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Thursday, July 16, 2020

PLAGF's Gameplan In East China Sea


In January 2019, the People’s Liberation Army’s (PLA) Academy of Military Science’s Deputy Director Rear Admiral Luo Yuan had proposed that the PLA seriously consider sinking two of the US Navy’s aircraft carriers. This would, according to the Rear Admiral, resolve the dispute surrounding both the East and South China Seas by sending a message to Washington regarding the dangers of militarily provoking Beijing in East Asia.
Rear Admiral Luo had then referred to “five cornerstones” of possible US weaknesses, noting: “What the US fears the most is taking casualties.” Referring to the PLA’s high-end anti-ship missile capabilities, he noted that sinking at least two US Navy-operated aircraft carriers would lead to losses of several thousand US servicemen—a cost no US government would be willing to tolerate. Rear Admiral Yuan indicated that China’s growing and formidable arsenal of new anti-ship missiles, which are designed to and capable of bypassing a full carrier strike group’s defences, would be able to cause considerable damage to hostile warships in the East or South China Seas. “We’ll see how frightened America is,” he had said. Elaborating on the reasons for his proposition, Rear Admiral Luo said that China had to “use its strength to attack the enemy’s shortcomings. Attack wherever the enemy is afraid of being hit. Wherever the enemy is weak, just focus on developing (an advantage).” 
Eighteen months later, as the US Navy’s two carrier battle groups, centred around the aircraft carriers USS Nimitz and USS Ronald Reagan, have been conducting military exercises in the contested waterways of the South China Sea since early this month, the PLA Navy’s (PLAN) two aircraft carriers—Liaoning CV-16 and Shandong CV-17—are both holed up at Dazhu Shan, 30km southwest of Qingdao in Shandong province, and in Dalian—while the PLA Ground Forces (PLAGF) are reportedly gearing up for invading the Taiwan-owned Pratas/Dongsha Islands (20 41 11.12 N, 116 47 17.00 E), which comprise one island, two coral reefs and two banks, and are located about 170 nautical miles (310km) southeast of Hongkong SAR.
And entrusted with this tasking is the former Nanjing Military Region—which on February 1, 2016 was re-organised as the Eastern Theatre Command, and which commands amphibious mechanised units that are now subordinate to the PLAGF’s 71 (in Zuzhou, Jiangsu province), 72 (Huzhou, Zhejiang province) and 73 (Xiamen, Fujian province) Group Armies (GA). Each of the GAs is made up of six Brigades.
And maintaining a daily vigil along the eastern and southern coastlines of China is a Northrop Grumman E-8C Joint Surveillance Target Attack Radar System (Joint STARS) of the USAF, which has been flying daily from July 12 out of Okinawa, Japan.
Within the PLA, it is the PLAGF’s amphibious assault forces that are tasked to invade and occupy “big island” targets, with the PLA Marines being tasked to invade and occupy the smaller shoals and reefs. The PLAGF’s amphibious assault forces will deploy from vessels like the PLAN’s six Type 071 landing platform docks (LPD), Large Landing Ship Tanks (LST) and Zubr hovercraft; as well as PLAGF-owned LSM craft. They will also take advantage of high-speed mobility offered by Z-8 heavylift helicopters (and escorted by WZ-10 attack helicopters) and in the form of Combined-Arms Air-Assault Battalions, conduct reconnaissance, small-scale raids, infiltrations, and special operations attacks (against the entrenched Taiwanese coastal defences comprising both field artillery assets and anti-ship missile Batteries) through vertical envelopment. In terms of island-landing operations, the PLAGF forces will play the role of a first-attack force that operates inside hostile or contested territory, with the Mechanised Combined Arms Amphibious Brigades providing the main external attack force.
The PLA’s amphibious landing operations concepts are focussed primarily on “attack on main targets” (zhongdian daji), “three-dimensional landing” (liti denglu), and “deep strike” (zongshen). The focus is on landing from multiple sites and launching mobile raids—and this is a mode of operations that takes advantage of high-speed seaborne and airborne transport platforms to conduct raids over all types of terrain and at multiple sites.
Still, conducting a simultaneous airborne and seaborne invasion is easier said than done, and speed and the consequent tempo of operations will of absolute essence. Therefore, to reduce mobilisation time, the PLAN has sited its Zubr hovercraft base directly to the west of Pratas/Dongsha at Zhanjiang, while a PHL-03 long-range MBRL Regiment has been positioned to the south on Hainan Island (for being ferried to Pratas/Dongsha on short notice).
In addition, at Danzhou on Hainan Island, the PLA Rocket Forces (PLARF) has created a new storage facility (under Base 62) for housing the 624 Brigade’s DF-26 intermediate-range ballistic missiles, which are armed with EMP-generating warheads and are meant for launch in the direction of any inbound carrier battle group, so as to deny them their network-centric war-waging capabilities.
In addition, the PLAN has inducted into service up to two mobile landing platforms (MLP) for ferrying heavier warloads. At a July 10, 2015 ceremony at the PLAN’s Zhanjiang Naval Base in Guangdong province, the 868 Donghaidao, a 50,000-tonne displacement MLP with a giant staging platform installed at its waterline, was commissioned into service. This MLP can accommodate a wide variety of hovercraft, helicopters, fast-attack craft and armoured fighting vehicles. This MLP was launched by Huangpu Wenchong Shipyard and is a 33-metre by 120-metre submergible platform that is large enough to carry up to three Type 726 hovercraft.
Possible Retaliatory A2AD Options
To neutralise the seaborne threats from both the PLAN and PLAGF, Taiwan’s republic of China Navy (RoCN) in the 1990s itself developed and procured the homegrown 400km-range Hsiung Feng-III (Brave Wind) supersonic anti-ship cruise missile, which can be launched from both warships and land-based wheeled TELs. 
However, no air-launched variant of this missile was developed. Instead, the Republic of China Air Force (RoCAF) opted for the 200km-range, turbofan-powered Wan Chien (Ten Thousands Swords) standoff air-launched cruise missile (similar to the Raytheon AGM-154A JSOW), which was declared fully operational in August 2018.
Japan’s Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, on the other hand, completed the development and testing of its air-launched ASM-3ER supersonic anti-ship missile in 2018, following which it has been under series-production for Japan’s Air Self-Defense Force (JASDF). Under development since 2003, the ASM-3 is designed for launch from Mitsubishi F-2 M-MRCAs. The 200km-range ASM-3 has a top speed of Mach 3 and a 900kg warhead. 
Eventually, the JASDF will service-induct three different types of modern anti-ship missiles: the Raytheon-Kongsberg subsonic sea-skimming Joint Strike Missile (JSM) for the F-35 JSFs, the subsonic 800km-range Lockheed Martin AGM-158C Long-Range Anti-Ship Missile (LRASM) for the upgraded F-15J/DJ H-MRCAs, and the ASM-3ER for the F-02 M-MRCAs.
Looking to the future, Japan’s Acquisition, Technology & Logistics Agency (ATLA) has started developing a hypersonic multi-role missile for attacking both warships and ground-based targets. Development work began last year and is due for completion by 2030. ATLA is currently in the development phase of the scramjet engine along with Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, which won the contract for prototype engine R & D. The missile will be powered by a dual-mode scramjet engine (DMSJ), a combination of ramjet and scramjet (supersonic combustion ramjet) engines, to fly at a wide range of speeds, including hypersonic speeds of Mach 5 or even Mach 15. The scramjet engine is expected to have high engine efficiency in a wide range of speeds because the air inhaled from the intake is compressed and combusted at supersonic speed when the missile is flying at Mach 5 or higher. That means that the scramjet engine would be needed accelerate the missile to hypersonic speeds to operate, and that would require acceleration by a rocket booster. However, a large rocket booster would be required to accelerate to hypersonic speeds, which would increase the overall length of the missile, including the booster.
Therefore, ATLA plans to combine the capabilities of the ramjet engine, which operates efficiently in the Mach 3 to 5 speed range, with the scramjet engine (DMSJ) being used to reduce the proportion of the rocket booster. In this way, the rocket booster only needs to accelerate the missile to supersonic speed, and from there, the ramjet engine accelerates the missile to hypersonic speed, which then activates the scramjet engine to cruise. ATLA is now working with Japan Aerospace Exploration Agency (JAXA) to realise the DMSJ. According to the ATLA, the hypersonic missile can cruise at high altitudes at hypersonic speeds while manoeuvring, making it difficult for hostile air-defence systems to intercept it. Both RF and IIR seekers will be used to identify targets, and its warhead will of the high-density explosively formed penetrator-type (EFP) for penetrating hardened targets.
Rise Of The Supersonics
It may well sound surprising, but it is a reality that the Indo-Pacific region today plays host to the largest number and types of supersonic anti-ship cruise missiles (ASCM), be they air-launched, sea-launched or ground-launched. The former USSR was the first to induct such missiles into service in the Far East, with the 4.5-tonne Raduga P-270 Moskit being fielded since 1981. This 120km-range ASCM had a speed of Mach 2.2 and carried a 300kg warhead. It was only in the late 1990s that this missile was exported to China.
This was followed by the 3-tonne NPO Mashinostroyeniya-developed P-800 Oniks/Yakhont in 1987. It had a speed of Mach 2.5, range of 600km and carried a 300kg warhead.
In early 2011, eight such missiles were delivered to the Indonesian Navy, while the Vietnam People’s Navy (VPN) in 2013 procured from Russia two Batteries of the K-340P Bastion-P land-based coastal defence systems that came along with 40 Yakhont ASCMs for its 681 and 682 Brigades, and EXTRA projectiles from Israel Aerospace Industries for its 685 Brigade. The 150km-range EXTRA has a CEP of 10 metres. Vietnam occupies about 24 islands and reefs in the Spratlys, including islands close to China’s reclaimed bases on Subi Reef and Gaven Reef.
The second country to introduce supersonic ASCMs into service in the early 1980s was China’s 1.85-tonne YJ-1/C-10—manufactured by the China Aerospace Science & Industry Corp (CASIC)—that had a 300kg warhead, a 50km range and a top speed of Mach 2. This was followed by the 3.4-tonne HY-3/C-301 with 180km-range, a 500kg warhead and Mach 2 speed. Both types of ASCMs used liquid ramjets and were used only for coastal defence.
India became the third country to field supersonic ASCMs since the year 2000 onwards when her navy first procured the 1,951kg Novator 3M54TE Club warship-/submarine-launched missiles from Russia that has a 220km-range, 200kg warhead and a top speed of Mach 3. Following next in 2003 was the 3-tonne BrahMos-1 with a 300kg warhead and a speed of Mach 2.8.
Next was Taiwan, which in 2007 began using the 1.5-tonne Hsiung Feng-3 ‘Brave Wind’ ASCM, which was developed by the National Chung-Shan Institute of Science and Technology (NCSIST). The missile used a solid fuel main booster with two side-by-side solid-propellant jettisonable strap-on rocket boosters for initial acceleration, and a liquid-fuelled ramjet for sustained cruise. Its maximum range is 200km, while its speed is Mach 2.5 when armed with a 120kg warhead.
The first supersonic ASCM using integral solid-propellant ramjet propulsion that is now entering service in the Far East/East Asia is Japan’s 900kg Mitsubishi ASM-3, which has a 200km-range and a top speed of Mach 3.
The second such supersonic ASCM to enter service was the YJ-18 (a clone of the 3M54TE), which has a 537km-range when armed with a 300kg warhead. The YJ-18’s turbojet engine is capable of flying at a cruise speed of Mach 0.8 for about 180km and after that point the warhead section separates and a solid rocket engine ignites allowing a top speed of Mach 3 for about 40km.
Another such ASCM now being developed is the HD-1A by its developer Guangdong Hongda Mining Company.
China’s 2.5-tonne liquid-fuelled YJ-12/CM-302 ‘Eagle Strike’ missile, which has a 400km-range, a 205kg warhead and a top speed of Mach 4.

75 comments:

asd said...

Dear Prasun,

What's your view on rear admiral Luo's opinion that China can sink aircraft carrier of USA? I think it's just bombastic word bites.

Buddha said...

What if china able to knock US carriers then US probably hit china with its full might and fury..
Has CPC calculated such risk of its SCS misadventures...
Though it is acknowledgeable that China has developed well strong force for invasion but risks are too high to go for such adventure...

Unknown said...

Prasun Da

https://www.theengineer.co.uk/royal-navy-autonomous-minesweeper/

Is this useful to Indian Navy?

John

VSJ said...

Hope you are well.

1) How efficient are carrier oriented naval fighters from land? I am talking basing nlca mk2 and additional mig29k and few brahmos A capable sukhois off A&N command in future, few brahmos batteries, barak8.
With data sharing from quad that will create three chokepoints to cover entire chinese maritime trade at lesser cost than INS VISHAL.

2) WRT to your prev post seems like Chinese mech divisions are fundamentally better equipped than ours due to force multipliers like Namica equivalents and humungous short range air defense, artillery detachments which we deploy at corps level.
Mixed arm divisions aren't novel and we have RAPID types too but hanging on namica, artillery and integral air support. Is that advantage overwhelming if it wasn't mountains?

3) Can chinese be diverting to make a run at Bhutan? The country has way to less forces to hold considering the length of border they share with Tibet far away from Sikkim and Arunanchal tri junctions.
What are our options to protect them?

Wouldn't it be prudent to coerce them into expanding upto 4-5 mtn bgds with integral 105 mm and 130mm artillery, L70, zsu23, manpads from donations etc plus 1 commando battalion, few battalions of border patrolling force and a militia brigade.
All this just to hold any advance till we can arrive.

4) Brits sailing into scs soon, is a quad plus alliance already marching for war without formation of an alliance officially?

Thanks

panic said...

China (Communist Party of China) has become a "Monster" which India alone can't tame period.
China knows it very well.
Unlike India, China smarts from its mistakes.
Don't you think China will come back with a crippling and bigger surprise?
India's mad rush for weapons makes feel so.
I guess, China wants a military victory (Trophy) to show case it to its tamed citizens.
Taiwan seems to be prepared , but an attack is imminent.

just_curious said...

Prasun,

why did India never seriously retaliate to cpec passing thru GB/PoK and break away from 1 china policy inspite of blatant transgression & multiple other provocations like stapled visas etc.. recently read that Modi has appointed an envoy for Taiwaan .. this after some cabinet ministers attended the swearing ceremony of the Taiwanese PM in the recent past.. Are things changing now?

Ankit Kumar said...

How effective is a light tank useful in our context with respect to China? I thought along the LAC wherever tank battles were possible, we had brought our T72s and T90S. If wherever tank battles might be possible, we already have MBTs, then why waste resources on Light tank?

Arpit Kanodia said...

Sir, isnt it CHinese underestimating US too much, Japan also made the same mistake in ww2.

asd said...

Is it true that IAF is going to sign the contract for 83 Tejas Mk1A with HAL in December?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ASD & BUDDHA: That depends on what kind of tactics are employed for such attacks. The Soviet/Russian & now PLA’s thinking is that a series of atmospheric EMP blasts will knock off the network-centric early-awrning capacity of a carrier battle group, following which successive salvoes of supersonic ASCMs can be fired from the land, sea & air. Back in the mid-1980s it was the case that a salvo of 24 Raduga P-270 Moskits were reqd for breeching a carrier battle group’s air-defences. But today, with advances in ASCM interception technologies like high-power laser effectors, the number of supersonic ASCMs reqd for successfully targetting a carrier battle group has gone up exponentially. Another tactic involves the data-linking of supersonic ASCMs while in flight, especially the submarine-launched ones, in such a way that if the first 3 ASCMs are knocked out by air-defences, then the follow-on 3 will take their place & this sequence will be repeated for all the 24 ASCMs either get intercepted or at least 3 of them manage to get through & hit the aircraft carrier.

To UNKNOWN/JOHN: Yes, it is but these are only for minesweeping, and not for mine-hunting, for which MCMVs are reqd as well. The MCMV can then also function as the mother-vessel used for controlling the unmanned, remote-controlled minesweepers.

To VSJ: 1) The efficnency is directly dependent on the target acquisition aspectsfrom the air through LRMR/ASW aircraft & UAVs. If a MRCA is to be used for target search, then it will be an unsuccessful endeavour. With the inking of a LEMOA-type agreement with Australia, IN’s P-8Is can operate even out of Christmas Island south of Sumatra to keep a watch over naval movements transiting the Sunda & Lombok Straits. 2) What the IA needs are MBTs re-engined with 1,000hp/1,300hp engines for greater power-to-weight ratio, BMPT-type vehicles & LCHs for working in tandem for supporting the MBTs, and tactical UAVs. 3) Bhutan can easily be protected by the IA & contingency plans also exist for enlisting the help of US Marine expeditionary Forces for such tasks. 4) Yes, there indeed is a very strong case for the U&K & even France joing such an alliance.

To JUST_CURIOUS: 1) Nil, because India has already zeroed in on the BrahMos-2 from Russia. 3) Such such funds only small arms & ammunition can be bought, nothing else. 4) The protest was lodged yesterday with the Pakistan Foreign Office. 5) Not reqd, since India herself has failed to utilise all her share of the waters. 6) Only SSNs will be reqd from now on. No need for any further SSK procurements. 7) No conformal antennae reqd for Super Su-30MKI. Such antennae will be reqd only for those MRCAs that have wedge-shaped nosecones like that of the Su-57 PMF/FGFA or the AMCA. Tejas Mk.1 FOC deliveries are slowly picking up. 8) They were always meant only a harassment attacks. In any case, Naila Qaadri early this week told an Indian TV channel that the Govt of India had refused to support the Baloch freedom movements. 9) Those are for long-term hydroelectric projects. 10) Nothing will change unless & until all the DPSUs are subjected to govt divestments.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

The RAT: Of course the PLAN has chosen the path of discretion & hence both its aircraft carriers are homeported & are not out at sea. Launching saturation ASCM attacks requires lots of networking of the type the PLAN has yet to master. Shaurya is a tactical ballistic missile.

To ANKIT KUMAR: No one wants Light Tanks, kindly rest assured. Today when the IAF’s C-17 Globemasters can airlift out to Ladakh MBTs like T-72CIA, T-90S or even Arjun Mk.1A, the reqmnt for light tanks simply don’t exist. Today the firepower of a BMPT-type vehicle is far greater than that of an AMX-13 light tank. Instead, what is reqd are MBTs with 1,300hp engines (for T-72CIA & T-90S since additional ERA tiles have increased their weight) so that they can have a power-to-weight ratio of at least 25hp/tonne, which is what the PLAGF’s ZTQ-15 tank boasts of. And accompanying such MBTs must be LCH-type attack helicopters armed with AGM-114 Hellfire-type ATGMs & BMPT-type fire-support vehicles & only behind all these will come the BMP-2 ICVs.

ZTQ-15 MBT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkIdOQ5q_ew

ZBD-04A ICV: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eIiQ0wBtlGA

To ARPIT KANODIA: What worries Beijing the most are the US Navy’s operational fleet of SSNs in the Western Pacific & that’s why the US DoD had stated early this month that all SSNs under the Indo-Pacific Command are out at sea on operational patrol.

To ASD: Well, if we are to go by HAL’s statements, then a confirmed order for 83 Tejas Mk.1As is still quite some time away. According to HAL, it is still awaiting the order for 18 tandem-seat LCA Mk.1 FOC operational conversion trainers. HAL will be reqd to roll out a functional Tejas Mk.1A prototype before any production contract can be inked.

Meanwhile, here’s the latest round of ‘bandalbaazi’ from the ‘desi patrakaars”:

https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/how-pla-war-gamed-on-huge-ladakh-model-inside-china-1701299-2020-07-16

ASccording to them, the 1:500 scale terrain model measuring 800 metres x 700 metres was built in 2004 for preparing for initiating the latest standoff along the LAC in 2020! The existence of the terrain scale-model was revealed here:

https://virtualglobetrotting.com/map/aksai-chin-terrain-scale-model/view/google/

It is located at Huanyangton village near Yinchuan in Ningxia (38 15 56.22 N, 105 57 3.71 E) & contrary to popular belief & needless speculation by certain dubious satellite imagery interpreters, the terrain-scale model was built not for attack or campaign rehearsals, but for fine-tuning the optronic & SAR payloads of UAVs that were then under development in China & which were meant for use in the Aksai Chin area.

And here is another piece of disinformation dished out by the same TV channel:

2nd Consular Access: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXiCkzZgFQQ

In reality, this was the 1st-ever consular access. Previously, access was granted only to the mother & wife of Kulbhushan Jadhav, while the Indian High Commission official J P Singh was kept confined behind a glass panel in a separate room & he only had a visual glimpse of Jadhav.

Lastly, these very 3 ‘desi patrakaars’ some 4 years ago were predicting the acquisition of Heron-TP UAVs & now they are doing the same WRT the General Atomics Reaper:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyPeDlKnwtQ&t=128s

It gets even more hilarious: they are now claiming that such UAVs will be ‘autonomous’, and they will be able to get inside hostile airspace for undertaking SEAD missions!

And this channel must have read this thread yesterday & decided tgo do this story:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pHq6KBYFevA

JASDF ASM-3 Test-Firing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsdgfD5ZtzY

Millard Keyes said...

"accompanying such MBTs must be LCH-type attack helicopters armed with AGM-114 Hellfire-type ATGMs & BMPT-type fire-support vehicles & only behind all these will come the BMP-2 ICVs."But will they? There is still zero high mobility capability and not even considered, LCH is still awaiting weapons integration and series production, a mere 22 Apaches, NO BMPT type vehicle- not even contemplated as yet. It seems GOI thinks all that is needed to overwhelm China is Air power and Air Superiority hence always talk about new planes. I think GOI feels IA would not have much success against China so they keep the IA Pak centric and feels IAF is the trump card in defending any Chinese invasion. How else do you explain no addition of transport aircraft beyond the few from the US, no LUH, no attack helicopters and gun ships in greater numbers, no APC, No BMPT type fire support...the list goes on.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ARPIT KANODIA & SUMANTA NAG: Soldiers of Tibet Military District Complain About Lack of Winter Clothing, Habitat Deficiencies:

http://www.81.cn/jmywyl/2020-07/16/content_9854320.htm

According to these senior retired IA officers, their interactions with their PLA counterparts revealed that the PLA's senior field commanders think only at the tactical-level like the IA's junior command officers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xH6EBRJ6Hs&t=6s

Huawei Is Small Potatoes Compared To Taiwan's TSMC:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/georgecalhoun/2020/07/12/5g-risk-huawei-is-small-potatoes-compared-to-tsmc-who/#420907ca765c

http://www.cescube.com/vp-understanding-chinese-communist-party-s-ccp-psychological-warfare-institutions-and-strategy-adopted-against-india

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

This is what an island-wide anti-invasion drill is all about:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYGfIEgmO7s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTwPBod9qNE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1F9k_LGzcc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcMR2ZCcheI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S30JGcYnakg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WTl0GBvQku0

Brig John Parashram Dalvi’s Son: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFykkyrI6qQ

Lt Gen D S Hooda on LAC Standoff: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhUO6Bu5e48

Unknown said...

Is the Indian 14 Division a RAPID or Infantry and 10 division is it also RAPID?

joydeep ghosh said...

@prasun da

1. why is China so interested in pushing its hand into every country's behind?

2. from the things i figured Galwan Valley and Pangong Tso lake are the actual 2 oints from which IA can launch strike into Aksai Chin and Tibet, which is why China is hell bent on denying India access to these 2 places DBO is almost entire under chinese arty range so it cant be used for aby offensive by IA?

3. is it correct there exist air launched land attack variant of Novator ASCM?

THANKS

Joydeep Ghosh

Anonymous said...

1. You say T90 and T72 should have 1250/1300 hp engines. But HVF Avadi has facility only for variants of V46 (780 hp) and V92 (1000 hp).
Should not MoD then have also considered higher power engines for high altitudes ? Did Indian Army not push for it ?

2. As far as light tanks are concerned GoI had approved 350+ T90 tanks during 2012 itself. So why this discussion now ? I thought armies make a strategy not have one to one weapon comparison.

3. How many Namicas have been delivered, they too can be deployed together with T90 ?

Regards
Venky



Vector said...

Would it make sense for IA to invest in developing something like a heavier & optionally manned version of Ripsaw M5 ? To counter Type 15s ?

Ankit Kumar said...

India had under 3 deals (310 T90S, 330 T90S and 347 T90M) bought TOP tanks along with licence to produce 1000 more tanks upto 2020, which the Avadi factory due to slow production and other problems didn't manage, resulting in India buying another extension of licence upto 2028.

Can you
1. Give a breakdown of total number of T90 tanks which Army eventually aims to operate.

2. What are the different variants in service. Is the latest order for 464 tanks for T90 or the latest T90MS version.

3. Do we have a upgrade program to improve its protection by adding latest generation ERA and a passive/active protection system?

And a final one on Arjun. DAC had cleared 118 Arjun Mk1A tanks, what's happening to those? And will Arjun MK2 be a reality?

সুমন্ত নাগ said...

Thanks Prasun Da, for the links, yes it's the fact that Psychological War of PRC gets easier when the utopian, shameless, paid Fifth columnists exist in our countries, in form of (pseudo) 'careerist liberals(dhandabaazs)', ultra radical left intellectual(highly irrational, brain dead weed smoking communities) , certain political parties with ties in PRC, and leaders with lack of common sense present across all political parties almost, in addition to literate but gullible public, along with dumb journalists, the public, even don't know the difference between PRC and Taiwan, they tend to discard Taiwanese goods as bad Chinese goods, We can see the hankering for PRC originated electronic gadgets in e commerce platforms, with a buying spree, even not bothering whether those Chinese vendors may even provide after sales services in the present scenario of trade war and economic condition of China, when there are other options available, people tend to paint Chinese(PRC) as 10 feet tall, when in reality they are cunning lilliputs.

A. After reading Forbes article can it be concluded, that in the face of US trade onslaught all the Chinese vendors as well as those companies like Realme, Xiaomi, OPPO may suffer also, if US policy runs longer.

B.
Kindly also, please share your views regarding the article,

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.wionews.com/world/india-not-a-part-of-chabahar-zahedan-project-iranian-official-313841/amp, is it true that India was not part of Chabahar Zahedan Railway project ?

C. What's your view on media report on review of Sri Lankan Govt. Of Indo Japanese investment in Colombo Port amidst labour and employee agitation, can Chinese hand be behind it, and Chinese port deal with Greece, amidst anti Chinese sentiments?

i. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.orfonline.org/expert-speak/srilanka-review-india-role-colombo-port-terminal-work/


ii. https://m.shippingwatch.com/article/12286172 & https://splash247.com/china-merchants-cosies-up-to-thessaloniki-port/


Please share your views, thanks in advance.

Anonymous said...

@Prasunda

1. It would not be prudent to forget that the Chinese have always been an expansionist imperialist power. A quick glance at China's history would bear out the same and it would not be wrong to assume that the Chinese, if given an opportunity would gobble up the whole of Asia or half of the globe. Therefore, any behind the scenes politicking or diplomacy under the impression that the Chinese are serious about permanently settling its border disputes with India, or that the latest Chinese machinations are to get parliament resolutions empowering border negotiations would be extremely dangerous. Indian politics don't work that way, and nor does China. I wonder what is giving credence to such tomfoolery? The Chinese are capable of unforeseen brutalities and massacre, but more importantly are willing to sacrifice and persevere for hundreds of years, if need arises, in expanding their territories and ensuring their geographical continuit, besides strategic objectives.

2. With the decaying and stagnating West, Beijing senses an opportune moment to announce itself before the world. And it surely has its sights on its prey- a weak and timid India which can be nipped in the bud. An India which pussyfoots against a failed state like Pakistan cannot be hoped to match up with a power like China. The Chinese are apt in insisting on psychological weaknesses of a nation-state. In our case, it is a comatose strategic decisionmaking apparatus which lost all the time in ensuring a tit-for-tat with the Chinese, despite global sentiments being at all time highs against China.

3. It would so appear that we have done a tight embrace with the US. One would have hoped not. Realpoliticking is foolish in that it doesn't really understand the civilizational forces and battles at play. There are wheels within wheels for sure, and yet all of this is undergirded by civilizational vectors. The American prog-lib model is an affront to this great civilization of ours and unfortunately, any embrace with US will exact its civilizational costs on us.

4. On the operational front, can we ensure a rigid defence against Cruise Missile threat profiles stacked against us? How would we bring down the numerous NLOS-BSMs and IRBM/Tactical BMs which are aimed at us?

5. What does it take to beat F-22/F-35 like stealth strike packages in terms of an IADS? In the Airspace how can we hope to neutralize similar stealth platforms in air to air engagements?

Regards,
Abhishek

sandeep said...

Hi sir
Is there any role for close air support fixed wing aircraft in high altitude warfare ... Why is India not purchasing such aircraft ... Can Tejas be modified for anti armour role ..

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To UNKNOWN: 14 Division WAS a RAPID. It has since been converted into a Mountain Division. 10 Division remains a RAPID as its main responsibility is the Chammb sector in Jammu.

To JOYDEEP GHOSH: 1) maybe because those countries have left their respective behinds wide open & exposed. 2) Wrong. It is Panggong Tso & Depsang Plains. The Galwan River-Valley’s best entrance is from its southern end, which is where Gogra/Hot Springs is located. That’s why in the late 1960s when both the IA & PLAGF created their respective posts there, they both entered from the southern end. And that’s why when the PLAGF first wanted to enter the River-Valley this time & advance towards PP-14, it first decided to block the River-Valley’s southern entrance by setting up blocking positions in Gogra/Hot Springs. 3) here they are:

3M-14AE: https://www.key.aero/sites/keyaero/files/comment_forum/2014/02/09/3m54ae.jpg

3M-54AE: https://www.ausairpower.net/V-MF/3M54AE-Canister-MAKS2007-1S.jpg

To VENKY: 1) 1,300hp engines & related gearboxes can always be installed on existing T-90S MBTs, just as Russia has done by upgrading its existing T-90S to T-90M standard. 2) Those were all rumours & the IA never even considered procuring any light tanks. Russia had offered the T-90MS but with a 1,130hp engine back in 2012 & a T-90MS was even shown at the DEFEXPO-2012 expo. But the IA wanted a MBT with greater power-to-weight ratio & hence was willing to wait for the definitive T-90M that the Russian Army eventually ordered in 2017. The T-90M was promised for delivery by Russia to India in the 2020-2021 timeframe & that’s why the IA delayed placing its order for 464 T-90M MBTs. The level of protection of the T-90M has been improved to defeat kinetic threats capable of penetrating 1,300mm and shaped-charge threats penetrating up to 1,350mm of rolled homogenous steel (RHS). Developed by the Yekaterinburg-based Uralvagonzavod JSC, the 46.5-tonne T-90M Proryv-3 boasts of a power-to-weight ratio of 26hp/tonne, thanks to its uprated V-92S2 engine rated at 1,300hp & developed by the Chelyabinsk Tractor Plant. The main armament is the 125mm 2A82-1M cannon (same as that of the T-14 Armata MBT). It uses Relikt ERA tiles, along with a soft-and hard-kill active protection system (APS), which is similar to the Afganit system installed on the T-14 Armata. The T-90M also has the Kalina hunter-killer all-digital fire-control system that also has an automatic target-tracker. Here it is:

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-mkrE170Yz4w/XgeHhGv2LsI/AAAAAAAAPDg/VR_qHu1Ms8kB-Pl8o4gfqDCY3Dv247rBACLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/41ca7e1aa23e62cdf641fcbd23cc31be.jpg

3) Had they been delivered, the DRDO & OFB would have had a grand public ceremony on their rollouts & they would have been publicised. Since that hasn’t happened, it means none of the NAMICAs have been delivered as yet.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ANKIT KUMAR: 1) All the numbers are mentioned here:

http://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2018/12/24-arjun-arrvs-being-ordered-from-hvf.html

2) T-90MS has been superceded by the T-90M version, which the IA will be procuring. 3) Yes, for both the T-72Ms & T-90S. 4) The production indent for Arjun Mk.1A has already been placed with HVF Avadi. Mk.2’s development is now underway & the hulls & turrets of four prototypes, each made of HNS, have already been delivered to CVRDE at Avadi for electrical/accessories outfitting & systems integration. By using a Cummins 1,500hp engine, the desired power-to-weight ratio of 25hp/tonne will hopefully be realised if the MBT’s weight is kept limited to 61 tonnes.

To VECTOR: No. Just install 1,300hp engines on existing T-90S MBTs of the IA. Light Tanks are reqd only if they are to be air-dropped or air-transported by aircraft smaller than the C-17 to high-altitude areas. Since the IAF’s C-17A Globemasters can ferry medium & heavy MBTs to anywhere along the LAC (except Sikkim), the need for procuring light tanks does not even arise. As for Sikkim or Bhutan, the roadways there are now easily able to sustain land transportation of medium/heavy MBTs by trucks pulling tank transport trailers. In addition, all existing limited-load Bailey Bridges in Jammu, Ladakh, Sikkim, Uttarakhand & Himachal Pradesh are being swiftly replaced with permanent bridges made of concrete, which will enable the smooth road transportation of the heaviest loads of the IA. And in Arunachal Pradesh, the thickly forested hilly terrain prevents the usage of practically all types of armoured vehicles, barring perhaps 4 x 4 LAMVs. So once again, the IA does not need light tanks & has never asked for any, nor will it ask for it. Don’t fall for all the mischievous rumour-mongering by the band of discredited ‘desi patrakaars’.

To SUMANTA NAG: B) Neither India nor Iran has said anything as yet on the future status of the railway line & hence it will be foolhardy to speculate. Instead, better to focus on factoids, which state that India continues to ferry supplies of perishables to Afghanistan via Chabahar, as explained here:

https://twitter.com/India_in_Iran

C) I see no need for India to invest in such projects abroad since India can very easily, through dredging, create her own deep-water port at an offshore reclaimed area in southern Kerala. In fact, the ADANI Group is building one such port at Vizhinjam:

https://www.vizhinjamport.in/aboutproject.php

To ABHISHEK: 3) There’s nothing wrong with a tight embrace with anyone for as long as you emerge with what you wanted. Such a tight embrace with the US has always been the ground reality because even during the days of the Cold War, India’s military always sent their officers to the US & UK (and not to the USSR) for higher command training, while the DRDO sent their engineers & ‘scientists’ there oo for acquiring greater knowledge & skills. Even today, the US, Australia, UK & perhaps Canada remain the principal destinations for Indian students seeking higher education avenues, while only about 10,000 of them end up in Kunming & Xinjiang for acquiring medical degrees. 4) The IA & IAF have adequate counter-force strike capabilities through their BrahMos-1 NLOS-BSMs & SCALP ALCMs launched from Rafales. This alone will deter China from using its SS-BSMs & TBMs against India. In addition, quick-reaction solid-fuelled SS-BSMs like the Pralay need to be deployed as soon as possible for replacing the existing liquid-fuelled SS-150 Prithvis. 5) Any IADS can be crippled & paralysed through innovative tactics & weapon combinations. For example, for both SEAD & DEAD, combinations of EMP-generating SAAW & RCS-mimmicking SAAW can be used for decapitating & deceiving hostile early-warning sensors & then destroying them with NG-ARM/Kh-31P PGMs.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SANDEEP: It is the terrain that dictates the usage of weapons platforms. For instance, in the thickly forested areas of J & K & Arunachal Pradesh, target location will be very difficult by any type of aircraft & such aircraft will also become vulnerable to shoulder-launched MANPADS salvoes should they decide to reduce their cruise speed. But over barren desert-like terrain like that in Ladakh & to the north of Uttarakhand & Sikkim, aircraft like the Jaguar IS/DARIN-3 & even Hawk Mk.132 can have a field day by dropping bombs laden with sensor-fuzed sub-munitions & explosive cluster munitions, provided tactical air superiority is achieved through SEAD/DEAD missions of the type I have described above. Especially vulnerable to air-attack is China’s Tibet-Xinjiang G-219 Highway, which meanders through the Kuen Lun mountain range before entering Aksai Chin:

https://live.staticflickr.com/2887/32983229570_13bf865594_b.jpg

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/WXqkQALLPKA/maxresdefault.jpg

To RAD: Looks like the Barak-MX SAM family is a further evolution of the Barak-8 family & now features mid-body fins:

https://www.iai.co.il/p/barak-mx-system?utm_source=defense_update&utm_medium=banner&utm_campaign=always_on_global_2020&utm_content=300x250-barak_mx-en-matah;ad=471921456;creative=134961518

https://scontent.fccu2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/105393429_591935911743863_4372030147374519773_n.jpg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=MjMNtfbBRHIAX8P9yP2&_nc_ht=scontent.fccu2-1.fna&oh=c8525a818e446a490741812acf06a5aa&oe=5F385316

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbdeCujiiz4

Am also wondering why the ADE not get its hands on all the decommissioned Sea Eagle ASCMs & try to come up with an upgraded ‘desi’ version of such an ASCM:

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_44d3OT-xI3U/Sqbda_Cu9lI/AAAAAAAABB8/d3q0qwim934/s1600-h/10+Sea+Eagle.jpg

PramodW said...

Prasunji,
1) From what you have shared regarding the composition of Chinese forces in ladakh, they have assembled a truly fearsome force especially opposite depsang. How can we counter such a force? Is it even possible to do so?

2) Are you confident of the IAF achieving Air superiority against PLAAF over ladakh?

3) Is the iaf capable of overcoming china's formidable s300/400 Air defenses? Have they any plans for doing so or rehearsed them?

4) How many regiments of t90 and t72 have we got in ladakh at present?

5) How many Indian army infantry divisions are currently deployed there?

6) Do you believe there will be hostilities next month between India and either of her two neighbours in ladakh /kashmir?

Thanks

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

In addition to the Beretta .338 Lapua Magnum Scorpio TGT and the Barrett .50 M95 sniper rifles, the IA's Para SF has also acquired the SAKO TRG-42 from Finland & Protective Helmets from the US:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EdHvXDfU0AACU88?format=jpg&name=large

SAKO TRG-42: https://cdn1.sako.fi/sites/default/files/TRG-42_Tech_specs.pdf
https://cdn1.sako.fi/sites/default/files/TRG_FoldingStock2.pdf

Exfil High Cut Ballistic Helmet: https://www.teamwendy.com/products/helmets-accessories/helmets/exfil-ballistic-sl

Rudra SWI in Ladakh: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EdH3KL6UcAA98we?format=jpg&name=large

Snow Eagle, Snow Wolf, Snow Fox, Snow Mastiff Militias of TMD:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ANIgs9IA6g

VN-1 8 x 8 Assault Vehicle: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BY31BVRctp0

PLAGF LY-80 MR-SAM: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1lpjhSlCAoI

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Underwater Scooter, or diver propulsion vehicle, seen at in this video at 00.08.59:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAmAsyVgpC8&t=20s

These were bought from Italy-based SUEX (https://www.suex.it/prodotti.php)

To PRAMODW: 1) Of course. They have very long supply-lines all the way up north from Xianjiang via the G-219 Highway & these can easily be cut off. 2) Yes, both numerically & qualitatively. Those LR-SAMs are located at Ngari, Shigatse & Lhasa Gonggar airports. 4) One entire Brigade. 5) Three. 6) The possibility exists. Especially along the LoC.

Anonymous said...

In thickly wooded sectors, it makes sense for IA to have Jeep mounted 120 mm mortars /105 mm gun.
Also the light artillery that Gen Rawat wanted when he saw Kalyani offering.
Nothing happened to it, whose issue is it , Army (release RFP) or MoD ?


Regards
Venky

Millard Keyes said...

T-90M Proriyv https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPlzjVwtE9Q

Pinkal Shah said...

Dear Prasun,

Greetings of the day!!

Actively following your blog for wrt High altitude warfare coverage & analysis since March'20

1) What is status of IACCS/AF-NET for IAF, Has is deployed across whole indian land mass or only few nodes are operational.

2) Heard last ear that bengaluru IACCS node as operationalize, does it also covers radars from Indian navy as well as civilian ATC.

3) What is status of HSL build DRDO VC-11184 Ocean Surveillance Ship for tracking missiles

4) Any update/progress regarding procurement of MCMV for Indian Navy, is the absence of dedicated MCMV vessels hampers IN ORBAT & War preparedness.

5) Any update on shore based El/M-2248 radar near eastern coast announced two years ago.

6) Kindly share status on SU-30 MKI upgrade program, looks like it is delayed due to fund crunch or is there any other reason.

7) Is delivery of HSL build Indian Navy Swimmer Delivery Vehicle completed.

8) Whether procurement of MRSV-LPD for Indian Navy is scrapped. Will there be any future progress on this type of requirement.

9) Any update on DRDO Technology Demonstration Vessel by CSL for IN, when is induction planned.

10) How would you rate out of 10 wrt Network-centric capability of Indian armed forces wrt Chinese/Pakistan armed forces. Also provide IN, IA & IAF inter-operability in terms of network warfare in present day.

Thanks & Regards,
Pinkal Shah

Vector said...

With the given host of Supersonic Weapons Assets in the west asian region , what merit does Brahmos 1 bring to table. Few defense analysts touts Brahmos as our go to solution even for taking out S400s. Doesnt china have such equivalent capabilities . Are we not putting too much faith in Brahmos's capability ?

সুমন্ত নাগ said...

Thanks for bringing clarity in the matter Dada, seems to me that reckless speculation by media may some time cause embarrassment for the Government,and reader like me sometime becomes needlessly apprehensive due to it.

সুমন্ত নাগ said...

Prasun Da, in your blog , http://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2016/10/gloves-are-finally-off-against-those.html?m=1
You have opined for 120 mm Breach Loading Morter Carier, using available T 55 Hull, is IA considering any option for procurement of the same or any ready made solution from overseas ? Or local vendor ?

https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-n14a2SaB-tU/WBFBfiKAKbI/AAAAAAAAL00/Y9LTooOshd8qKOARi0CsZ7x68rHeqRE9ACLcB/s1600/T-55%2Bhull%2Bwith%2BAMOS%2B120mm%2Bbreech-loading%2Bmortar%2Bturret.jpg

Thanks.

Rocky said...

Hi Dada,


Sorry for diverting your attention to different direction. But as you see economic situation is getting bad day by day. Dada are we heading to situation similar to great depression of 1929or its passing phase which will go in 6 to 8 months.


Thanks & Regards,
Rocky

Ankit Kumar said...

The Eastern Air command was supposed to have its own Tanker and AWACS squadron. But there's no urgency on it yet. Are we waiting for a Chinese misadventure in NE to procure them as emergency procurement?

mg6357 said...

Hi Prasunji,

1. As you said to Ankit Kumar that, the development of abut 4 prototypes of Arjun MK 2 is well underway, could you please make a thread on it or can you guide us to your previous threads of Arjun Mk 2 ?

2. Russian Tanks work with 3-man crew while western tanks work with 4-man crew. Similarly Arjun tank works with 4-man crew.

Is there any specific philosophy behind operating 3-man or 4-man crew for tanks ?

3. What are the advantage & disadvantages of using 3-man against 4-man crew for tanks and vice versa ?

Thanks & Regards,
MG6357

joydeep ghosh said...

@prasun da

1. your views on this https://www.indiandefencetimes.com/how-china-is-at-a-great-disadvantage/

2. you said China is planning a invasion of Taiwan island . if it does for sure it will be punched out by USA but i fear this will make the panda more belligerent towards india

3. the swimmer device you talked abt it seems is brand new, didnt the MARCOS have these earlier? i remember watching TV series in 80s 90s about sea exploration there i had seen many divers using these

thanks

Joydeep Ghosh

joydeep ghosh said...

@prasun da

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alfBF3h1VLo

this link says 1 more C17 can be readied for delivery, India should grab this chance it cant let go

thanks

Joydeep Ghosh

Pratap said...

Prasun sir,

1) Are these 464 new T-90M tanks in addition to 1600 ordered earlier? So IA will have a total of 2000 T-90 MBTs?

2) Has Russia completed the development of the 2 new hypersonic missiles that are part of our S-400 deal?

3) When can we expect order for second tranche of Rafales?

4) What configuration of Sig 716 have we procured? DMR or Patrol? What's the difference between the 2?

5) What's the reason behind delay in Ak-203 project? Is the second batch of Sig 716 a result of delay in procurement of AK-203?

6) Is India working on hypersonic glide vehicle like Avangard? Do we need such a weapon?

7) Is IAF buying the 90 km version of Barak 8 like IN and IA? Or the 150 km ER version?

8) Any forward movement on Mountain Gum System procurement?

Karmic said...

Does India has any defense against EMP blast if carried out from China side. Does India has any emp capability?

Mohan said...

Prasun sir,
Does f-35 irst range is 1300km? As given in Wikipedia:https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/AN/AAQ-37?
What is su-30mki irst range?
Does russian developed such long range irst?
Regard

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VENKY: This what is reqd: https://www.patriagroup.com/newsroom/patria-magazine/case/nemo-hits-by-surprise

As for the MGS, this is what is reqd, but the IA has not yet acted pro-actively:

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-xCPfMiyXbmQ/XkIIcgRB4GI/AAAAAAAASjg/dFQYpXTg1oErbOLX-RsYaKVx_aPTi7hXgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Kalyani%2BGroup%2527s%2BMGS%2BPoster.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-tDWORLF29Ik/XkSifcToihI/AAAAAAAASpI/6q0a_PjtTmUSt7Cv3TjmOEKUBwRzeSvRgCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Z-7.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-oT8ABaGSwes/XkIIgJoYBqI/AAAAAAAASjs/Kc-id5YTAyQcM7AUilMXj3-HJMTUlhC8wCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Kalyani%2BGroup%2527s%2BMGS-2.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-xwBCgwdcNO8/XkIIegAQbuI/AAAAAAAASjo/4dVssLPpJ1IK3L6HD4j-mQ--SxvtzAWugCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Kalyani%2BGroup%2527s%2BMGS-1.jpg

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-TYX6t5UoHrM/XkIIiBz8n6I/AAAAAAAASjw/yT-Ww2pOGIUBqwCUYZNMM5F_Bup0cC3JwCLcBGAsYHQ/s1600/Kalyani%2BGroup%2527s%2BMGS-3.jpg

To MILLARD KEYES: https://www.smh.com.au/world/asia/rundown-of-china-s-spy-agencies-will-make-uncomfortable-reading-for-some-20200713-p55bhs.html

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9Z3O8u2HWg

To PINKAL SHAH: VMT. 1) Yes, it is fully operational in its complete form. 2) Not IACCCS node, but the joint ATC system that combines air-traffic management data from both civilian & military radars. 3) It is still undergoing fitting-out at the wet basin. 4) None whatsoever. 5) None whatsoever. 6) It is not delayed, but is ready for takeoff. 7) Orders were never placed. 8) Not scrapped, but postponed. 9) Nothing new has happened. 10) Indian NCW capabilities & capacities are are far ahead, rest assured.

And do watch this: https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7uys5r

Do you reckon something similar might be happening over Ladakh, given the increased air activity in that area?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VECTOR: Yers, both side have equivalence in terms of precision-guided firepower & that’s why deterrence will hold, since China does not want to see all its land & rail transportation infrastructure to get destroyed by Indian fire-assaults.

To SUMANTA NAG: That’s the AMOS system from Finland’s PATRIA, which can easily be installed on both the Kestrel & T-55 tank hulls. Meanwhile, the best data on what’s more reqd to be done in Ladakh, why customised air-defence solutions are reqd & how can ISTR capabilities be improved was explained by ret’d Lt Gen Devraj Anbu (former VCOAS of IA) here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wa_Yvqz6EvM&t=49s

To ANKIT KUMAR: No such reqmt ever existed. Airpower by definition is omni-directional & hence airpower asstes cannot be divided theatre-wise. Instead, the IAF should be re-organised to have Air Combat Command, Combat-Support Command, Air Transportation Command, Maintenance Command & Training Command. And all its existing regional theatre commands should be merged with the IA’s existing theatre commands & then it will be realised that the reqmt for joint service theatre commands in peninsular India is far lesser than it now being made out to be.

To MG6357: 1) Here it is: http://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2018/06/given-below-are-weblinks-of-show.html 2 & 3) The Soviets & Russians prefer 3-man crew because of manpower limitations (they still have the military consription system), just like France & China.

To JOYDEEP GHOSH: 1) Don’t you think China is already aware of all this & therefore it deliberately decided to set up camps in those areas which wre only India-claimed, and not India-controlled? 2) China is not planning to invade the island of Taiwan, but the Ptaras/Dongsha island that is Taiwan-controlled. 3) Those are dual-use items used for commercial diving purposes as well. Their naval term is ‘Diver Propulsion Device’ & the IN had issued an RFI for it back in late 2010.

To PRATAP: 1) Not in addition, but a part of the total MBTs of the T-90 family of MBTs that India had contracted for. 2) Yes. 3) Not this financial year, that’s for sure. 4) The DMR (assault) version. 5) It is all about the unit-price & how many are to be ordered & for which end-users. This involves a lot of negotiations between the MoD & Union MHA. 6) No. 7) No, only the 70km version & 150km version. 8) None.

To KARMIC: Yes.

To MOHAN: The data is wrong. IRST can offer HD imagery only out to a max range of 70km on the F-35. The Su-30MKI’s IRST has 40km-range while that of the Su-57 has 70km-range.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To PINKAL SHAH: This is what a BMEWS looks like:

https://defpost.com/raytheon-awarded-9-million-in-support-of-qatar-early-warning-radar-qewr/

And this is probably for obtaining RCS-related & IRST-related target acquisition/identification data:

https://theaviationist.com/2020/07/17/satellite-image-shows-chinese-j-20-mock-up-at-marine-corps-auxiliary-landing-field-bogue-in-north-carolina/

3rd ~ EyE said...

Has IA ever tried to reckon Kalyani Group and TATA's Contribution ? It seems IA's adoption of home grown tech is deliberately kept low !

Millard Keyes said...

Great link that Prasun thank you- already knew this just told me the agencies and their names :) By the way what exactly is a Mountain Gum System? is it laid like mines for enemy soldiers to step on and get stuck or is it a type of chewing gum you chew on to ease pressure on your ears? (ref to Peratap)

Anonymous said...

Prasunda,

It appears as though Covid cases are decreasing in Pakistan, while they continue to increase in our country. How is Pakistan managing better without a lockdown ? Their positive to tests ratio (with a low number of tests) is 7% now. It was 20% a short while ago. Ours is continuously at around 10%.

Satyaki

rad said...

hi prasun
can you confirm if the aesa radar has been mounted on the super su-30mki prototype?
Is the aesa radar imperative to fire the air launched brahmos given its range of 550 km?
why did israel develop a version of the narak8 so soon even when the production is just taking off?. is there some thing sub optimal?.
The mid body wings offer more manouver ability definately. but mind was puilled towards using the MX as a long range AAM. seems perfect?wiht a 200km + range ?
i wonder if the LCA can carry such a AAM given its size?
Any news about the desi IRST that reports suggest ? is it not wise to partner a irst player rather than wait decades? as we dont have the basic hardware like the cooled sensor?
why are other gov so coy and scared to ban chinese apps, especially the western countries?
is india looked upon as a strong country after the galwan issue and banning chinese slowly?

i dont understand the policy of making the ak 203 in india apart from making it in india?
we can get it always cheaper form russia as out right sale ? and be safe from the vagaries of the OFB?
there was a lot of hype regrdingthe KALI laser project whats happening .This comes inot question after the chines reveal lasers to blind EO sats?



AMIT BISWAS said...

Your idea about IAF restructuring is way ahead of time...If IAF command structure is reorganised what will happen to SASOs, AOCinCs ...😀😀 they will be left jobless if army takesover the regional air command...will the air marshals let that happen??

সুমন্ত নাগ said...

Satyaki, they are low on testing also misreporting cases.

https://amp.dw.com/en/pakistan-coronavirus-testing/a-54221822

https://theprint.in/india/imran-khan-trolls-unfortunate-india-over-covid-surge-but-pakistan-conducts-21-fewer-tests/463898/?amp

সুমন্ত নাগ said...

I think Prasun Da has referred to Mounted Gun System.

https://www.army-technology.com/news/indias-ofb-beml-unveil-155mm-52-calibre-mounted-gun-system/

সুমন্ত নাগ said...

Prasun Da, in the meanwhile British Parliamentary Kashmiri ' Rights ' Group was sold for merely Rs. 30 Lakh.

https://youtu.be/UUqxMIBsf8U

DynaDemos said...

Prasun sir,can you explain what is transpiring between IRAN and China with the new treaty .Is India being kicked out of Chah Bahar port.

Kaustav said...

Dear Satyaki,

Don't believe anything coming out of Paxtan specually from the Paxtani Govt. It's a country that's done for. It makes little sense anymore to compare India with Pak anymore. But it's cases-per-million figure is 56% higher than India’s though hv 1/4th cases & 1/5 th deaths with a very very unreliable system of checks
https://theprint.in/india/imran-khan-trolls-unfortunate-india-over-covid-surge-but-pakistan-conducts-21-fewer-tests/463898/?amp&__twitter_impression=true

Parthasarathi said...

Prasunda,

Is it possible to install gas turbine engines for tanks which are deployed at Laddakh as dust particles are lesser ! The advantages are numerous. It will reduce the weight of the tank. Higher power and at last easier to start during cold climate.
There are numerous private sector enterprises can built small 1500 bhp gasturbine engine for military use. One is ABB at Vadodara workshop and second is Wartsila at New Mumbai. Gear can be made by Shanti Gears.
Best regards

Kapil said...

Prasun sir, you in a reply to PRATAP said that India has contracted for Sig 716 DMR variant. Other Indian defence blogs say that we have ordered the patrol variant. While according to this report Sig has confirmed that it has supplied the 716I Tread variant overtdefense.com/2020/07/16/indian-army-orders-more-716i-rifles-from-sig-sauer/

Anonymous said...

Prasunda,

My main worry was that covid cases have been rising for the past 3 months, with a 10-12% cases/tests ratio for quite a long time. Several other countries have only had short peaks. It seems strategically valuable entities like ISRO and DRDO have had to put all satellite launches/ missile tests on hold due to this. If this continues, we may even end up losing existing capabilities in these domains. At least these entities should have been kept fully operational. The US and Russia continue their launches even in the middle of the pandemic.

Satyaki

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To MILLARD KEYES: MGS is the same as motorised howitzer or truck-mounted howitzer. Just as foot-soldiers are also known as dismounted infantry & soldiers who are vehicle-borne carry out mounted operations in urban areas, or MOUT.

To SATYAKI: LoLz! Do you really believe all that’s being dished out by IAKN? China has already issued directives to its Pakistan-based citizens to take proper precautions, detyails of which can be found here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmLl3qVpJqY&t=1s

US Increases Deployment in Western Pacific:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQgUiHjIeOw

To RAD: The AESA-MMR will be mounted after the Super Su-30MKI is ferried to Russia, where the systems integration will take place. 90% of the radar sub-systems will be the same & only the programmable signals processor & the AESA antenna will be the new items. Everything else will remain the same as the existing PESA-MMR. BrahMos-1 land-attack version does not require any fire-control cues from any radar. Only the anti-ship version requires target acquisition/identification cues. Hence, the anti-ship version of BrahMos-1 will not be 550km-range & will continue to have 290km-range. It remains to be seen if the Barak-8s of the IN & IAF too will sport mid-body control surfaces in future. Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A will both eventually have Astra BVRAAM in future. No one is developing any ‘desi’ IRST sensor. Countries like Australia & Canada have huge Chinese populations that make use of Apps like WeChat & Weibo for communicating with their relatives on the mainland. KALI was a figment of imagination. There are varioius types of laser-based weapons in development, but KALI isn’t one of them, rest assured. And do watch these 2 documentaries:

PLAGF WZ-10: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J3Ijud-ekgY

German Rocket Project in Congo: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HB26MHTC3Xs

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To AMIT BISWAS: Eventually the IAF will have to bite the bullet since that is the only re-structuring & re-balancing option available to it.

To DYNADEMOS: No, not at all & everything now circulating about the 18-page strategic agreement is pure speculation.

To PARTHASARATHI: Everything is possible, but is it really reqd? Ladakh too is a desert area, albeit on a high-altitude plateau in areas closer towards Aksai Chin. ABB & Wartsila have 1,500hp engines but not the types ready for installation on MBTs. Hence, Cummins India & MTU remain the only worthwhile contenders for supplying 1,500hp engines along with matching automatic gearboxes. But the orders will have to be fairly large for achieving localisation of manufacture—at least 5,000 engines being the bare minimum. Hence, unless such engines are also selected for diesel locomotives or other heavy vehicles, domestic production of such engines can safely be ruled out. No one will set up a production facility for just 700 or 1,000 engines. No one else has done it in the world so far nor will anyone do so in future. It is all about the foundational economies of scale business concept.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Rudra WSI: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ONxWAKsCIWg

Why It Remains Unarmed: In 2002, in the backdrop of the Kargil war, HAL floated a competitive tender for an air-to-air missile and appropriate launcher for an under development iteration of the Dhruv, that would ultimately become the Dhruv Mk.4, then Dhruv-Weapon Systems Integrated (WSI) and finally, Rudra. Following a process that included technical and field evaluation tests, European firm MBDA’s Mistral missile was selected. In 2006, MBDA was awarded a contract to integrate and supply the air-to-air Mistral (ATAM) launcher. Integration of the ATAM launchers commenced thereafter on a number of airframes. In 2014, the government issued a request for proposal (RfP) for the actual Mistral missiles, a requirement of over 400 missiles to arm at least 50 Rudra helicopters. This was necessarily a single vendor RfP since the 2006 ATAM contract award was based on the Mistral being competitively chosen—the two go together, and the ATAM cannot launch a different weapon (the LCH airframes began getting their ATAM launchers in 2015). The procurement negotiations of the Mistrals remained stalled for over four years until July 2018 when the MoD summoned MBDA to inform them that their commercial package was simply too expensive. Faced with a demand for a discount, MBDA reworked its commercials, returning to the MoD with a lowered cost package in August 2018—an offer that stands valid till the end of June 2019. In August 2018, HAL ordered a second batch of an unspecified number of Mistral ATAM launchers for the Rudras it was continuing to build for the IA. The IA currently has nearly 40 Rudras across three operational squadrons, with plans to raise four more squadrons for a total fleet of 78 Rudras. The Rudras are almost entirely unarmed with rockets/missiles, and have the chin turret-mounted Nexter M621 cannon. The future of rocket fitments on the Rudras have also reportedly been imperiled with a steep escalation in the cost of its existing stub-wing mounted 12-tube Belgian FZ231 rocket launchers deploying 48 70mm FZ-90 unguided rockets, forcing the IA to look to the state-owned DRDO for a new rocket solution. Rockets and air-to-air missiles aside, the Rudras lack their most critical piece of weaponry—ATGMs. Despite a stated requirement for 124 ATGM launchers and 1,362 missiles from either MBDA or Israel’s RAFAEL for the PARS-L3 or Spike-ER respectively, there has been no forward movement. The HELINA has so far not attracted any orders from the IA. The DRDO says it is also developing a 12km extended range version called the SANT (stand-off anti-tank) for the Mi-35.

The Elusive ISTR Platforms: The first RFI was issued in 2006. The IAF again mooted its desire for a new SIGINT (Signals Intelligence) aircraft back In April 2012. It issued an RFI for nine seven aircraft for survey, target towing, COMJAM, and two platforms for and airborne SIGINT. Another RFI was issued on July 17, 2017. Five of the aircraft, the RfI stipulated, were to be configured for SIGINT collection and COMJAM, with two configured solely for SIGINT for the NTRO. Till today, the RFP remains elusive.

Buddha said...

Really sad state of Rudra WSI..
Does Similar fate awaits for army LCH .
Has DRDO been able to develop rocket launcher for Rudra WSI and LCH..And the guided and unguided rocket..
Is Rocket launcher of Indian retired aircraft like Mig 23/27/21 usable on the helicopter...
Indian defence industry and involvement of Army is confusing one and rudderless...
Is there any chance of arming them soon..
Thank you..
Stay safe ..In the onslaught of Covid 19....In India

joydeep ghosh said...

@prasun da

1. the way i see it India, Indian Army ad most importantly PM Narendra Modi have played into the hands of China, the wuhan/mahabilipuram, gandhinagar meeting all have put him in tight spot

2. your views on thi http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2020/07/rajnath-says-cannot-guarantee-full.html

thanks

Joydeepghosh

Arpit Kanodia said...

Sir why indian army till now not ordered Nag? It is too expensive or still problems persist in nag ?

Unknown said...

Mr.Prasun what happened to the armoured brigade of 14 Division?

Buddha said...

Sir
1. When do Indian Airforce get LRLACM.. probably not before 2025 and its smaller range version for aircraft like Tejas Mig 29
2 Bramhos NG air launch version seems not before 2025
3. What is the status of Indian anti-radiation Missile
4. Is SAAW going to be mass produced soon or it will face same trial test fine tune delaying conundrum..
5.What about other glided PGM like Garuthmaa, Garudaa are being developed...Are they being produced...

just_curious said...

Prasun,
1- can u pls share more details about the super sukhoi aesa radar.. like range & itx comparison with ibris-E su 35 radar
2= Will there be variants/ family of SAAW like rocket motor powered, 250 kg class ones with more power & range .. they cud become mini cruise missiles
3- abysmal state of affairs as your writeup shows on why LCH/ RUDRAS are still under armed.. 15 yrs and counting but its still not materialized.. is all the blame on babu incompetence or the forces also have their share of blame for incompetence or are they delayed by design for kickbacks? will anything change this is recurring trend going forward takng lessons from the recent clashes with china..
4- Pvt industry in lurch wrt small arms...http://www.indiandefensenews.in/2020/07/private-units-voice-concern-over.html. will private players like SSS & Bharatforge(F90) or PLR(Travor local manufacturer) survive with no visibility on orders? if not, then why would anyone burn their hands again going forward given the capital investments needed

SUJOY MAJUMDAR said...

Prasun Da, according to this report Russia has offered the Berezhok Combat Module for upgraded BMP-2. Can you please confirm if the Indian Army has accepted the Berezhok Combat Module? Thanks.

https://www.financialexpress.com/defence/potent-formidable-and-made-in-india-infantry-combat-vehicle-bmp-2-deployed-in-ladakh-region/2028008/

AMIT BISWAS said...

The service chief themselves are responsible...they should openly declare in media if they have equipment deficiency..afterall it is democracy to put pressure on govt and MOD...instead they put these in closed door meetings and result is infront of us , same as 1999

asd said...

Dear Prasun,

Please share your view on WZ-10. How is it going to fare against IA/IAF? Please enlighten us.

Unknown said...

Prasun Da

Why we are not interested in more Mi 26?. It's lifting capability is enormous.

John

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To KAPIL: This is correct: Indian Army has procured the 7.62 x 51 direct impingement 716i Tread, not the short-stroke piston-driven SIG716 G2.

To SATYAKI: In most other countries, lockdowns are striclt enforced & adhered to. There, one does not face law-n-order violations like mass reverse labour migrations. That’s what makes the difference. Civic consciousness/discipline is very low in India due to mass illiteracy & ignorance (especially among the literate & educated).

To BUDDHA: yes, both Rudra WSI & LCH are suffering from the same fate due to the adoption of SEQUENTIAL R & D processes, i.e. first develop the airframe & then weaponise it, instead of concurrently achieving both objectives. DRDO should have told as far back as 2004 to begin work on modifying the OFB-built 68mm unguided rockets (https://ofb.gov.in/product/products/product-details/rocket-68mm-he-) into 70mm rockets. Even OFB could have done it in-house if it was empowered to do so. But as expected, sound common-sensical solutions are always the hardest to embrace/adopt within the DPSUs & the DRDO. The same goes for the HELINA. I had warned as far back as 2007 that the 4 brear-mounted thruster rockets of the NAG will make iot absolutely impossible for the NAG to be helicopter-launched as it will damage the launch-helicopter’s cockpit section after missile-launch. The DRDO realised this only in 2011 & only by 2016 was a new solid-fuel rocket design without the 4 thruster rockets was ready for firing trials. Again, an enormous waste of time due to non-application of sound common-sense. And that’s also why the DRDO took the Varunastra autonomous HWTs for field-trisl to Kyrgyzstan instead of making use of the Panggong Tso Lake for such trials & tests. The IAF’s MiG-21s, Su-7s, MiG-23BNs & MiG-27Ms all fired 57mm S-5 rockets. The Mi-171s & Mi-17V-5s fire the S-8 80mm unguided rockets. 1) LRLACM has yet to be flight-tested with a ‘desi’ turbofan & therefore at best such LACMs won’t be available till the latter half of this decade. Again, an enormous waste of time because GTRE should have spent more time & resources (between 2007 & 2012) on developing the ‘desi turbofan for the LRLACM instead of splurging on the Kaveri. 3) It is still undergoing user-trials. 4) Yes, BDL will series-produce its variants. 5) All fancy names only, nothing concrete.

To JOYDEEP GHOSH: 1) ALL successive PMs (with the exception of those who had very short tenures) are to be held accountable, not just the present-day PM. 2) What that means is that China in 2020 has presented its latest perception of the LAC, superceding its previous perceptions of 1956, 1960 & 1962. 3) Lastly, thi8s is why many have been MISTAKENLY claiming thus far that post-2017 the PLAGF has 200,000 troops stationed in Tibet:

http://ajaishukla.blogspot.com/2020/07/border-dispute-china-has-over-200000.html

In reality, the total number of troops available to the entire Western Theatre Command (WTC) does not exceed 235,000 & consequently, those permanently stationed inside Tibet won’t number more than 80,000, inclusive of the BDR Regiments.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ARPIT KANODIA: Both NAG & NAMICA have been ordered. But their formal deliveries to the IA have not yet commenced.

To UNKNOWN: It has been redeployed to Sikkim as an Independent Armoured Brigade, just as Ladakh too has had such a brigade since 2014.

To SUJOY MAJUMDAR: LoLz! Those damned ‘desi patrakaars at it yet again!!! The BMPs were first deployed in Ladakh back in 1987 under OP KARTOOS. How the IA’s mechanised forces got inducted into Ladakh was detailed here:

https://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2020/05/what-has-plagf-learnt-from-dogra-gen.html

What is being offered as a retrofit kit was shown at DEFEXPO-2020 & it is TsNII Burevestnik's AU-220M turret with a 57mm cannon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=157&v=sfY6uI8EP2M&feature=emb_logo

To JUST_CURIOUS: 1) It was detailed long ago here: http://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2011/05/super-su-30mki-from-air-dominance-to.html 2) SAAW has multiple appllications both as a precision-strike PGM as well as an airborne decoy. 4) None of those private-sector companies are offering indigenously-developed solutions. All of them are foreign designs. They therefore should never have invested tgheir funds in such projects whether there never was policy clarity emanating from the MoD.

To AMIT BISWAS: All equipment shortages are always publicly reported by the Parliamentary Standing Committee on defence every year.

To ASD: The WZ-10 won’t be able to operate freely inside contested or hostile airspace, just like the AH-64E won’t be able to either. Hence, the IAF will be reqd to achieve tactical air superiority by destroying the PLAGF’s ground-based AAA assets, especially the AAA cannons & SHORADS.

To UNKNOWN/JOHN: Because the Mi-26T is enormously expensive to operate, i.e. 100 man-hours of maintenance per flying hour, compared to 40 for the CH-47F Chinook.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ASD: This is what is reqd before even deciding on the composition of any kind of Integrated Battle Group:

https://elbitsystems.com/pr-new/idf-commences-training-in-elbit-systems-new-brigade-and-battlegroup-mission-training-center/#:~:text=20.07.2020-,IDF%20Commences%20Training%20in%20Elbit%20Systems'%20New,and%20Battlegroup%20Mission%20Training%20Center&text=The%20new%20training%20center%20immerses,in%20actual%20battle%20zone%20territory.

It is such tools that enables one to cost-effectively optimise the final composition of any integrated battle group in different shapes & sizes.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To PINKAL SHAH & BUDDHA: Unidentified Season-2 Episode-2:

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x7v38gu