Tejas Mk.1, but that means only structural integration. Next, electronic integration will need to be achieved by firing the cannon at sea-level, medium altitude & high altitude in order to perfect the ballistic tables & guage the recoil forces on the airframe. Onlt after all such data-points have been obtained will it be possible to programme the weapons-management/control computer & optimise the related HUD display symbology. This process will take at least 12 months, since static ground-level firing trials began in Nashik only last February.

To RAD: The BMD-configured S-400 LR-SAMs are not part of the package sold to China. That’s why China continues to procure the homegrown HQ-9 & HQ-22 SAMs as substitutes. The guy from Karnataka had predicted the pandemic 8 months ago & had also stated that it will end by May 28 this year. China is already facing the world’s collective wrath & this can translate into positive news for India, if one goes by this:

https://theprint.in/opinion/in-corona-crisis-lies-indias-opportunity-to-make-huge-economic-gains-jayant-sinha/396698/

MESMA AIP is a highly mechanical system prone to equipment malfunctions. All types of existing AIP modules offer decreased acoustic signatures while the SSK is submerged. The China-developed AIP module uses the Stirling Engine operating principle.

To ASD: 1) By late next year, if the contract is inked this September. 2) IAF will overwherlm the PLAAF since the latter can operate from only 3 air bases located in TAR, whereas the IAF has the luxury of operating from 8 air bases facing the LAC.

To ASHISH GAUTAM: Woh bullshit failaa raha hai. The AK-203 is so good (so is the AK-101) that when during its in-country firing trials, it was keep under marshy soil for 6 hours & then retrieved & fired, its performance became even better (in fact I had a good laugh on this incident with a senior IA officer now attached to the OFB’s OF Amethi during DEFEXPO-2020)! Back in 2004 I had personally fired one such AK-101 as well when it was being demonstrated to the Royal Malaysian Navy’s PASKAL special operations unit in the mangrove marshlands of Lumut along the Melaka Straits.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To KAUSTAV: A lot of behind-the-scenes parlays are always going on between India & Iran, which never comes out in the public. For instance, India is actively helping Iran with medical aid (Iran already is one of India’s biggest export markets for generic drugs). As for Chabahar Port, Iran needs it far more than India, since Indian wheat shipments to Afghanistan take place only 4 times a year & hence that same consignment can also be airlifted to Afghanistan. But it needs to be stated that for both China & Iran, the ongoing global pandemic is a definite regime-wrecker.

India’s regional & international strategy is elementary: at the SAARC & BIMSTEC & GCC levels, extend all forms of aid & cooperation to friendly countries while at the international level, just flow with the rising global anti-China tide. India will most likely support Taiwan’s re-entry into the WHO at the UN. If India’s industrial infrastructure & innovations can meet all the hardware & medicinal reqmts of friendly SAARC & BIMSTEC & GCC member-countries, this will go a long way in cementing India’s assured entry into the UNSC as a permament member with veto rights, especially if China is to be sidelined for the crimes against humanity that it has committed. Already, as one can see, in Nepal China is attracting increasing hostility by the day & China too has stayed away from supplying any kind of credible humanitarian/medical aid to countries like Myanmar, Sri lanka, Maldives, Mauritius, Afghanistan & Nepal. I would also add that with each passing day as India’s industries reorientate themselves to mass-produce the much-needed hardware essentials, the Central Asian Republics too will look to India for assistance & succour. This kind of soft-power will pay enormous dividends in the weeks, months & years ahead, especially over the next 3 years. Hence, all in all, this is India’s moment to chart forward an ambitious but credible roadmap ahead for increasing her sphere of influence in a highly positive manner (unlike the Chinese BRI’s much maligned mercantile approach) with the help of sympathetic sentiments from the US, EU, the UK, Taiwan, South Korea, Japan & Australia, as all these countries too will look toward India as the springboard for reaching out to the central Asian Republics, the BIMSTEC m,ember-states & also all other littoral states within the IOR.

In the military sphere, India needs to ramp up her logistics sustainment capabilities & capacities to cover the regions under her sphere of influence by acquiring at least another six C-17A Globemaster IIs to add to the 10 in service, no less than 12 MRTTs (For heaven’s sake don’t buy brand-new airframes, but buy second-hand & hardly-used A330-200 aircraft that are available in plenty now at rock-bottom prices), procure the 4 LPHs based on Navantia’s design that L & T will licence-build, as well as order at least 20 additional C-130J-30 Super Hercules transports (and forget procuring the C-295 STOL transports as HS-748 Avro replacements) & up to 40 more CH-47F Chinook utility helicopters & the additional 57 Mi-17V-5s.

Abir said...

https://www.3dprintingmedia.network/3d-printed-spare-parts-indian-navy/amp/

rad said...


Ho prasun\
can you confirm if the scorpene with the indian aip will be as stealthy or better than the gotland class?
regarding the chinese airfields in TAR, as you state they are at a disadvantage due to elevation , so they will never fight against an equal of superior force .Mao it seems said atack indian with 3:1 ratio only. He knows how indian soldiers are . Given that what would be the most probabale way to attack indian airfields - missile strikes?
Is there a chance of the hq-22 beng given to pak to counter the s-400?
i am amazed at your connections as you were there at a malay paskal base during demo . especialy you being an indian.
you indicated that the LCA has to carry subsonic tanks to do CAP. but from allrecords and test pilots it seems to have a decent unrefuleled range thanks to the ge 404?
On which lca series will the f414 engine be fitted?
Is the dare MAWS trying to be integrated on the su-30 ,? the drdo web site indicates so ?

Is it worth while making the ak-203 india for bill$ when it can be imported from russia directly at half the cost , just like the su-30 saga?.This added wihth the risk of OFB making substandard guns inspite of TOT?





AMIT BISWAS said...

Any chance for chinooks to carry out operational and tactical level flying from and to INS VIKRAMADITYA or INS VIKRANT?? I mean during HAID mission or moving big logistics to ships while on sea..navy may use chinooks??

Technology, Photograpy and Travel said...

dada,


Few inputs on the way to build a national corpus for such calamity and how to provide ways for strategic production of goods and services and other important things during such calamity times ?

VIKRAM GUHA said...

PrasunDa,

(1) In this piece related to the recent incident in Kupwara, Lt Gen Syed Ata Hasnain says that Indian Army/SF should adopt the 2015-16 model that focused on shallow IA/SF infiltration to target installations in near vicinity of the LoC discounting deep movement to the hinterland. Do you believe this model is effective today ?

https://www.rediff.com/news/column/kupwara-encounter-why-army-is-watching-the-loc/20200408.htm

(2) Some commentators suggest that the Indian state actually allows Pakistan to exist because it serves as a utility for the Indian state. Pakistan is held as a major existential threat to Indians by New Delhi so that in turn Delhi can effectively rule the country. Is this true?


Thank You

VIKRAM

Murthy said...

https://theprint.in/opinion/in-corona-crisis-lies-indias-opportunity-to-make-huge-economic-gains-jayant-sinha/396698/

if some one is writing this for a university assignment they would have got failed with out doubt. Writing an essay or an article that is full of sweeping statements is a disaster both at academic level and professional level. One is expected to build a case by researching appropriate data, analysing trends taking various stake holders, parameters and other strategic things into account and concluding the summary is the better way. But the author repeated the question many times and it formed an answer and spewed on us. One wonders why we are still developing world.

Ayush said...

Dada, where will the money for the military hardware you mentioned come from? Especially in this difficult time when government will probably cut down on defence spending?

asd said...

Dear Prasun,

I have been harassing you by asking questions after on the performance issues of Tejas aircraft. Please forgive me for the last time.

1. What's the utilities of the first tranche of 20 Tejas Mk1 aircrafts, which are devoid of Gsh-23 gun, no ASPJ, no MAWS? IAF could have rejected it outright.

2. In case of Tejas Mk1A still you had alloted 6 in scale of 10 (in my earlier question) despite the fact that it's going to have ASPJ, could be pylon integrated MAWS. What else does it need to satisfy the requirements of IAF? Your view please.

3. In some queries, you responded that ASPJ can't be integrated with all the crafts ( that's why Abhinandan's MiG-21 couldn't jam the incoming missile) as it's expensive( I think so; not certain). Please enlighten me.

joydeep ghosh said...

@prasun da

1. if not China as long as Russia is there nothing can happen to Iran, your view?

2. how come russia allowed US system on russian subs like periscope?

3. it seems both WHO and its chief are chinese stoges?

4. not just in defense but health also the responsibility is with health secretary like defense secretary (health minister udhao only secretary holds meeting briefing during china virus lockdn), seems our politicians are adapt at skirting responsibility ?

5. when will recism against people of north east will end?

thanks

JOydeep Gosh

Pratap said...

Prasun sir, will the companies moving out of China shift to India? It is easily said than done. American companies will surely go back to US given the anger in Washington. Even European companies would go back to their countries. So even if GOI projects India as an alternative the chances are slim. But South Korean and Japanese companies can be persuaded. Govt will hopefully work in this direction.

hoods007 said...

Hi prasun

Now that SANT is being developed with MMW seeker, are there any programs to equip LCH with MMW radar?

Technology, Photograpy and Travel said...

Dada,

If u get time to post some thing on the SR72 program would relieve the stress

Sudipta Pathak said...

Sir,
When China is not honoring the one India policy why are we still stuck to the one China policy. A clear message should be sent to them that we might retract from our stand on one China policy if they do any drama regarding Kashmir in UN or protest our politicians visit in Arunachal Pradesh.

1. What will be the global impact if India unilaterally recognize Taiwan as an independent democracy and setup diplomatic relationship?
2. How shall China react?
3. What will be the real negative/positive impact on domestic economy?

Thank You
Sudipta

Karnflakes said...

Looking at Russias response at the UNSC... It seems the havoc that this pandemic has unleashed on its traditional rivals is too good of an opportunity for Russia to mould the zeitgeist to her liking. It seems when nations start choosing sides India will be on the opposing front to her old friend.

Anmol Chaudhary said...

Hi Prasun.

1. Please do share, to whatever extent you can, how India's response to the SFs' killing is looking / going to look like.

2. Once things worsens and social unrest sets in (though I pray it doesn't), if the army is called in to impose curfew/order, it will be easy for disruptive elements to contaminate one or more of the personnel deployed, which will then go back to their unit/barracks and risk exposure to others. While yes the forces have deployed certain protocols within their unit premises, are they prepared to be deployed outside while mitigating the risk (of contamination).

Take care. Thanks.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SUDIPTA PATHAK: 1, 2 & 3) How can India unilaterally take such a step? It won’t have any impact. Unless India is joined by the US, EU, the UK, Japan & Australia, to name a few.

To HOODS007: No, the LCH won’t have any radar for target acquisition.

To PRATAP: MNCs relocate only when their destinations are business-friendly. On this score, India lags far behind even Vietnam. Hence, unless structural economic reforms are carried out, no MNCs will relocate to India. They would rather go to Vietnam & The Philippines & Indonesia.

To JOYDEEP GHOSH: 1) Has Russian support for Iran prevented the latter’s economic collapse? Is Russia buying Iranian crude oil & gas? Has Russia been able to prevent the deep slide of Iran’s currency? 2) Whenever such SSKs need to go to Russia for mid-life upgrades & refits, such periscopes will be reqd to be uninstalled by the IN. 3) That is evident by now. 4) Only after this viral pandemic have people in India begun talking about BIO-SECURITY. Previously they were all clueless about this topic. 5) Only after existing mindsets change for the better.

To ASD: 1) Those SP-series tejas Mk.1s can still be upgraded during their mid-life fetit schedules. 2) Had explained it all several times before. 3) Of course ASPJs can be integrated with any combat aircraft. In case of the MiG-21 Bisons, the IAF decided against equipping all its MiG-21 Bisons with EL/L-8222 ASPJs.

To AYUSH: There’s plenty of money available, especially after the decreases in world crude oil prices. Money spent on combatting the viral pandemic will not exceed Rs.5,000 crore.

To VIKRAM GUHA: 1) The fllowing thread will answer your question. 2) Not true, rest assured.

To AMIT BISWAS: Yes, the CH-47Fs can operate from any flat-top vessel.

To TECHNOLOGY, PHOTOGRAPHY & TRAVEL: Beofre creating any such corpus, let the GoI first build a state-of-the-art crisis management centre of the type existing in countries like Taiwan & Saudi Arabia. Here is the latter’s centre:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rfeB51z3sb4

And see the human traffic at the Torkham border crossing in Pakistan:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3a-H0OH_Q0

German Air-Ambulance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hEQ44JpWjBg

To ANUP: Of course it is possible, provided India becomes as business-friendly as Vietnam.

To RAD: The AIP-equipped Scorpene SSKs of the IN will be as good as any other AIP-equipped SSK. Since China lacks state-of-the-art MRCAs capable of terrain-hugging flight-profiles, the PLAAF will have no other option but to use BMs for mounting offensive strikes against India’s ground infrastructure, including air bases & ALGs. That’s why LR-SAMs like S-400 & XR-SAM are reqd in large numbers for the IAF. HQ-22 is still not comparable to the S-400. It still suffers from certain performance deficiencies. As I explained before, if the Tejas Mk.1 operates from forward air bases like Pathankot or Amritsar or Awantipora, then it will not require any external fuel tanks. F414 turbofan will go on the MWF, not on any LCA. Not the DARE-developed MAWS, but the AAR-60 MILDS-F MAWS from Germany’s Hensoldt. Any licemce-built piece of hardware will always be more expensive than procuring the same hardware directly from the OEM.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SUDIPTA PATHAK: This will answer most of your questions WRT China:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysxfxS7lyUM

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