Total Pageviews

Monday, January 2, 2017

Dissecting The RFQs Of HAL/ARDC For Tejas Mk.1A L-MRCA

By floating two separate restricted request for quotations (RFQ) on December 14 and 15 last year, the MoD-owned Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd’s (HAL) Aviation Research and Design Centre (ARDC) finally won the contest to be seated in the driver’s seat when it comes to developing the projected Tejas Mk.1A L-MRCA—83 of which are required by the Indian Air Force (IAF). 
The first RFQ concerns the procurement of a suitable AESA-MMR while the second involves the procurement of an integrated EW suite comprising of a pod-mounted jammer, and internally-mounted passive sensors like radar warning receivers, laser warning system, missile approach warning system (MAWS) and the central processor.
The flotation of the RFQ now also proves that the MoD-owned Defence R & D Organisation’s Bengaluru-based Defence Avionics Research establishment (DARE) has completely failed to develop a ‘desi’ integrated EW suite despite 15 years of R & D activity. Furthermore, the RFQ flotation has also pit the final nail in the coffin of ill-informed reportage often resorted to by certain ‘desi’ bandalbaazes, such as these:


RFQ For Integrated EW Suite

Inferences To Be Drawn
By specifying that the AESA-MMR’s operations must be synchronised with that of the integrated EW suite, HAL’s ARDC is in fact ensuring that the final bids must be presented as industrial partnerships between the OEMs of AESA-MMRs and OEMs of integrated EW suites. So, this is how the responses to the RFQs will be packaged by the OEMs.
In the case involving Israel, while Israel Aerospace Industries’ ELTA Systems subsidiary will offer the EL/M-2052 AESA-MMR and the ELL-8222WB EW pod, ELBIT Systems on the other hand will propose its ‘All-in-Small’ airborne self-protection suite EW controller that will include a digital radar warning receiver, laser warning system, the PAWS-2 MAWS, and a single digital processor.
The French offer from THALES and MBDA will include the RBE-2 AESA-MMR that will be integrated with the PAJ-FA pod, plus a digital radar warning receiver, laser warning system, the DDM-NG MAWS from MBDA, and a single digital processor.
From the US, Raytheon will offer its RACR AESA-MMR along with the ALQ-184 EW pod, ALR-69A radar warning receiver, a laser warning system and BAE Systems AAR-57 MAWS sensor.
From Spain, Indra Systems will offer its ALR-500 EW pod along with the Captor-E AESA-MMR from Airbus Defence Systems, while the Virgilius internal EW suite (derived from the Eurofighter EF-200’s ‘Praetorian integrated EW suite) will be offered by Italy’s Elettronica SPA.  
In another possibility, Elettronica SPA could offer the Virgilius internal EW suite along with a pod containing elements of the Praetorian jamming suite, plus the Vixen-850e AESA-MMR from SELEX ES.
From Russia, Phazotron JSC will offer its ZHUK-AE FGA-35 AESA-MMR along with the EW pod and internal EW suite sourced from either Elettronica SPA or from RAFAEL of Israel.
Finally, Saab Avionics’ is expected to offer the Vixen 1000es ES-05 Raven AESA-MMR from SELEX ES, along with its IDAS family of radar warning receivers, MAWS and laser warning systems. As for the EW pod, RAFAEL’s Lite Shield will be proposed.
Whichever AESA-MMR is selected, it will have to be interfaced with the I-Derby BVRAAMs that have been specified by the IAF for the Tejas Mk.1A L-MRCA. At least three flying prototypes of the Tejas Mk.1A will be involved in the airworthiness certification programme, involving close to 400 test-flights to be conducted between late 2018 and late 2020.  
However, the absence of an on-board IRST sensor will ensure that the Tejas Mk.1A L-MRCA remains a sub-optimal solution in the dissimilar air combat arena.


Aloquik said...

Sirji Any reason for not being capable to develop EW after 15 years of R and D?

Pratap said...

Another Russian copy? DRDO is working on a new tactical missile called Pralay this report says an anti ship ballistic missile version with 2000 km range is also being developed

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ALOQUIK: Obviously ADA & DARE did not do their homework. Hence no realistic project deadlines were set.

To PRATAP: Total hogwash. Till to date, no one else in the world has demonstrated any successful test-firing of any anti-ship ballistic missile.

Pratap said...

Yes. But what type of missile is it?

Satya said...

Sad and damning

Prasun K. Sengupta said...


BOGAN said...

With MoD doing away with the self defeating blacklisting policy, can we hope/expect some sanity to prevail on the AW-101 issue sir? Maybe get the deal resumed, 3 mothballed birds flying again and the outstanding requirements of the IAF's communication squadron met at last?

Gopu said...

The RFQ seems to be sound. I'm still a little surprised that HAL wants only paper submissions, considering that the rest of the world is in the year 2017. Of course, the Tot seems silly since it ultimately is merely assembling OEM-supplied kits.

The stated requirement for around 80 Tejas mk1a seems to imply that the mk1a will be produced until the production Tejas mk2 can supersede it sometime in between 2024-2026. HAL has stated that they were aiming for a production rate of 16 Tejas planes annually, which translates to 80 Tejas mk1a built in the 5 year period from 2019-2021 to 2024-2026.

Also why was the ASRAAM chosen to replace to Magic missiles on the Jaguar? An Israeli missile would have been a better choice to maintain commonality with Tejas and EL/M 2052.

And which regions will Nirbhay target? Industrial areas in Chengdu? Chongqing? Infrastructure in Tibet, Qinghai, and Xinjiang?

Ved said...

Dear Prasun,
Superb article. Even if we consider that the OEM will be selected after detailed evaluation, Is there any space left for fitting IRST sensors? How exactly the capabilities get restricted by not having IRST kindly elaborate. Thanks.

Ram Bharadwaj said...


Will the Tejas Mk-1A fly using the GE-404 or GE-414?

If it uses GE414 will it not delay the flight testing?

Pierre Zorin said...

Pratap and Prasun: BOTH of you are WRONG! Missiles like that exist and roll out almost every night a fanboy falls asleep. The trouble is when they open their eyes somehow they can't materialise....

Prakash said...

Is DRDO ARM missile still going through? This is a duplicate role of the SAAW.

If China stands by Pakistan on PoK, should we reconsider the One China Policy or say that Tibet is not an integral part of China?

3rd ~ EyE said...

Hi ,

What could be the possible the intent of having a new missile pralay ?
Any specific reason for its fast track dev ?

Senthil Kumar said...

Dear Prasun,

Happy New Year.

Finally India Lost one more close friend Mongolia to China. Mongolia is not in position to defend itself finally submits to China.

Now what is the option India have to hold Mongolia.

S.Senthil Kumar

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SATYA & SENTHIL KUMAR: LoLz! It’s indeed amusing how 1 person’s perceptions get paraded around as being the gospel truth. Totally missing from this narrative is the fact that HH The Dalai Lama’s visit to Mongolia wasn’t aborted or cancelled (as China had demanded) & it went ahead as scheduled. What promises Mongolia made AFTER this visit therefore doesn’t matter. Had China really sought retribution against Mongolia, it would have kept the economic embargo against Mongolia in force for at least a few more months. But that isn’t possible since it would have exposed all the hidden chinks in China’s OBOR initiative & countries like Kazakhstan would have been next in the firing line & if that were to happen, all connectivity between China & Central Asia would get axed & Kazakhstan would have refused to act as the bridge through which Russian weapons exports to China flow.

To BOGAN: That possibility exists.

To GOPU: ASRAAM & Python-5 are both IIR-guided AAMs & therefore they don’t use any radar for fire-control cues, but instead use HMDS. Nirvhay’s targets inside China will be located within the provinces of Yunnan, Sichuan, TAR & Xinjiang.

To VED: There won’t be any space left for the IRST sensor because if the IRST is to be accommodated, this will entail a major re-design & re-engineering of the aircraft’s nose section. As a passive target detection/tracking sensor, the IRST gives a pilot a ‘look first, shoot first’ capability that is absolutely vital for achieving air superiority.

To RAM BHARADWAJ: Let’s wait & see when the additional F404-GE-IN20s are ordered. So far only 17 + 27 have been ordered.

To PIERRE ZORIN & 3rd-EYE: Paper designs are always prepared for contingenmcy purposes & the Ptaslay is no exception. You will recall that in 2012-2013 when a Strategic Review was conducted of India’s strategic deterrent & it was to be decided whether or not India needed to acquire TNWs, there was a sudden spurt of test-firings of the so-called Prithvi-2, along with the emergence of Shaurya, Prahaar & Pragati. But eventually in 2013 when it was decided that India would not acquire TNWs, all test-firings of such NLOS-BSMs came to an end. Similar is the story with the Pralay & it is lieu of another Strategic Review that is to be conducted sometime in 2018.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

The sixth flight-trial of India's long range, strategic ballistic missile, Agni-IV, on January 2, 2017 from a road-mobile launcher on Abdul Kalam Island, off Odisha coast, was a grand success. Agni-IV had been launched five times earlier in 2011, 2012, twice in 2014 and once in 2015. All these earlier five were missions were successful.

sbm said...

Excellent piece as always.

Is the I-Derby the extended range variant?

On the Agni-IV test, what are the SFC's missile groups?
334 -Agni-1, 335 - Agni-2 and 222 333 444 and 555 being Prithvi (the last not being SFC)?

How many launchers per group and has another group been formed for Agni-IV?

man van said...

Is there any way(possible way) to enter NSG.Why China block Indian entry to NSG. Real reason behind it? Are we really need NSG entry?

Rushil Anand said...

This is the design Tata SED is offering. What is your opinion regarding this system and its specifications?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RUSHIL ANAND: LoLz! That design is of DEFEXPO 2012 vintage. The latest design concept from TATA Power SED is this:

To SBM: Agni-4 unit is 335. Standard configuration is 12 launchers per unit.

Sanjay Sharma said...

Dear Prasun,

1) You mentioned in your previous threads that India may get a chance to liberate GB from pak . Will that not cross nuclear red lines of pak? If not then what are the nuclear red lines of pak?

2) If India and pak go to war what are china's chances of opening a second front to ease pressure on pak? What are china's red lines to open hostilities against India?

3) I heard in an interview with the former CIA in charge on the af-pak region that the United States is very concerned about pak AND INDIAN nuclear arsenals. Do you think they will try to disarm us somehow? Like by doing a bin laden type strike. It's believed that the US has a plan to denuclearise pak. Do you think they have a plan for us too?

4) How well are Indian nukes guarded?

5) What is the state of readiness of Indian nuke forces? Are the warheads kept demated from the missiles like pak? Or are they in a ready to fire postion like US Russia and China?

6) How would you compare the extended range brahmos(550km) to the Chinese YJ12 as an AShM?

7) You mentioned in one of your previous comments that the YJ18 missile does not exist but multiple sources on the net are discussing about the missile as a possible weapon for the type 52d and type 55 destroyers. Do you think the Chinese have finally built such a missile? There are even pictures of the aforementioned missile which look a lot like the Russian kalibre.

8) You mentioned to a previous query that we have 12 each of the of Agni 1,2,4. How many agni-3 do we have? Will such small numbers be enough to penetrate Chinese BMD and hit targets?

Rushil Anand said...

Thanks for the update. What do you think of the design and specifications? How capable to do you think this FICV will be? Who do you think will win the project?

SK said...

Doesn't VIXEN 850 AESA come with a integrated IRST, so IRST maybe accommodated in the nose cone with out major modification. Although I am not sure on its range and performance parameters when compared with the competition.

Varunn said...

Is India working on any 10000 - 12000 km range ICBM that gives it the capability of hitting any part of the world? If not, then how can India become great military power? Why dont we make the big leap and develop a 10000 km missile? Why move like a tortoise from 4000 km (Agni 4) to 5000 km (Agni 5) to 6000 km (K-5) ?

sbm said...

Thanks! I know Agni-2 is still in service (for now - being replaced of course) so are there 12 Agni-2 launchers in 335 group as well and are there reloads for these launchers?

It does not compute that 24 odd A-1 and A-II have been produced but only 12 launchers each. Any clarity appreciated.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SBM: Yes, 2 missiles per launcher & therefore 24 missiles & 12 launchers per missile-type.

To VARUNN: Great military power status doesn't emanate from just possessing inter-continental strategic arsenals. Do you reckon Russia today is as great as the USSR once was? Similarly, possessing the best trained armed forces doesn't make a country a great military power, but rather possessing best-thinking armed forces do.

To SK: No ifs or buts or coulds or maybes. The RFQ clearly states what's reqd & the IRST sensor isn't mentioned at all. Furthermore, IRST sensor operates in visual/IIR spectrum whereas the radar operates in RF spectrum & hence IRST sensor can never be integrated with any radar. The two are standalone avionics sensors.

To RUSHIL ANAND: Of what use are such conceptualisations or designs when the future battlefield itself hasn't been conceptualised? That design is optimum for the European battlefield where there's a healthy mix of ground-launched/air-launched anti-armour weapons launch platforms & guaranteed air superiority. That's not the case with the IA because the IA does not possess attack helicopters in the reqd numbers while the IAF does not possess enough numbers of sensor-fuzed anti-armour PGMs. Consequently, targetting hostile armour & anti-armour weapons will be left entirely to MBTs & ICVs, meaning BOTH vehicles will have to be heavily protected & hence their weights will sharply go up beyond 60 tonnes. Thus, if weight reduction & higher cross-country mobility are to be achieved without compromising on survivability , then something has to give. The ONLY WAY this can be achieved is through the introduction of yet another armoured vehicle, i.e. the MBT Support Vehicle that can take on entrenched ground-based, vehicle-mounted anti-armour weapons launched by hostile infantry. This is exactly what the Russians have done after conducting extensive operations analysis of the future battlefields. Mo such analysis has been done to date by the IA or even the industry. Hence everything is in a terribly confused state & the nett result is the terribly convoluted nature of the FMBT, FRCV & FICV programmes. Just watch the 2 interviews of the new COAS of IA & you will see the very generic answers he has given WRT force modernisation:

And if you watch the 2 interviews of the RM, he's totally clueless about such future challenges:

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Assortment of recent CPEC-related video-clips:

CPEC Hunza



CPEC Attabad Lake-Hunza Valley Road


CPEC Skardu to Hunza Road

CPEC Hazara Motorway

CPEC Kohala Dam Project

CPEC Neelum Jhelum Hydroelectric Project

CPEC Haveli Bahadur Power Plant

CPEC Gwadar

CPEC Balochistan

Professor Daniel Markey on CPEC

China-Pakistan Axis by Andrew Small

Varunn said...

Why stop at 5000 km when we have the technology? I know we dont need a missile that can can hit US. But possessing such capability is central to great military power status. I believe it may be revealed after India becomes a member of NSG.

Pratap said...

Is this the start of something big? What impact will this have on Pakistan's missile programme?

sbm said...

Thanks - that is a lot of help.

So would I be right in saying:

334 Missile Group - 12 Agni-1 launchers and 24 missiles

335 Missile Group - 12 Agni-2 launchers and 24 missiles
plus 12 Agni-4 launchers and 24 missiles

Total: 36 launchers and 72 missiles in service?

Agni-3 - any production beyond 6? I know there have been reports of an Agni-3 Missile Group but have found no sign of same

Guidance much appreciated.

Raj said...


Supreme Court is now gearing up on the Augusta Helo matter.

You should be careful and not get on the wrong side of law in this matter.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAJ: LoLz! What has that got to do with me? I'm neither a journalist nor am I employed by any media house nor have I been part of any all-expenses-paid media junket that's gone abroad. So I'm at a loss to understand how & why you can associate me with anything to do with the AW-101 contract. However, I will be more than happy to give my testimony to any Supreme or Sessions Court, plus the CBI & ED in which I will explain with clarity & material evidence how the CAG made unsubstantiated false allegations that led to all kinds of disinformation being spread by the 'desi' media being dessiminated--which totally violated all laws of physics & consequently led to common-sense being junked into the dustbin & national security was irreversibly sacrificed at the alter. So kindly do us all a favour by approaching any court in India to contact me ASAP so that I can thoroughly expose all the 'Blind Men of Hindoostan' without any further delay. This will also serve to expose all those 'desi' journalists who regularly publish paid news at the behest of OEMs like Saab, Lockheed Martin, Boeing etc etc & who even invite advertisements from these OEMs for their respective blogs.

To SBM: As I had stated several times before, Agni-3 is not part of India's strategic deterrent.

To VARUNN: Who has ever claimed that India is stopping at 5,000km? Haven't you heard about the SLBM programmes?

To PRATAP: Of course it is huge, because for the very first time the US has described all these Pakistan-based entities as constituting a direct threat to US national secirity interests. So now entities like PAC Kamra will be unable to provide MRO services for any US-built aircraft & also those aircraft like the Saab 2000 that have US-origin hardware on-board. Previously, only Chinese OEMs were sanctioned in this manner, but to now state that Pakistan-based military-industrial entities directly threaten the national security of the US is indeed a big deal & this is only the beginning. More punitive steps will follow in future.

Senthil Kumar said...

Dear Prasun,

Thanks for your comments.

Well written article.

Pakistan is in deep deception. As per the author, Pakistan cannot be punished. Because if the world powers try to punish, ISI always uses Nuclear card saying that it will fall under mullah and escapes from punishment.

This Pakistan always uses terrorist-Nuclear card and milk the west maximum and escapes from wrong doing.

Russian Islamophiles are pushing Russian govt. to join CPEC which will be final nail for Indian coffin.

Winner is CHINA and Final Loser is INDIA in this game.

Now what are the options India have to tame this fellows.

S.Senthil Kumar

Thehundered said...

Not quite military related, but very impressive march of technology in robotics.

The Shape of Things to Come - Atlas, Spot, Cheetah, Pepper, ASIMO

Senthil Kumar said...

Dear Prasun,

In most of your comments you are saying that Russia is not tilting towards Pakistan or that is not going to happen. Your argument is Russian presence in Afghanistan-Pakistan is only to keep watch of ISIS in that region.

But multiple Geo political scenarios, India-US relation LEMOA, Trump, Current NATO Russian conflicts, Afghanistan, ISIS, Russian Islamophiles etc are pushing Russia to rethink its strategy towards South Asia in general and Pakistan in particular.

India is moving towards US influence is only to keep China in Control. But India don't have any intentions to ditch Russia with US friendship. But for Russia India moving towards US is a alarm bell.

In Geo-Politics there is no permanent enemies or permanent friends. Now everything is issue based friendship. In today's scenario Russia-Pakistan-China Axis is going to happen. But only question is When? and in What depth?.

May be Russian selling SU-35 to paki may be rumour, but no one in the world can assure that Russia-Paki Military sales will never happen.

Do you agree to the above arguments. Please Comment.

S.Senthil Kumar

sbm said...

Point noted on Agni-3

But of the others

So would I be right in saying:

334 Missile Group - 12 Agni-1 launchers and 24 missiles

335 Missile Group - 12 Agni-2 launchers and 24 missiles
plus 12 Agni-4 launchers and 24 missiles

Total: 36 launchers and 72 missiles in service?

asd said...

Dear Prasun,

You should write about the Augusta case to MoD ASAP. Bcoz they are going wrong somewhere. At least sanity will prevail if someone like you awake them. This is what your responsibility as a true citizen of India. Please consider it. I care for the image of my country; hence I request you.

Sanjay Sharma said...

Dear Prasun,
1) How would you compare the South Korea and Japanese navies with the PLAN? Do you think they can hold their own against China without US help?

2) Any chance for a Nato like Alliance in Asia against China? Ex : Japan + South Korea + India + Singapore + Australia + Vietnam + US

3) What is the end game of China subjugating Pakistan thru CPEC? Do they plan on starting a two front war with us later?

4) What do you think is Chinas plan for india? Do you think they'll try to break us up or something?

5) Now that the demonanitasation is over, how would you rate the exercise from 0 to 10? Do you think it has had desired effect to curb terror?

6) Why are the Chinese so belligerent with everyone? Has it got anything to do with sino centric world view? I don't think even the US at the height of its power was as aggressive as China is right now?


Anonymous said...

Prasun da

It is confirmed that another single engine aircraft is going to be procured. Which one do you think India should go for F-16 or the Gripen? How do you think this going to effect Tejas MK2 development?

Rajesh Mishra said...

India, Russia, Israel and US are on the same very side albeit pronouncing the things differently on various matters. If this can not be understood now, I think it will slowly start getting understood once Trump begins opening his cards after his takeover.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SENTHIL KUMAR: Russia already officially stated last month itself that it isn’t interested in joining CPEC. Nor can one conclude that the tripartite talks between China, Russia & Pakistan are about stabilising Afghanistan as per Pakistan’s suggested roadmap. And that’s because neither China nor Russia will keep Afghanistan out of such talks. The real reason why China & Russia are engaging Pakistan in such talks is because the Chechans & Muslims from Russia’s Dagestan province along with the Uzbeks from Uzbekistan form the largest foreign contingent of non-Arab active combatants oif ISIS. And they all make their way from Central Asia to northeastern Afghanistan & then into Pakistan & from there they head toward various Middle Eastern destinations before ending up in ISIS-controlled territory. In addition, several Shias from Pakistan too have crossed over to Iran for fighting against the ISIS. Therefore, all those who are spreading false canards about Pakistan playing the Russian card to the hilt are in fact distributing only FAKE NEWS.

And it is not only India that’s getting more friendly with the US. Even Putin wants to befriend the US under Trump’s rule. The Russians are definitely not so stupid so as to put all their eggs into the Chinese basket. And that’s precisely why Russia agreed to export only 24 Su-35s to China, despite China asking for up to 80 of them in the first tranche.

To SBM: 334-Yes. But for 335 as the Agni-IVs are delivered, the Agni-IIs will be decommissioned. Hence 335 will still have only 12 launchers but 24 Agni-IVs.

To ASD: I can only take the horse to the pond & I can’t force the horse to drink water from that pond. And that’s why sanity won’t prevail until a ‘Maha-Exorcism’ is conducted! Just look at how many TV interviews the newly appointed COAS of IN has given to dater. 2 days ago there were 2 & yesterday there were another 4:

It prompts me to ask how the hell does he have so much spare time to give such interviews? His foremost task is to talk to all his ACGS Directorates at Army HQ & the theatre commanders & ask them each 5 most important taskings that Army HQ can help fulfil ASAP before the delayed Combined Commanders’ Conference headed by the PM takes place later this month & before the annual budget for the next fiscal year is tabled next month. The IA’s COAS must therefore hold all his soundbytes in abeyance till the Day before January 15 when he will have adequate time to address the press/media on the eve of Army Day. So why jump the gun???

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SANJAY SHARMA: The PLAN is decades behind the ROKN & JMSDF in the arena of network-centric warfare & the resistance of PLAN warships to battle damage is far lower than those of the warships of ROKN & JMSDF. 2) There already is such an alliance, albeit not formalized in a treaty. 3) Not at all. China is now cionverting Pakistan into a vassal state just like it almost did to Sri Lanka under Mahinda Rajapaksa & now Sri lanka is crying & asking India to support the financial bailout packages now being prepared by the WB & IMF. 4) Between a pluralistic democracy & a one-party state, it is always the latter that faces the danger of breakup. That’s why China’s internal security budgets since 2011 have overtaken its annual military spending & that’s only why Beijing remains shit-scared of HH The Dalai Lama. 5) It was never meant to curb terror & any such results are only side-effects. Nor was it a demonetisation exercise, but more of a remonetisation effort. I have severe reservations about its implementation methodology because so far no one has convincingly spelt out how will the proliferation of black money be permanently curbed in future. Already the evil brains have started accumulating black money in the new currency denominations. 6) They are not belligerent, because belligerence requires consistency. Instead, China only engages in temporary brinkmanship & then backs off or gets defensive. Witness how it returned the AUV back to the US without any murmur

Kaustav said...

The above October 30, 2016 article by Air Marshal Chopra has interesting pointers:-

1. 83 Mk.2 or Mk.1A will have GE414 engines and imported AESA Radar along with IRST Sensor and/or FLIR pods.

2. The opinion states the IAF will have 14(-15) squadrons or 293 Tejas aircraft of various variants including trainers to replace the Mig21 Variants in service or phased-out. Similar number of squadrons for the Su30 MKI. That covers the L-MRCA and H-MRCA. Though how does the Su30 qualifies as a H-MRCA beats logic as it is not a good strike aircraft compared to the Rafael.

3. The 42 - 45 Combat squadrons would stil need another 14 (-15) squadrons of MMRCAs. So more Rafaels, FGFA, and maybe AMCAs or other twin engine aircraft like the F18 to complement and replace tye Jaguars, Mig27s and Mig29s.

Prasunda wWill the IRST sensor or FLIRs be installed on MK1As or MK2s via pods or otherwise?

The query is because right from 1993, the LCA capability requirements and media articles mentioned FLIR and later IRST. So why is this basic requirement being neglected now?

Subho said...

A rather comprehensive and well put together list of items that have been pushed through in the last couple of years to increase the preparedness of the Indian armed forces :

rad said...

hi prasun
where is the money to have a another single engine fighter line , it would work out to be expensive than buying one.What aircraft would be your favorite an why. My bet is on the gripen.
As THE Mod is going for direct purchase of rifles , what rifle should be chosen?
Isit possible for china to glean th etech from the su-35 considering that russia wwould have made sure that it is not possible .Can they get info about the radar and the engine?

Rahul said...

Dear Sir

Is there a Possibility of PAKIS Acquiring H 6 K Bombers
Or JH 7 B from China

ALong with Air launched Cruise Missiles

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To KAUSTAV: As the RFQ above states, only AESA-MMR & integrated EW suite are being sought for Tejas Mk.1A & now the additional reqd F404-GE-IN20 turbofans need to be ordered. The IRST sensor will go on the Tejas Mk.2. On the Tejas Mk.1A, the Litening LDP will be used & it has already been integrated with the Tejas Mk.1. The pylon underneath the portside air intake will carry the LDP while the pylon underneath ther starboard air intake will carry the EW pod. Since these 2 pods will increase aerodynamic drag, the Tejas Mk.1A will not be a dogfighter & therefore will not qualify as a MRCA even if the LDP is not carried during defensive counter-air missions. The Tejas Mk.2 will have to have a larger airframe to accommodate the heavier F414-INS6 turbofan, plus a new jet fuel starter, OBOGS, IRST sensor, and an internal EW suite inclusive of jammer. It will also have an all-new design cockpit featuring PAMLCD displays (the Cockpit NG configuration).

And I still hold on to the belief that the IAF does require supersonic LIFTs & that this reqmt can easily be fulfilled by the naval tandem-seat version of the Tejas Mk.1. Such a platform can also function as a CAS platform & a limited air-defence platform in wartime.

Meanwhile, the battles for the Buddha between China ^ India are now in full swing:

To RAD: As I had explained before, if the BAE Systems-HAL Combat Hawk option is exercised, then a cost-effective CAS aircraft can become a procurement possibility. Because the pressing reqmts are for 1) CAS platform & 2) defensive counter-air combat aircraft, i.e. urgent replacements for the 95 MiG-23BNs & 165 MiG-27Ms & 125 MiG-21 Bisons. While the Tejas Mk.1A can be an effective CAS platform with limited air-defence capability, the Combast hawk can be a lethal CAS platform especially over mountainous terrain both along J & K & along the LAC & Chumbi Valley. It is more like a 21st century Gnat with a fixed AAR probe that is small & therefore hard to visually acquire & is also agile enough to manoeuvre through valleys & if equipped with AESA-MMR, it can even achieve automatic terrain avoidance flight. The 83 Tejas Mk.1As on the other hand will be useful in the western plains for both CAS & limited tactical interdiction. The air-defence function can then be the sole domain of the Su-30MKI air dominance platforms.

For any direct purchases of rifles or carbines, the Tavor 21/Micro Tavor combination is the best option.

To RAHUL: ZERO possibility.

Anonymous said...

Dear Sir,

I think CPEC is different to Sri Lankan situation. Chinese leadership including PLA are heavily invested in Pakistan. Pakistani are also not like Sri Lankans, they really know how to play the big powers. Also what they are getting the Chinese to build is what their people will also use most of the time, like the roads, rail and power. The investment community is looking at this as a Marshall Plan for Pakistan by China. China is making sure Pakistan continues to be a counter weight to India. However I feel India can trump China wrt Pakistan if/when the trading relationship is normalised. Do you see any progress on this from in the near future?

Happy New Year,

Sarabvir Singh said...

To Prasunda

Thank God, another person who believes that the Tavor and its variants would suite quite well the Indian Army's requirements for both a Rifle and a Carbine.

Though I believe than internally, the Infantrywallas do prefer the Galil ACE. Your further inputs?

Anonymous said...

I wish they would have looked into your advice, but it seems like we going for another single engine aircraft. Which one do you think would be ideal Gripen or F-16? What model do you think they will offer?


Ram Bharadwaj said...

1. Who is developing the Tejas Mk-2? ADA or HAL?
2. RM has indicated the MoD decision to go for a "Single" Engine fighter. Can the IAF not use the technical evaluation report done for the MMRCA? The F16 and Gripen had participated then.

3. Are additional Rafale's ruled out in the wake of the new line of Single Engine fighter?

Pratap said...

Looks like Govt will sign K9 Vajra deal this year. But are 100 gun enough?

rad said...

hi prasun
wouldnt it be great if the combat hawk is re engined with the f-125 and a new wing that is in the making ,we would have a winner ?? can it be done will BAE allow it?.

what ever happened to the agreement with elta about putting their aesa radar on the LCA and jaguar , wouldnt it b e stabbing them in the back.
The mig-23 and mig -27 wouldnt survivie in todays air war! correct ???

Rajesh Mishra said...

How the Tavor 21/Micro Tavor assault rifles are placed financially in the competition.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To CHRISTOPHER: How the Pakistanis know to play with the big powers & how the big powers in turn know how to screw Pakistan back is brilliantly explained here:

China, unlike India, is not a decision-maker through national concensus & therefore there will always be jockeyings for power between the civilian CPC party leadership & the PLA. This is the greatest weakness of China, for the civilians have a different view of what comprehensive power is while the PLA has a securitised view of every policy & this faultline in turn is leveraged by the PLA everytime to corner the civilian top-brass of the CPC party. For instance, while the PLA was carrying out ballistic missile drills off Dongshan island in 1996 to intimidate Taiwan, President Jiang Zemin on the other hand was constantly saying that 'Chinese will never fight Chinese'. Similarly, most Chinese have brainwashed by history to believe that the main cause of China's breakup & the consequent colonial rule was because of corruption. Hence President Xi began by cracking down on alleged corrupt practices & then sought to use this to build up a cult personality around himself. Only a person who does not enjoy any mass or grassroots-level popularity will resort to cult personality-building. If you benchmark or compare all this with what has been happening inside Pakistan since the 1950s, you will realise that these are mirror images of each other as both are national security states, not welfare states. Hence, there's no prospect of any rapproachment between a national security state on one hand, & a welfare state like India on the other. They simply will never have any reconcilable meeting point anywhere. This is what the history of the world;s nation-states teaches us & there is no other alternative but to accept this reality & draft one's national security policies accordingly.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SARABVIR SINGH: The reqmts in question are of a limited quantum & concern only the IA's HQ Northern Command. For the entire IA's reqmts for assault rifles & carbines, there's no other option but to go for indigenous solutions since they are the most cost-effective ones that do not compromise on performance parameters.

To RUSHIL ANAND: Why is everyone ASSUMING that a single-engined combat aircraft will include only the Gripen & F-16? Isn't the Combat Hawk single-engined too? The benchmarks of both the MoD & IAF are that the chosen platform will be COST-EFFECTIVE, i.e. it should be CHEAP TO ACQUIRE & PRODUCE, & it should be available ASAP. On both these counts the Gripen & F-16 & even the F/A-18 don't qualify by any stretch of imagination. On the other hand, a single-seat Combat Hawk with a customised weapons suite comprising lightweight PGMs will be the ideal choice both for CAS & defensive counter-air missions. Availability of TARGO HMDS & Python-5 plus I-Derby will easily compensate for the Combat Hawk's subsonic speed. The only nett additions reqd for the Combat Hawk are an AESA-MMR, MAWS sensors & internal jammer. If a lightweight, internal IRST sensor is available, that's the best icing on the cake since this will easily enable the Combat Hawk to stealthily approach its targets from the rear & engage them in 100% passive mode.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAM BHARADWAJ: 1) ADA. 2 & 3) Refer to my explanation above. If the Combat Hawk option is exercised, then that will save lots of money for being pumped into the procurements of Tejas Mk.2 & follow-on Rafale tranches.

To PRATAP: If the idea is to use the K-9 Vajras along the Jammu-Pakistan border, i.e. in support of cold-started IA mechanised & armour formations undertaking a swift operation to capture the Chicken’s Neck area, then 100 K-9s will be more than enough for such an operation. And that is exactly why & how I believe the K-9s will be used in support of a swift manoeuvre warfare operation.

To RAD: Those modifications are time-consuming & will invariably increase the acquisition costs at a time when they are not operationally reqd. Just equip the Combat Hawk with the sensors I’ve mentioned above & that will be more than enough to do the reqd job. What the ‘desi’ journalists/analysts are failing to do is to ‘CONCEPTUALISE’ the future battlespace. Without conceptualisation & an appreciation of what type of air battles will be fought, where will they be fought & against what type of aircraft, it is futile to suggest speculative solutions like the Gripen or F-16 or F/A-18.

What agreement with ELTA? That was pure hogwash which now stands exposed by HAL’s issuance of the RFQs. I have alluded to it in the very first para of this thread. MiG-23BNs have already been decommissioned while the MiG-27UPG/M versions are plagued by shortage of spares for the R-28B engine.

To RAJESH MISHRA: As stated above, the reqmt is only for units under the IA’s HQ Northern Command & not for the entire IA.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To RAD: Here's more info on the Combat Hawk proposal:

If BAE Systems can offer the 'new wing' design as a validated & certified solution, it will be a welcome accretion. The Combat Hawk can then be jointly marketed worldwide through the existing industrial partnership of BAE Systems & HAL & countries like Sri Lanka & Myanmar will enthusiastically welcome such a L-MRCA solution.

sbm said...

Prasun, I see your point wrt Combat Hawk. That said, speaking to some Indonesian AF people, the Hawk 200 that they operate is deemed sluggish. While I accept there is a place for the Combat Hawk - and an important one - I am not certain it will fill the requirements. AFAIK, the Combat Hawk project does not include radar (subject to correction).

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SBM: I've seen both the Hawk Mk.208s & Mk.209s of both the TUDM & TNI-AU operate over mountainous terrain & even over islands & I am stating with certainty that they--in the eyes of the end-users--are extremely difficult to acquire either visually or by radar if they're used properly using terrain-masking techniques, i.e. in much the same way the Argentines used the A-4 Skyhawks in 1982 in the Falklands. As for filling in the reqmts, how exactly are the reqmts visualised? What is the conceptual future battlefield? Only after this is resolved will it be possible to identify the tools reqd to meet the stated reqmts. Right now, both the Gripen & F-16 are already classified as MMRCAs since they did take part in the IAF's MMRCA competition & therefore they cannot be categorised as L-MRCAs. Plus, the entire licence-production exercise involving either aircraft will be cost-prohibitive & will prove to be logistical nightmare for the IAF. That, however, won't be the case with the Combat Hawk. Furthermore, WRT F-16, there will be legislative hurdels, for instance, will Indian laws allow made-in-India F-16 components to be exported to countries like Pakistan or Taiwan? And WRT Gripen-NG, won't it directly compete against the Tejas Mk.2 & lead to the same scenario involving the PC-7 Mk.2 versus the HTT-40? The issue therefore has to be approached from both the operational reqmts & financial ends. As for the final design of the Combast Hawk, matters will become clearer next month in Bengaluru, since in 2015 only the conceptual cockpit mockup was revealed & nothing else about other on-board avionics was.

Sanjay Sharma said...

Dear Prasun,
1) You mentioned above that China is in greater danger of breaking up than India. And that is why they are afraid of HH dalai lama. But are there any major movements in China for independence like in kashmir. I know there are some disturbances in Xinjiang but is it that serious?

2) Can you tell us something about the Falun gong in China and why it is being persecuted?

3) What is the weight of the warhead of the naval variant of brahmos? Is it 200 or 300kg?

4)Can the same naval variant of brahmos being for AShM be used for land attack or are there separate version?

5) Any plans to equip shivalik class with brahmos?

6) How long before the extended range brahmos arrive?

7) How long before upgradation of Delhi and talwar class with brahmos begin?

8) Have the ka 31 helos of IN been integrated with kolkata class or is it just compatible with talwar only?

9) How would you compare parrikar with Antony? Any positive or negative changes?

The Engdoc Society said...

Throw some light on Kali project
Is it operational
Any why so many people in parliament eager to get info.on it and each time RM has to clarify that he can not provide the same citing security of the nation.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SANJAY SHARMA: Not just Xinjiang, but the whole of TAR. The Tibetan resistance is a nationalist movement & not a religious one. The reason why Beijing is afraid of the Dalai Lama is because in a one-party national security state there cannot be any other centre of gravity. Hence, only 1 entity can always exist as the singular power structure & that is the CPC. No wonder the largest applicants with UNHCR for asylum abroad are from the PRC. 3) 300kg. 4) How can that be? There are different target recognition algorithms for different targets over different types of terrain. 5) What for? The supersonic 3M54 Klub is good enough. 6) They arrived 2 years ago when the IAF took delivery of the land-launched version. 7) Only P-15 DDGs wsill get BrahMos-1. Project 1135.6 FFGs already have 3M-54s. 8) P-15 & P-15A & P-15B DDGs are designed for accommodating 12-tonne helicopters. The Ka-31s are for Project 1135.6 FFGs & INS Vikramaditya only. 9) Parrikar certainly spends more time inside the MoD compared to AKA.

To THE ENGDOC SOCIETY: That project is not within the RM's purview & it comes under the NSA's watch. All matters related to strategic deterrence are handlled by the NSA in the PMO . Those parliamentarians who are asking questions about it must probably have been 'paid' by certain interested foreign parties for seeking more clarity on this project.

Kaustav said...


Thanks for your logical and clear observations to my queries and your views on the Combat Hawk as a cost effective addition to the L-MRCA. This would be the most effective from all angles, ofcourse. Logistics, Cost, Operatability and I believe would be even better than the Russian SU25 type for strike and air support. Your observation on developing the Tejas LCA Mk1 Navy as a LIFT is of course the best solution for that type for both Air force and Navy.
The mix of LCA Mk2 and Combat Hawk for the L-Mrca is the most optimum solution
Thanks again. You make a person lazy.

Kaustav said...

Further, is it feasible to have UCAVs in the strike role or for bombing missions for air forces. Or will it remain in a niche role in foreseeable future , say 20 year window, and would human pilots continue. Sorry if a bit off thread.

RASAYAN said...


soorya narayan said...

Prasun sir, in Paragraph 5 of Page number 2 of the AESA tender it is written that scope also includes supply of Radome for the radar selected . Does this mean that the Cobham Quartz radome will be replaced by something suitable for the particular radar selected?

Ram Bharadwaj said...

Does IN need large destroyers like the PLAN type 055?

rad said...

hi prasun
i really wonder if it is possible to fit <maws, irst ,internal jammers , data link on a small ac like the hawk. what are the capabilities of the Indonesian hawks do they have the above sensors?
I fully agree with you on the hawk being able to make up for its sub sonic regime by the addition of the derby and python 5 though there may be some kinematic dis advantage during launch. BUt at low speeds it could equal the f-16 in turning . It would preferable if the hawk was given stand off weapons like glide bomb etc to be safe from ground fire.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Aha! Finally an admission of the 'assistance' it provided to Pakistan in the arena of ballistic missiles! So now Pakistan's NESCOM can officially be declared as just an import-processing trading house & all previous grandiose claims of indigenous R & D have now been junked by China itself:

This is also perhaps setting the ground for the eventual supply to Pakistan of the SLBMs now being developed by North Korea.

Meanwhile, China's economic woes continue to mount:

To RAD: There's more than enough internal space for such sensors/avionics. Only the LDP will be fitted externally. Today the concept pf core avionics processors has replaced the earlier architecture of distributed processors & this accords great space savings.

buddha said...

Sir nice path opening analysis...
Hope Indian armed force will take notice of it and implement....the Naval version will surely prove to be supersonic Lift and as well as close air support supplemented by hawk..LMrca..

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Vijay said...

Dear Sir

Please answer my Question

Does Indian Army need 60 MM Mortars given that Pakistan uses them
and they have a good range of 2 KM

Our 51 mm has a range of 900 Metres

Secondly has the Recent LOC skirmishes exposed some short comings
such as Long Range Sniper Guns etc ;

What Weapons would you suggest that we should acquire to cause more pain to the Pakistanis

Rahul said...

Dear Sir

There is a News coming in that Russia wants the AYNI Air base in Tajikistan
which was developed by India

SO what will be the Quid Pro Quo

Also The Present Government has been able to Get a Deal on manufacturing SU 30 SPARES

Now can we expect the SUPER Sukhoi deal to move forward

Anonymous said...

Instead of BAE aircraft, surely its cheaper to build a second or even a third plant for the Tejas? You will have a far more capable platform and will help scale up various industrial production systems in the country.


sbm said...

On the Indonesian and Malaysian Hawk 200s, you are dead right about being very difficult to acquire even without terrain. I tried to track a few visually (vs F-16s) and wow!

Gripen is a direct Tejas Mk.2 competitor of course but I am not sure if the F-16 and Hawk may find a place.

sbm said...

Have F414 deliveries to India began?

Pratap said...

Some ques about Pakistan military modernization after reading Quwa, a Paki defense website

1 It says China has supplied undisclosed number of AH-4 (Chinese M777) to pakistan army.

2 PA is testing Denel T5 and Nora B52 self propelled guns. But earlier there were reports that Pakis have ordered Norinco SH-1.

3 PN is in talks with Turkey for various types of warships including MILGEM frigates to replace its second hand Type 21 ships.

Kaustav said...

The TMC ruling party in West Bengal led by Ms.Mamata Banerjee is clearly anti-national and working against India's interests after the WB Police having banned Tarek Fateh from speaking on Balochistan and Pakistani atrocities.

The Communists started this trend but TMC has over reached itself on vote bank politics and Taslima Nasreen being banned from residing in Kolkata , Puja processions being banned, and large areas and districts of the state under the sway of Islamic terrorists accompanied by unchecked Islamic infiltration. West Bengal is set to go the Kashmir way and may soon have Islamic Republic of Bengal/Bangladesh on our hands.

Ved said...

Dear Prasun,
Is any body in MoD even thinking about Hawk as an option? Further it is also about bringing in key tech. for future projects like AMCA and Aura.
Along with Rafale and this single engine fighter procurement, MoD intends to bring key technologies like jet engine and AESA radar to India which will make us more self sufficient in making fighters.

Pls also let us know which torpedo has been selected for Kalvari and it's sister subs. Or is it yet to be decided?

Rajesh Mishra said...

USA brought the muslamic terrorists including ISIS to the forefront on the chessboard and Russia is finishing them mercilessly in Aleppo and wherever possible. Now in turn Russia is bringing Taliban and Pakistani muslamic terrorists to the forefront on the chessboard and USA and India are waiting in wings to finish them mercilessly. Just think it.

Anonymous said...

"Instead of viewing China and Pakistan as two separate adversaries bound by an unholy nexus, India needs to understand that the road to managing an assertive China runs through Pakistan – both strategically and militarily. Only this will ensure space for India in Eurasia. For this reason, an Indian study about managing China should begin with an understanding of Pakistan’s security policy and military power. Whether we like it or not, the path to India becoming a leading power is through Pakistan. Without optimal regional integration through the South Asian Association for Regional Cooperation (SAARC), which has not happened since its inception, India cannot claim its rightful place in Asia and the world – a void which China has been stepping into boldly for several years now."

There lots of truth to the above statement or is this all hogwash?


Anup said...

As you said combat Hawk good option but it's possible to use against advanced SAM & Paf or Chinese airforce advanced aircrafts?

Sanjay Sharma said...

Dear Prasun,
1) There was an article on the Hindu by a professor from JNU by the name of Happymon Jacob highlighting the infighting within the India armed forces.
Is it as alarming as he is saying?
Won't our defence preparedness be affected by all this?
Are the pak and Chinese military free from this type of thing or is it universal?

2) Will the Indian navy get the extended range brahmos?

3) If so when will we get the first warship equipped with 550km range brahmos?

4) You said that the airforce got the 550km range brahmos 2 years ago? But doesn't that mean russian violated MTCR?

5) Have the Chinese navy begun to approach the level of US navy training and efficiency?

6) How well prepared do you think the Indian navy is in the case of a conflict with China? Will we try to block the Malacca straits?

7) Your opinion of the Chinese yj 12?

8) Can Barak 8 shoot yj 12 down?


rad said...

hi prasun
The astra seems ready for delivery to the iaf. The claim being they will be used on mig-29 mirage -2000, LCA etc . How will they integrate russian electronics into the LCA ? How good is the astra given this is the first time we have made a missile .It does not even have laser fusing tech. will it e good enough to target low level cruise missile under ground clutter?
what is the main difference between the astra and the improved astra ? How is the progress. Are there 2 teams trying to out do each other>. What are the new features?.

Anonymous said...

In the light of India’s surgical strikes along the Line of Control, will dropping the policy of strategic restraint work towards taking a step forward or will it ignite another spiral of violence and retribution in Kashmir

ur detailed analysis?


dushyant hardaha said...

some news reports has suggests
UAE may take part in republic day parade
what you're pov on this new development

ShibRam said...

Sir, as per this report rafale sqn will neither be stationed at ambala nor at Gwalior. your views please. VMT

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SHIBRAM: LoLz! As usual the ‘desi’ reportrers got it all upside-down. Air bases housing the bulk iof any type of combat aircraft are always located deep inside the hinterland & only during wartime they operate from secondary air bases. Sarsawa & Hashimara are secondary air bases used for refuelling, just as the Jaguars from Ambala will relocate to Gorakhpur in wartime & make use of Ambala only for refuelling. The same with Hashimara or Bagdogra, which will be used for refuelling by aircraft based further inland in Kalaikunda. That’s how aircraft dispersal works. Furthermore,airfields like Sarsawa & Charbatia are not air bases & are owned by ARC, not the IAF. Only an idiot will house aircraft during wartime in air bases like Pathankot or Uttarlai or Srinagar or Halwara or Amritsar or Jaisalmer, all of which are only a few minutes flying-time from Pakistan & which will have at most only between 3 minutes or 60 seconds early warning time from the IAF’s ground-based air-defence radars.

To DUSHYANT HARDAHA: That’s correct. It is to be welcomed as it is a positive development.

To RON: Anything major or drastic won’t happen till next March/April once the snows start melting. That gioves India plenty of time to catch up on several fronts, some of which are explained here:

To RAD: Not Astra-1 BVRAAM, but the first EMB-145I AEW & CS platform. It’s formal handover ceremony will take place in the near future.

To SANJAY SHARMA: 1) Don’t take such opinions by armchair specialists that seriously. 2) No. 3) Never. 4) No. Just like the US did not violate the MTCR when it supplied T-LAMs & Trident-D5 SLBMs to the UK. MTCR is a regime, not a Treaty. 5) No, it is still 50 years behind the US & Europe. 6) What for? Doesn’t India’s seaborne trade also make use of the Malacca Strait? 7) It is comparable to the Raduga Kh-41 Zubr. 8) Of course.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To ANUP: Are advanced SAMs deployed along the forward line of own troops, or are they located deeper in the rear in the hinterland for protecting VAs & VPs? And will the Combat Hawks or any other battlefield air interdiction ever venture out without air superiorioty combat aircraft escorts?

To DAS: One’s perception of the ground reality is limited only by the ability or inability to see the big picture, & to acquire the big picture, several types of inputs are reqd. For instance, how can one label China as being more assertive when the ground reality says this: PLA transgressions in 2010 were 228, 230 in 2011, 426 in 2012, 334 in 2013, 500 in 2014, 400 in 2015 and 200 in 2016.

Yes, Pakistan projects military power, but at what cost & what end-state? Like it did in 1999 & what was the end-result? Was there any nett gain? Why did the PAF then discontinue its CAPs over Gilgit-Baltistan after flying for only 7 days? Similarly, has military power projection of the type practiced by it ushered in or diminished that country’s international isolation on both diplomatic & economic fronts? Why is the PA today in a severely fatigued state? Why even the US is now studying in great detaiol how exactly India since 2010 has gotten rid of the ‘One China’ policy? Why hasn’t China been able to raise new permanently deployed military formations anywhere inside TAR for high-altitude warfare against India even though TAR hosts excellent transportation infrastructure? Why is China seemingly unwilling to bail out Sri Lanka out of the latter’s economic woes?

Certain folks in India tend to overhype the OBOR & CPEC concepts while totally overlooking the totally decimated state of the economies of all those Central Asian Republics (plus Pakistan now) that are now totally dependent on cheap consumer goods imports from China at the cost of their own domestic manufacturing sectors. The shit will hit the fan when China’s economy goes into deep recession in future & even the US$3 trillion that Beijing is sitting on today won’t be enough to revive China’s domestic economy.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To VED: If the Combat Hawk option is not being thought of by the MoD, what then explains why HAL, a MoD-owned company, is investing the Indian taxpayer’s money on developing the Combat Hawk? AMCA & AURA need to be junked since there’s no money available for them if India wants to go for the FGFA & more Rafales. No technology of any sort will come with either new-generation turbofams or AESA-MMRs of imported origin. There are only 2 options: either develop them on one’s own, or co-develop them. In both cases, sizeable demands should exist for the R & D project costs to be amortised & for this to happern, procuring only military end-products will never produce the reqd results. Civilian/commercial end-products also need to be developed & procured as only this will make it viable to develop or co-develop dual-use technological solutions. No HWTs have yet been selected for the Scorpene SSKs. But it will be either the Black Shark or the F-21.

To KAUSTAV: Here are the video-clips explaining what happened:

To PRATAP: 1) Nope. 2) Not true on all counts. 3) Pakistan cannot afford them.

To SBM: Have already answered all kinds of queries relating to the F414 deliveries close to 50 times before since Febriary 2015. Any practical solution for combat aircraft procurement can emerge only after one undertakes a holistic operations analysis of what the future battlefields demand, what will be the types of battlefields & the kind of conventional wars, & what will be the desired national security objectives of India.

To DAS: That is possible only if there are interested investors in such a programme. Reality is, there aren’t any except HAL & even HAL finds it cost-prohibitive despite theIAF’s reqmt for 14 LCA Squadrons with 294 aircraft. This is because when one develops only military solutions without any revenue-earning commercial/civil solutions, the entire production effort becomes cost-prohibitive. Dassault & SNECMA Moteurs could develop & produce rthe Rafale because they had healthy order-books from the commercial aviation sector. South Korea can produce the T-50/TA-50 aircraft because its strategic industrial/financial partner is Lockheed Martin. Riussia on the other hand is struggling with the T-50 PAK-FA because it is not earning healthy revenues from the civil aviation manufacturing sector.

To RAHUL: Ayni air base was never developed by India. It was built by the USSR & India only refurbished it in the previous decade.

To VIJAY: You’re forgetting that the IA possesses 81mm, 120mm & 160mm mortars. 60mm & 51mm mortars have today become obsolete with the advent of shoulder-fired LAWs & ATGMs.

Sanjay Sharma said...

Dear Prasun,
1) Why would the Indian navy not be getting the 550km brahmos?

2) Considering the domestically used PLAN yj 12 and yj 62 both have 400km range (you told me the export versions given to pak were 290km range), isn't it vital for IN to get extended range brahmos to outrange the Chinese?

I would consider it shocking if we don't adopt the 550km range brahmos for IN.

3) Range and speed of CM 400 AKG?

4) Is the CM 400 AKG related to yj 12?

5) Does the Brahmos have a terminal speed of Mach 2.8 at low altitude attack phase or is it slower?

6) Will the Brahmos equipping the Su 30mki have ship attack capability as well as land attack or only one?

7) I know the IN may lag behind the royal Navy in training and sophistication. But with formidable weapons like the Brahmos and Barak 8, are we approaching the british navy?

8) Is the Chinese CX1 a copy of brahmos?

9) How would you compare yj12 with brahmos? Which is better as an AShM?

10) Any guess when brahmos 2 will be ready for india?


Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To SANJAY SHARMA: 1) Because the 550km-range version is for land-attack. The IN does not have the capability for ISTR for such l;ong-range overland strikes. 2) Not 400km-range. YJ-12 cannot go beyond 200km. 3) Range is no more than 120km & speed is supersonic. 4) No. It does not have ramjets. 5) There's no altitude attack phase. Since it cruises at an altitude of 16km, it has to dive in the terminal phase & is therefore always supersonic in this phase. 6) Only land-attack. The BrahMos-NG will have ship-attack capability. 7) The Royal Navy is far behind the IN today as far as principal surface combatants go. Only in the arena of undersea warfare the RN is far ahead of the IN. 8) No. It is a Ukrainian design. 9) BrahMos-1 has greater range & carries a heavier warhead. 10) Later in the following decade.

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Programme aired yesterday on Pakistan Ordnance Factories' production facilities in Taxila:

Prasun K. Sengupta said...


Saudi Arabia: A Regime Declining?:

Shias of India:

Anonymous said...

Dear Prasun,Sepoy Chandu Babulal Chavan is still not released by Pakistan Army,is he was tortured to death by Pak Army? VINOD KUMAR

Manu Singh said...


There was always a context between SSK and SSN acquisition in the Indian Navy. I believe a year back there was a big internal meeting where this issue was discussed too. Can you update on whether IN has decided what kind of force structure they are looking at undersea warfare? Is India going to procure more diesel submarines or focus solely on nuclear attack subs? Will there be another new line of SSK for P75I procurement?

financeblogger said...

In reply to DAS, you have mentioned that Chinese economy may go into deep recession. What time frame (e.g. 1 year down the line) are you looking at?

Thehundered said...

Prasun can the IAF's current 100+ fleet of Trainer Hawk 132s provide limited CAS to the army after air superiority has been achieved by Su-30's? or do they also need to go through upgrades to be able to launch lightweight PGMs? Thanks.

Anonymous said...

zcompared to Taxila facilities how do Indian ordinance factories compare?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

What a decisive & logically reasoned slap on the faces of those in the PMO & MEA!

Thehundered said...

Prasun is there any update on the contract for new lighter helmets for the Indian army or is it still stuck? The article below is from Sept 2016.

Defence ministry sources on Monday said a contract for 1,58,279 light-weight ballistic helmets, worth around Rs 170 crore, is on the anvil now.
"The deal would have been inked much earlier after the CNC (contract negotiation committee) was completed. But there has been a complaint, as also some financial queries...these are now being addressed," said a source.

Anonymous said...

Prasun da

What is the current status of Saras? Certainly a project like this can help government to improve the aviation R/D in the government and also help in development of dual use technology , correct?

If the project is still going on, is there any chance, after necessary redesigning, for a turbofan powered Saras, like HTFE-25?


Kaustav said...

A timely article by Ujjal Dosanjh and a nice poke to the new nationalists. Hope our wooly headed pm and team have some idea as to what they exactly want to achieve.

Anonymous said...

above article is good n decisive but as he compared us with Israel he forgot one thing Israel neighours doesn't possess nuclear weapons but our neighour do by striking him we may gain little but has lot to lose ours is developing economy n neighour economy is almost near to default so i think it should wise decision fight it out diplomatically in international arena and uses IWT to our advantage

ur views


bhoutik said...

how much do Indian developments and force planning related to aircraft carriers influence the chinese and their plans? off late, it seems to be like their timings are matching specifically Indian developments - they refurbished the one right when the vikramaditya came in, they're constructing the new one which to be racing with the IAC-1, and now they're officially confirming the third one just when over the last year or so India has been firming up plans on the third.

SUVO said...

1) About the situation of neelum Jhelum project:

2) From the Syrian conflict,recapture of Aleppo-what our military & think tank learn?
............... Please reply.

Arpit Kanodia said...


your view on this?

bhoutik said...

is this just merely for scientific reasons or also has political/military objectives? ----

Varunn said...

Prasun, how many Pakis (PA soldiers + jihadis + rangers) did we kill, and how many of our men (IA soldiers + J&K police + BSF) were martyred? What was the kill ratio?

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

To THEHUNDRED: Those contracts along with the one for the K-9 Vajra SPH are due for signing later this month.

To RUSHIL: The Saras project has breen permanently scrapped.

To KAUSTAV: It always pays to speak softly & instead carry a big stick. For instance, the application against Masoof Azhar should have been filed at the UNSC’s 1267 Sanctions Committee AFTER the NIA had filed the chargesheet on the Pathankot terror attack. Instead, the GoI jumped the gun. If China had then put this application under a technical hold, then India should have launched declaratory cross-LoC raids all along the LoC & should have kept launching such raids for a full 90 days. Such a calibrated move would have fetched far greater desired results.

To RON: LoLz! Are you saying that Pakistan will launch nuclear WMDs against India if India raided terrorist launch-pads & sanctuaries inside PoK? If that’s Pakistan’s mindset, then how come Pakistan hasn’t yet launched any such WMDs against sanctuaries inside Afghanistan (which possesses no nuclear WMDs) that harbour the TTP?

To BHOUTIK: The timings are coincidental. But the PLAN lags far behind India on carrier-based aviation since none of the J-15s have been cleared for deployments in fully armed mode. In the recent exercises, the J-15s did only trial-firings of CM-802AKG ASCMs & PL-12 BVRAAMs.

To SUVO: From Aleppo, the only thing to be learnt is not to alienate a cross-section of one’s populace to the point where there’s no other option but armed civil war. Just look at how many Pakistani citizens have been killed by the PA in FATA, which is far more than all Pakistanis killed by the TTP to date.

VMT for posting those links. The UFO in question looks remarkably similar to this:

Prasun K. Sengupta said...

Looks like it will be the Dhanush 45 (and not ATAGS as speculated earlier) that will be paraded at this year's RDP:

China’s Presence in Sri Lanka:
It's a deal that the Sri Lankan government hopes will pay off some of its multi-billion dollar debts to China. A controversial agreement has been signed to lease the port of Hambantota to a Chinese state-owned company for the next 99 years. The Chinese government helped foot the $1.3 billion bill for construction of the redeveloped port in southern Sri Lanka. An industrial zone near the port hopes to attract Chinese investment. Critics complain a Chinese colony is being built. Sri Lankan leaders insist Chinese debts need to be repaid and the deal will attract investment and create jobs. Is the deal too high a price to pay?

Interesting discussion on the current situation in Balochistan:

Senthil Kumar said...

Dear Prasun,

Recently Kerry told it has build Tactical Ops Center in Pakistan. What does it mean?

Please explain.

S.Senthil Kummar

Manu Singh said...


1. Have you read this guy named Andrew Korybko. he writes on south asia. what is your opinion on him?

2. There was always a context between SSK and SSN acquisition in the Indian Navy. I believe a year back there was a big internal meeting where this issue was discussed too. Can you update on whether IN has decided what kind of force structure they are looking at undersea warfare? Is India going to procure more diesel submarines or focus solely on nuclear attack subs? Will there be another new line of SSK for P75I procurement?

Senthil Kumar said...

Dear Prasun,

India use the Trump card Dalai lama Several times. But China is not scared.

Now India should openly declare TIBET is a country occupied by China and Tibet is individual country and India will support for its freedom. By doing this India can rake up Tibet issue in international level bringing the Chinese to compromise.

Defensively once Tibet issue is raised by India whole world will support it. Because Tibetans never took terrorism in their hand.

Next India should declare xinjiang as occupied country. By doing this whole Muslim world will support. Mostly turkey cannot escape. So Turkey-China relation will get disturbed. xinjiang is a tit for tat Kashmir.

India should start issuing stapled visas for this countries.

So china uses all its card to suppress India. India should do back.

Do you agree for the above strategic moves.

S.Senthil Kumar

Anonymous said...

why do think organs like UNO,ICJ weakened frequently by not bringing peace,reconciliation,mediation and cooperation in world order or major world problems?


Anonymous said...

what do you think of India's response towards Srilanka and it's chinese ports?
Since chinese ports in SL purely depend on India's Domestic traffic how do India's actions put check to these chinese axns?

Anonymous said...

So, interesting news regarding the industrial park in Sri Lanka. What is forcing Sri Lanka to go down this route? Is it because no one else is prepared to invest in Sri Lanka? Can India provide any relief to Sri Lanka?


Varunn said...

I'm referring to the year 2016. Total Pakis dispatched to hell vs Indian security forces martyred.

dineja said...

Prsun Sir,
I have one basic question. How will a sub acquire a moving target which is more than 150 KM. If it cannot acquire such target what is the point in having a missile lunch capability against such target like.

Anonymous said...

I believe it is about time india recognised Tibet and Xinjiang as separate entities. Because they have been independent entities before and shall be again. Under the Mogul rule, india had 27+% share of the global GDP. We have to put china under pressure in a big way.


Kaustav said...

We are fond of bragging that in 1700 Indian GDP was 27℅ of the world GDP which British Rule reduced to 3℅ by 1947...fair enough, by how much did the world economy grow due to the Industrial Revolution? Blaming the British is simplistic to say the joined the Industrial Revolution and the race to create colonies for a market as well as supply while we lost our independence to a mercantile power.
Blame the British by all means, but missing the Industrial Revolution did us in. Our lack of scientific and technological temperament was as much to blame if not more. Even India not being united is a figleaf of an excuse. There were big power centres Marathas, Mughals, Sikhs, stable kingdoms in the South, Vijay nagar offshoots , Tipu, Zamorin, Tanjore Nayaks but none understood the ramifications of the exponential growth in the Occident. Japan understood and prospered.
The GDP of countries participating in the Industrial Revolution from 1760s grew because of that...Britain Prussia France USA followed shortly by Japan and Russia. The American Revolution was a loss to Britain but in general the Industrial Revolution was the catalyst that drove the European powers to exploit the non industrialised Orient and Africa. Our lack of industrialisation and mass manufacture due to being laggards in the sciences and technology (steam, machinery, metallurgy etc.) cost us while Imperial Japan wised up fast and joined the west in exploiting or capturing the available markets, China in particular.

Vimax Asli said...

nice for sharing