The first two consecutive test-firings in lofted top-attack mode of the definitive version of the third-generation HELINA anti-armour
guided-missile on July 15 and 16 at the DRDO’s ITR at Balasore has finally
kicked off the process of integrating the missile with the ‘Dhruvastra’ weapons-control
systems on-board the Rudra WSI (Dhruva Mk.4) helicopter-gunships (78 for the
Indian Army Aviation Corps or AAC, distributed among 7 Squadrons, and 16 for
the Indian Air Force or IAF) and Light Combat Helicopter or LCH (97 for the AAC and 65 for the IAF).
The 7km-range HELINA’s
developmental effort began back in 2012 after it was discovered that the 4km-range
NAG anti-armour guided-missile will not be suitable (from a flight-safety
standpoint) in a helicopter-launched configuration. In the initial round of
test-firings in late 2016 and mid-2017, the HELINA’s imaging infra-red (IIR) seeker,
which was derived from that of the NAG failed to acquire and engage ground-based
moving and stationary targets beyond a range of 5km.
This led to the IIR seeker’s
sensitivity being subjected to further improvements aimed at achieving mission
effectiveness out to the specified range of 7km during both daytime and at
night.
A series of user-assisted
firing trials lasting eight months will kick off by the year’s end for
validating the HELINA/Dhruvastra combination’s performance during both
winter-time and summer-time over different kinds of terrain and at different
operating altitudes. Following this, by late 2021 the Rudras and LCHs will
start receiving the series-production HELINA/Dhruvastra combinations.
It may be recalled that the first
Rudra prototype made its maiden flight in August 2007. After a series of flight
and weapons trials lasting almost six years, the 5.5-tonne Rudra achieved Initial
Operational Clearance (IOC) in February 2013. The first two Rudras were
officially handed over to the AAC during the Aero India 2013 expo at Yelahanka,
Bengaluru. Since then, it has taken almost another eight years for the Rudra to
emerge as a fully weaponised helicopter-gunship for delivering immediate air-support
to the Indian Army.
The 5.8-tonne LCH’s
development began at HAL’s RWR & DC Division way back on October
3, 2006 when the Ministry of Defence (MoD) sanctioned a sum of Rs.376.67 crores
for HAL to design and develop the LCH over a 24-month period. Powered by twin
Ardiden 1H (1,200shp TM333-2C2 Shakti) engines, the first LCH
prototype—TD-1—completed its first ground-run on February 4, 2010 and its
maiden flight was logged on March 29, 2010. Exactly a year later, the IAF
placed a production indent with HAL for procuring 65 LCHs, including 10 LSP
models. Three months later, the LCH’s second prototype, TD-2, made
its maiden flight on June 28, 2011. The third prototype—TD-3—made
its maiden flight on November 12, 2014, while the fourth and last
prototype—TD-4—took to the skies on December 1, 2015.
The LCH was originally targetted
in 2006 to achieve its IOC by 2013, but as of now, it has yet to complete
its weapons-firing trials (due to delayed availability of the HELINA), while its
self-protection sensor suite (comprising radar warning receivers, laser warning
receivers and missile approach warning system) has yet to be integrated with
the airframe. IOC attainment now is not expected before the end of 2021.
It is also expected that the
IA, which has to date ordered 443 Bharat Dynamics Ltd-built third-generation
NAGs along with 13 OFB Medak-built NAMICA-2 tracked missile launchers, will
decide against ordering additional NAGs and will instead opt for the longer-range HELINA for
its follow-on NAMICAs.
Also under development is a
DRDO-developed fire-and-forget millimetre-wave (MMW) W-band seeker for a 12km-range
version of the HELINA, called SANT. However, the R & D cycle of this missile
is unlikely to be completed by 2021 at the very latest.
Total orders for the HELINA
for both the IA and IAF are expected to exceed 8,500 units, while for the SANT
the requirement is for 4,000 units.
Airborne SDR-Based Tactical Data-Links For MRCAs & Attack Helicopters
RAFAEL-developed BNET-AR will
be installed on the Tejas Mk.1As, MiG-29UPGs, Rudras (for CSAR) and LCHs of the
IAF, while the IN has already begun installing them on its MiG-29Ks and
upgraded Ka-28PLs.
The THALES-developed data-link (below) is for the Rafale M-MMRCA.
From 57mm To 68mm To 80mm & Now To 70mm Unguided Rockets
The IAF began using unguided air-to-surface rockets with the Dassault Mysteres. The MATRA-built Type-155 rocket pod was used for firing the 68mm SNEB (Societe Nouvelle des Etablissements Edgar Brandt) developed by the French company TDA Armements, which in turn allowed the MoD-owned Ordnance Factory Board (OFB) to licence-build them. However, attempts to use such rockets by the Hawker Hunter and Folland Gnat/HAL Ajeet proved unsuccessful.
The MATRA Type-115/SNEB combination was subsequently
used also by the HAL HJT-16 Kiran basic jet trainers, SEPECAT/HAL Jaguar IS
interdictor/strike aircraft, BAE Systems Sea Harriers of the Indian Navy, and
Dassault Mirage-2000s of the IAF.
For aircraft and helicopters like the MiG-21FL, Su-7BM, MiG-23BN, MiG-27M, Mi-4, Mi-17, Mi-25 and Mi-35P, the IAF began using the UB-16 and UB-32 rocket pods for firing 57mm rockets, and this was followed since the mid-1980s by the usage of 80mm B-8M1 rocket pods, which are now in use by the Mi-17V-5s, Mi-35Ps and MiG-29UPGs of the IAF, and the MiG-29Ks of the Indian Navy.
For
the Rudra WSI and LCH, Belgium-based Forges de
Zeebrugge (now known as THALES
Belgium) is supplying the FZ231 lightweight composite material,
high-drag, straight cylindrical 12-tube reusable launcher that is is equipped
with removable universal dual-purpose FZ125 detent mechanism that enables the
firing of 70mm Mk.40 and FZ-90 FFAR and WA rockets. The FZ231 is also equipped
with a LIU interface (Launcher Interface Unit).
The IAF’s 22 Boeing AH-64E
Apache attack helicopters use the 70mm Hydra-70 rockets that are fired from the 19-tube
LAU-61 launcher. Both are produced by General Dynamics Armament and Technical
Products (GDATP).
128 comments:
Indian army and Air Force have no in-house expertise on product development Nor program management.
They also clearly no intention of developing it, don’t blame them given the defence production ecosystem.
Every DRDO projects needs to be approved only if there is a plan B that kicks in if weapon is not delivered at certain time.
Regards
Venky
Excellent details. The MPATGM with VEM was in user trails? Can the trails be expedited?
Since Rudra and lch have no anti armor missile, can't we order some for emergency use?
Prasunda,
I know I am being tiresome with these inane niggles. Obviously the payload capabilities of a Dhruv/Rudra/LCH is lesser than that of the heavier Apache AH-64. However, the Dhruvastra launcher features two parallel launch tubes per pylon for 8 ATGMS? Why can't it have 4 launch tubes per pylon for 8ATGMs asis common thus still leaving 2 pylons free for possibly rockets, etc. Maybe payload limitations make it unnecessary, but it could be useful in other circumstances. Or maybe, it's stackable but not shown?
Sorry for this silly query, but if you clarify, it would be great!
Prasunda
My other query is ofcourse, what is PRC's objective as far as India's concerned?
n 1962, the Indian economy was bigger than PRC, even in the 1980s both countries had similar GDPs, today India's economy is 5 - 7 times smaler than PRCs thanks to our bureaucratic red tape. INDIA HAD BETTER PREPARE TO FIGHT A WAR
PRC evidently believes that diminishing India & cutti g it to size is a necessary & achievable objective & it uses Pactsn, support to terrorism & direct military aggression to gain territory & it's geo-political objective. It is upto India to impose costs on PRC
economic, territorial, military or strategic.
Sudheendra Kulkarni being the Devil's advocate as usual. India never wanted to be part of BRI. It's been made clear from the start. For India its the North-South Corridor for access between India & Russia with the CARs in between. India's sec prosperity lies in destroying CPEC & recapture of POK spl. G-B. It's PRC & Paxtan that's acting against India. https://thewire.in/diplomacy/modi-iran-chabahar-port-china-pakistan
Hello Prasun Sir,
Will DRDO upgrade the Dhruvastra design so that it can accommodate 4 tubes similar to western counterparts?
Dear Prasun,
Attainment o criticality at KAPS 3 is indeed a achievement in itself. I want to ask whether the design on the indigeneous IPHWR 700 is scalable to lets say 1000 MW or more on the likes of AP1000/EPR/VVER 1200/APR1400 etc. And if it is scalable why is GOI going for EPR and AP100O for Jaitapur & Kovvada Atomic power projects. Also all the recent 3rd Gen Reactors are PWRs while IPHWR 700 is a PHWR, are there any Indian designs for developing a higher MW PWR.
Also does not being a member of NSG prevents India from exporting Nuclear reactor designs.??
Prasunda
And ofcourse this spot-on article by Lt.Gen.H.S.Panag(Retd.) Logical as always & reiterating exactly what you have said all along over the last few months ☺️
"option is that we attack the vulnerable areas anywhere along the LAC for a quid pro quo with the Chinese — asking the PLA to withdraw from Indian territory in exchange of the areas captured by the Indian Army. Since the initiative will be with us, we can choose the time, place and weather for the operation. Our degree of preparedness and chances of achieving tactical surprise should dictate the timing of the operation. Interestingly, “denial and obfuscation”, and military/diplomatic engagement will fit well into the strategic deception plan. Logically, this should be the preferred option"
https://theprint.in/opinion/india-has-two-options-with-stubborn-china-the-better-one-involves-taking-the-battle-to-them/466239/?
Excellent article as usual with minute details...
Sir why it would take so long to integrate with Rudra and LCH..
On part of heli-launch air to air missile ..Is any project going on in house or India has to depend on costly sollution of importing..
On the part of rocket guided or unguided ..Is any project going on in house or India has to depend on costly sollution of importing..
https://theprint.in/opinion/india-has-two-options-with-stubborn-china-the-better-one-involves-taking-the-battle-to-them/466239/
You and Panag sir are of same view...
Hope govt and army take bold decision
https://www.aninews.in/news/national/general-news/india-to-boost-rafale-capabilities-with-hammer-missiles-under-emergency-order20200723134530/?amp=1
This is a welcome news..
Really SANT 12km..DRDO fellows are short sighted ones..A little bit extended version could easily arm Jaguar Tejas BAE HAWK 130
And make them more potent..One..
Now press is carrying articles that IAF will order hammer air to surface ammunition.
Is this true ?
Regards
Venky
Hello Prasun Da ..
Is there something lacking in the Dhruv mk4 with regards to the power output.. Considering that it carries far less weaponary than the apache while it has comparable engine mpower.
Mr Prasun what are the various weapons carried by MI-35 of IAF and what is the status of Shturm missiles ordered in 2019?Also shed light on HAL Lancer.
@prasun da
1. your views on this
https://www.news18.com/news/opinion/china-may-be-drawing-up-plan-to-hit-india-around-winters-as-floods-pandemic-make-situation-ideal-2729703.html
the way i see it this will be much sooner, why bcoz of below
2. RM Rajnath Singh has finally accepted only talks cant help resolve the issue in eastern adakh
https://thewire.in/security/china-ladakh-rajnath-singh-narendra-modi-galwan-depsang
your views
3. the views expressed by respected Panag sir are even more direct hinting at something big coming up, your views
https://theprint.in/opinion/india-has-two-options-with-stubborn-china-the-better-one-involves-taking-the-battle-to-them/466239/
4. As the talk of confronting Chinese panda grows again defense forums are abuzz with India missing the bus in acquiring 4-6 Tu 22M3 either purchase or long lease, bcoz talk is it is the only jet that can take out Chinese S 300 & its clone as well as S 400 that are real threat for any IAF fighter, did we really missed the chance in 2001, your view
5. in last thread you said 'Strangely, however, the DRDO has not yet made any effort to develop a medium-range high-subsonic anti-ship cruise missile that can be launched from the air, from warships and from submarines.' but we do have Nirbhay then why reverse engineer Sea Eagle
hanks
Joydeep Ghosh
PrasunDa,
This ATGM Dhruvastra-39 is not state of the art isn't it? Can be easily defeated by 30 years old PPS, something the Chinese has had access to for many years and probably even the Pakistanis have it.
The way to go is laser-beam riding like Kornet, Refleks etc. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
Thanks,
VIKRAM
Thanx! Now under the dire pressures, the defense projects and objectives are really moving very fast.
To RAD: Designs for such turbojets are easily available on-line from expired industrial patents & all that one has to do nowadays is acquire such designs & do 3-D design modelling & then go straight to 3-D printing production. Kalyani has been working on producing active RF seekers since 2014 for the Akash-1S & Akash-2 based on the designs provided by DRDO’s RCI. And that’s because of the large projected production orders that cannot be fulfilled just by BEL & ECIL. W-band seeker’s reqmt was stated in a previous DRDO Technology Focus publication that is available online here:
https://publications.drdo.gov.in/ojs/index.php/dsj/article/viewFile/4118/2385
The same MMW seeker will also be the terminal-homing sensor for the NG-ARM, which also has a wide-band passive seeker built by Astra Microwave & developed by the DRDO, which can be seen here:
https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-upjYPthxnCo/WtKAYVJZ3sI/AAAAAAAAOTM/Wh8oGs5oFNg0tflkRGaLoHi8slHDO6zRQCLcBGAs/s1600/NG-ARM%2527s%2BPHH-1.jpg
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-t97GlyTMAfA/WtKAbCLFc6I/AAAAAAAAOTQ/4emROq-aTOQSeUb2LfE4dPxXNytLDyJPQCLcBGAs/s1600/NG-ARM%2527s%2BPHH-2.jpg
Attack helicopters never operate a high-altitudes tens of thousands of feet above the surface & hence they are not reqd to scan for targets at distances greater than 15km. If the surface is located 14,000 feet above sea level, then attack helicopters will operate at a height of only 50 feet above such a surface. Hence, arming such platforms with BVRAAMs is totally unnecessary.
To WHO CARES: VEM Technologies was never entrusted with the task of developing MPATGMs. The company was only identified as a second manufacturer of MPATGM sub-systems & components that would then be supplied to Bharat Dynamics Ltd (BDL) for final-assembly so that BDL can portray itself as being the prime industrial contractor for the MPATGM & secure both domestic & foreign (!) orders. Such is the working culture/mindset among the DPSUs!!! Even procurement of ATGMs from abroad for Rudra/LCH won’t meet the immediate reqmts since the systems integration & firing trials themselves will take another 18 months to be accomplished.
To VENKY: They have the expertise, but they all exist in respective vertical silos. There exsists no methodology to channelise such expertise in a productive manner & that’s precisely it took the IA & IAF so long to realise that the naval AK-630M six-barrelled cannons can easily be modified to become ground-based AAA systems. Similarly, the DRDEO cannot be blamed for the lapses of other Govt Depts. For instance, if the DRDO was promised the availability of certain types of microprocessors by GAETEC within a certain timeframe, but the timeframe could not be adhered to by GAETEC, then the entire product-development schedule goes haywire. That’s why, just like the Dept of Space under the PMO, the MoD needs to have a Dept of Defence R & D/Production under a full-time Minister of State whose only job will be to monitor & facilitate indigenous product development & enhance inter-ministerial decision-making synchronisation. Instead, presently, the Minister of State wastes 95% of his executive time on monitoring only the DPSUs. And that is the MAIN REASON why the DPSUs need to be divested of majority govt shareholdings, so that MoD’s civilian bureaucracy gets to spend no more time on micro-managing the corporate & administrative affairs of the DPSUs. Presently, for even building a housing block or a road roundabout or even a public park inside an DPSU-owned township, the CMD of the DPSU has to seek permission & financial sanction of some Joint Secretary of the MoD! Precious time is thus being spent on unproductive matters due to totally irrational work methodologies!!!
The AASM Hammer-related rumours are being spread by ANI & INDIA TODAY. As I had explained in the previous thread, the AASM was rejected by the IAF back in 2016 itself after it emerged that the Indian company that had teamed up with SAFRAN/SAGEM was involved in corrupt practices & its owner (Sanjay Bhandari, a business associate of Robert Vadra) is now absconding from the law & is in hiding in the UK. Do read this:
https://www.defenseworld.net/news/15857/Sagem__OIS_AT_To_Co_Produce_AASM_Hammer_In_India#.Xxck0ygzaM8
And finally, the AASM Hammer is integrated with the THALES-built TALIOS target designation pod, whereas the IAF Rafales use the Litening-3 TDP & hence the IAF selected the SPICE family of PGMs from RAFAEL for the Rafale. Hence, no amount of chest-thumping by either ANI or anyone else will be able to either defeat the laws of physics & mathematics, or overcome the methodologies applicable to MIL-STD-1760A databus modification for the sake of interfacing with the Rafale’s weapons management computer, kindly rest assured. Hence, such rumour-mongering is the same as previous instances of rumour-mongering by these same ‘desi’ entities about India procuring Heron-TP armed UAS four years ago.
To KAUSTAV: The Rudra WSI is a helicopter-gunship, while the LCH is a dedicated attack helicopter & hence the LCH will be able to carry four HELINAs in a quad configuration or eight HELINAs in all, plus four Mistral ATAMs for self-protection. And since the Rudra WSI will be a dedicated platform for delivering immediate air-support, it will be reqd to carry 70mm unguided rockets as well. In fact, once the LCHs become available to the IA in adequate numbers, they will be the only ones to carry tandem shaped-chareg warhead-equipped HELINA ATGMs, while the Rudra WSIs will carry versions of the HELINA equipped with HE blast-fragmentation & thermobaric warheads of the kind that are now being developed.
To KUNAL JADHAV: Only for the LCH, not for the Rudra WSI as I have explained immediately above.
To ADITYA: Every design is scalable & hence the two 540mWe PHWRs developed by NPCIL for Tarapur were scaled-up versions of the original 220mWE CANDU PHWR design. Similarly, the 700mWe design is a scaled-up version of the 540mWe design. The 700mWe PHWR design too can be scaled up, provided India has assured supplies of natural uranium. If not, then reliance on imported enriched uranium will entail the import of PWRs from abroad, like from Russia, France & the US. Of these three, only the ones from Russia have been built so far due to state-funding assistance from Russia (this again was possible because when the USSR broke up in 1991, India was owing US$20 billion in credits to Moscow due to the prior Rupee-Rouble payment mechanism & after some deft negotiations between the 2 countries a new payment mechanism was agreed upon by 1995, which in fact greatly reduced Russia’s national debt liabilities at that crucial juncture—a favour that Russia will never forget at a time when all other countries worldwide refused to honour their debt commitments to Russia). And that’s why everyone can rest assured that for at least the next 60 years, Russia will continue to be India’s steadfast ally/friend through thick-n-thin, especially in crucial strategic sectors/arenas—a fact often glossed over by most ‘analysts’ appearing on various Indian TV channels nowadays.
To BUDDHA: Had already explained it on July 21, 2020 at 2:19AM, i.e. both Rudra WSI & LCH are suffering from the same fate due to the adoption of SEQUENTIAL R & D processes, i.e. first develop the airframe & then weaponise it, instead of concurrently achieving both objectives. DRDO should have told as far back as 2004 to begin work on modifying the OFB-built 68mm unguided rockets (https://ofb.gov.in/product/products/product-details/rocket-68mm-he-) into 70mm rockets. Even OFB could have done it in-house if it was empowered to do so. But as expected, sound common-sensical solutions are always the hardest to embrace/adopt within the DPSUs & the DRDO. The same goes for the HELINA. I had warned as far back as 2007 that the 4 brear-mounted thruster rockets of the NAG will make iot absolutely impossible for the NAG to be helicopter-launched as it will damage the launch-helicopter’s cockpit section after missile-launch. The DRDO realised this only in 2011 & only by 2016 was a new solid-fuel rocket design without the 4 thruster rockets was ready for firing trials. Again, an enormous waste of time due to non-application of sound common-sense. The IAF’s MiG-21s, Su-7s, MiG-23BNs & MiG-27Ms all fired 57mm S-5 rockets. The Mi-171s & Mi-17V-5s fire the S-8 80mm unguided rockets. So for the Rudra & LCH either of these two options should have been selected & later laser-guided versions of such rockets should have been developed. But now, by adding a new reqmt of 70mm rockets, it has been ensured that only importation is possible in the short-term. For air-to-air missiles, while the Mistral ATAM from MBDA was selected for both Rudra WSI & LCH, the FIM-92 Stinger has come along with the AH-64E Apaches—again no standardisatiuon due to lack of coordination!
To KARNFLAKES: As I have explained above to KAUSTAV, the Rudra WSI is a helicopter-gunship reqd for immediate air-support & hence cannot be compared to any attack helicopter, whose roles are totaslly different. The Shturm is no longer in production & has been superceded by the 9M120 Ataka, which was ordered by the IAF in June 2019 under a Rs.2 billion (US$29 million) contract.
To JOYDEEP GHOSH: 4) LoLz! Where are the S-300PMU1/2, S-400 & HQ-9 LR-SAMs located? At airports located in Ngari-Gunsa, Shigatse & Lhasa Gonggar. And how does one approach such airports if their LR-SAM sites are to be attacked? By adopting terrain-masking flight-profiles. Has the IAF been practising such flight profiles? Yes, since the 1990s & the last most visible evidence of this was explained by me here:
http://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2011/10/update-on-latest-iaf-mig-29-crash.html
Since the PLAAF’s LR-SAM sites are all at fixed installations, they can easily be attacked by either cruise missiles like BrahMmos-1, or by standoff PGMs like SAAW when used for SEAD missions. Will the PLAAF therefore be stupid enough to deploy just LR-SAMs? Obviously no, hence it has also deployed quick-reaction HQ-17 SHORADS & LY-80E MR-SAMs for intercepting inbound standoff PGMs, leave alone the Tu-22M3 bombers. Therefore, it will be a waste of time exchanging delusional scenarios with internet fanboys. 5) Can any Jaguar IS or MiG-29UPG or MiG-29K or Mirage-2000N or Ka-28PL or Sea King Mk.42B launch Nirbhay? Has any Nirbhay been launched by any such platform to date? Has the ADE publicly stated that it is developing an anti-ship version of the Nirbhay? Sea Eagle must never be reverse-engineered. It can only be re-engineered to replace 1980s-era sub-systems & components with far newer sub-systems & components.
To VIKRAM GUHA: Of course it is not state-of-the-art & hence it has always been described as a third-generation ATGM. The same goes for the MPATGM & BDL's Amogha-3. The rest of the world has already graduated on to 4th & 5th-generation ATGMs. The principal advantage of laser-guided ATGMs is that multiple laser designators & missile-launch platforms can be used, i.e. laser designators on armoured vehicles, on manportable launchers, as well as infantry-carried hand-held or tripod-mounted portable laser target designators.
Meanwhile, with both sides agreeing not to use UAVs within a distance of 10km of each other's present dispositions along the LAC, the only way of maintaining persistent vigil on one another's locations remains such elevated platforms carrying both battlefield surveillance radars & optronic LORROS-type sensors:
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-glamkHBx8BI/WtUFM1RJwaI/AAAAAAAAOcM/B1odzK74Zjsjp_DbPZr5VP9Hxk36NzmnACLcBGAs/s1600/Mast.jpg
Thanks for explaining it PrasunDa.
1.So why is DRDO developing such legacy ATGMs when 5th gen ATGM are already available? Just for the sake of numbers? In other words given the high price of imported laser beam riding ATGMS only a few can be purchased so for the rest the IA will use these DRDO developed ATGMs.
On the other hand, Laser beam riding ATGMs are almost impossible to defeat.
2. If UAVs cannot be used within a 10 km distance can India, China use airships for ISR?
Thanks again.
Dear Prasun Sir,
Why is Indian Army ordering Spike MR instead of Spike ER1/ER2/NLOS?
Why isn't Indian Army not procuring loitering munitions like Harop or Mini Harpy in large numbers?
Why isn't IAF procuring large nos. of A2G PGMs under emergency procurement expect Spice2000 which has 60km range? Whereas MARS,SkySniper PGMs hv ranges over 100km.
Prasun sir,
1) How does LCH fare against attack helicopters like Apache, Ka-52 and others in terms of speed, weapons and other specs?
2) Instead of 3rd gen desi ATGMs why can't we grab French offer for 5th gen MMP ATGM under make in India?
3) How's the indigenous SSN project going? Given our strategic ties, can Russia help us out in designing a truly world class 5th gen SSN?
4) Pompeo talked about India attracting supply chains. So will US now officially encourage US multinationals to shift factories to India?
5) Someone asked you about Avangard hypersonic glide vehicle some days ago. Why is India not working on HGV?
6) Why can't IA work with private cos like MKU or may be collaborate with Israel on a futuristic integrated soldier system project?
7) Once you talked about advance conical shaped missiles like Ukraine's Grom and KTMM of South Korea. How are they better than Prahaar? Are we working on developing anything like that?
8) Why are hostile statements not coming against China from Western nations other than US? Especially Germany and France? Even UK is speaking only on HK.
9) Some years ago on a thread on S-400 you talked about India acquiring an Israeli long range tracking radar. What radar was it? Has it been ordered?
10) Is there any foreign help involved in XRSAM? Can you tell us anything new that we don't know?
11) What happened to US offer of joint development of future vertical lift helicopters and infantry combat vehicles? These projects can be game changer for us.
12) When will US shift some of its wrath from China towards China's slave state Pakistan? The so-called peace programme with Taliban that Pakistan was using as a leverage over US has turned out to be a total sham. The Pakis are in fact carrying out strikes in Afghan border areas. When will US use its economic clout of sanctions and IMF to finish off that madina ki riyasat once and for all?
Mr.Prasun do our mountain divisions have any armoured units or any extra armour deployed in apart from the already existing tank brigade recently?
Prasunda,
1) Gen. Panag says that we would have to rely on nuclear brinkmanship in the event of a conflict with China to safeguard our territorial integrity. Is our deterrent as of today sufficient for that purpose, or does China have the ability to eliminate it with conventional PGMs ?
2) You had mentioned in an earlier thread that we can expect initial MIRV testing within the next 2 years. Does that still hold (except for possibly a few more months delay added due to covid) ?
3) You had also mentioned long ago that the Agni-IV (which is to replace the Agni II) has already been tested with a 2 warhead payload. Does'nt it make sense to deploy all Agni IV's with that payload to increase credibility in the current scenario vis a vis PRC ?
Satyaki
To VIKRAM GUHA: 1) Actually, such ATGMs are Gen-3.5 as they incorporate fire-n-forget features. But the latest ones available today incorporate dual-mode or triple-mode guidance for overcoming countermeasures. Laser beamriding ATGMs also have limitations, since laser designation/illumination activates the laser warners & countermeasures suites. Hence, dual-mode or tri-mode guidance is the preferred alternative. 2) Airships/aerostats will not be able to sustain deployments in high-altitude areas due to strong prevailing winds that frequently causes the tethering cables to snap. Only collapsible masts that are 50 feet-tall are therefore advisable.
To AMAN: Spike-MR is reqd for usage out to a range of 4km & hence longer-range ones are not being procured as they are vehicle-mounted & the IA does not have LAMVs to house such NLOS-ATGMs. Harop & Harpy are in service in adequate numbers. Up in high-altitude areas, long-range gliding PGMs are useless as they will only cause the launch aircraft to cruise at higher altitudes & this in turn will make them highly visible to hostile airspace surveillance radars.
To VARUN: 1) The LCH is comparable, but nowadays it is the networking via data-linking that is of utmost importance & until such capabilities are incorporated into the LCH, it will function as a sub-optimal platform. 2) That’s because of the very strong lobby of technocrats of DRDO & the cable of MoD bureaucrats who are predisposed to the DPSUs. 3) That project is still in the project definition phase. 4) No, he can’t because the US govt does not own or control such MNCs. Such MNCs will come to India only if India makes it worth their while to set up shop in India, it’s that simple. 5) Because India has been promised the BrahMos-2 by Russia. So why try to develop something similar? 6) That’s because the Indian end-users are not able to make up their minds on what they want & hence the tactical comms project & BMS project were terminated without making any gains. For example, no one in India is even talking about 5-G cellular comms spinoffs for the armed forces. Even the existing 4-G spinoffs that can easily be used as a substitute for tactical comms grids & BMS are not being discussed. This alone shows how intellectually backward the end-users in India are. 7) Prahar (not Prahaar) was never developed as a NLOS-BSM. It was originally developed as the AAD airframe & later it became the airframe of choice for a BSM armed with tactical nuclear warhead. Conical NLOS-BSMs are optimised for very high speeds & quick-reaction activation. 8) Some are making hostile statements while some are taking actions instead of talking, like the UK & France. But the US has so far not said a word about repression in Tibet. Instead, it continues to harp only about repression of the Uighurs of Xinjiang. 9) No, it hasn’t been ordered as yet & it was mentioned in the thread dealing with the S-400 LR-SAM. 10) Russia is helping the DRDL with the Ka-band active RF seeker. 11) There are as yet no takers for it in India. 12) The ANA too is carrying fire-assaults along the Durand Line in Kunar. And the bulk of weapons reqd for this by the ANA continues to be funded by the US.
To UNKNOWN: The Mountain Warfare Infantry Divisions in Ladakh & Sikkim are all provided with Independent Armoured Brigades inclusive of mechanised infantry formations. In Arunachal Pradesh, the terrain in any case prevents the use of armoured vehicles in that area by either side.
To SATYAKI: 1) It is not required if India decides to have the PLAGF deployments vacated by counter-occupying some territory along the LAC that is now under China’s control. The nuclear factor & vertical escalation will kick in only if India decides to forcibly evict the deployed PLAGF forces through direct assaults. 2) Yes, it still does. 3) Not at all. For it is like claiming that China will tolerate the destruction of Chengdu or Qingdao with nuclear WMDs but will not tolerate the destruction of Beijing. Hence neither China nor India will never escalate matters to that stage which involves the usage of nuclear WMDs.
To KAUSTAV, BUDDHA & JOYDEEP GHOSH: Will explain later today in chronological order what was China’s intention in initiating the military standoff. It was never about the DSDBO Road or DBO or anything like that. Instead, it is all about the Himalayan politics of which Buddhist sect will reign supreme over all such sects that currently prevail in Mongolia, Ladakh, Sikkim, Bhutan & India, and the winning stratagem employed weill ensure not only stability in TAR, but will also enable China to kill 2 birds with one stone, i.e. ensuring stability in TAR & adjoining Xinjiang while also ensuring the implementation of BRI through these areas & of course guaranteeing the success of CPEC. And that is perhaps why the US has so far refrained from uttering a word about repression inside TAR, hoping instead to use this as a bargaining chip for something else in future. For now, the US wants to highlight only the Xinjiang/Uighur issue so that this can also stoke passions of the cousins of the Uighurs inside the Central Asian Republics & create widespread unrest around China's western borders, as the US through Afghanistan will then be able to find direct geographic lanes of communication & transportation for supplying warfighting materials to the Central Asian Republics. And that's also why the US has stopped issuing all soundbytes about the Afghanistan-Pakistan peace process.
Transshipment with India Begins Using Chittagong Port:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hzjy0-JNhiA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXeTwRMjdRE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GVcd461oDfQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-tmukn-GMA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8WkIn0XWgY
Prasunda,
VMT. What about the scenario where China initiates operations in an attempt to break the stalemate and settle matters its way once and for all (a possibility Gen. Panag outlines)? With DBO and similar forward areas not very defensible, wo'nt nuclear brinkmanship be our final option ? In that case do we have a sufficient deterrent that China cannot eliminate by conventional means ?
Satyaki
Prasunda,
As again thanks for explaining the great game going on in great details while common man as well as Indian ruling class remain oblivious to the fact as to what is happening. After going through the situation analysis on this blog, it appears that all hope is lost and China has altered the status quo permanently while our PM is interested in fighting elections and constructing temples.
It is clear that ruling class is not interested in counter occupation because either they are no different from previous party in government and are scared to act beyond a point or they are being misled by the incompetent IAS(S) babus. Either way, India will be portrayed as the sore loser in all of this and while the world sympathizes with us, it will simply move on for even the Corona narrative is dying down.
Now that we are here and after going through you comments just up i.e. July 24, 2020 at 7:16 AM, it appears that everybody is milking this opportunity for their own advantage even USA since they want to achieve their own objectives. After all, they have gone slow on Corona front also which brings me to the final question.
Did USA advised India against any kinetic operations or counter occupation so that Indian ruling class remains nestled in their own understanding of this crisis and believe that they don't have capabilities to counter China for a limited time. (This is like the exact scenario like 1962 where US doesn't want India to use air power so that India would ask for help from US and US shall achieve their own objectives in 1962 ( from a report published in Times of India in last decade))
Only thing which we did was to throw some economic punches and that too appears to pacify the domestic audience. But we were played as a fool on the international stage.
Pardon my language.
Regards
Hi Prasunji,
1. I remember reading one of your post stating the Su-30MKI numbers would go past 300+. Recently, we placed an order for 12 Su-30MKI only.
Why didn't we order more of these then ? or the new order would be placed only after Super Sukhoi upgrade ?
2. Recently I have seen many YouTube videos/reports stating 3 Gorges is in dangerous condition. What could be the potential consequences for China if that does happen ?
3. Why has US asked Chinese embassy to close down in Texas ? Is it only due to spying by China ? If that is the case, then almost all the Chinese embassies should be closed down.
Can you share more insights on it ?
4. And if US had knowledge about this embassy spying on the country, then why did US keep them open for such long time ?
Or is this some kind of bargaining chip that US wants to use against China ?
5. Apparently, our Cabinet Minister has been promoting a "PAPAD" that can cure Covid-19 virus.
https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/union-minister-arjun-ram-meghwal-launch-bhabhi-ji-papad-claim-fight-against-coronavirus-viral-video-1703915-2020-07-24
What is the solution for these kinds of idiots ? To think, he is a heavy industries and PSU minister.
No wonder our PSU are sinking and eating up our tax money.
Thanks & regards,
MG6357
Can we not even now change over to 80 mm rockets for LCH/Rudra, it is an integration and test project ? The initial squadrons can use existing stock of 70 mm rockets.
regards
Venky
Dear Prasun,
Greetings!!
Many thanks for your reply,
1. For IL-76MD & 78 upgradation, All negotiations have been completed, so only contract signing is due. Will MoD sign the contract this fiscal year.
2. There are no LAMVs for use in military operations. But there are plenty of them for counter-terror operations, means such LAMV are from indian vendors or imported.
3. Whether DSA, DCA & AFSOD are operational in its full capacity or still under raising phase. Pl provide more details on respective charter & RoE for this tri-service organization. Also will they be converted into command in future (let's say by 2025) or beyond.
4. "Kalyani group 155 mmx39 cal 4x4 MGS system may well be ordered in future, but after an arduous & avoidable process" sorry state of affairs indeed, looking forward their induction by IA for Hilly terrain in earliest possible manner. Hope for the best.
5. What is pace of Mirage & Jaguar upgradation by HAL
6. Recently there is news that Jaguar DARIN-2 (with EL/M 2032 radar) deployed in andaman islands, is it true. Also how many jaguar has 2032 radar.
7. Only collapsible masts that are 50 feet-tall are therefore advisable. Does IA/IAF has any mast with both battlefield surveillance radars & optronic LORROS-type sensors for Ladakh, UK, HP & Sikkim sector of LAC.
8. "The IAF will require at least 80 heavylift helicopters like the CH-47F Chinook, plus a total fleet of 250 Mi-17V-5s for airlifting & deploying an entire brigade of IA troops & related war materials" as per your reply in earlier thread. Whether IAF top brass aware and paid any head to your suggestions or they are still to grasp the reality.
9. So, a minimum of 80 CH-47Fs Chinooks, backed by 60 Mi-17V-5s, 40 AH-64E Apaches, 40 ALHs & 40 LUHs for both aerial scouting & CASEVAC, is the minimum reqmt for airlifting a fully equipped air-assault brigade over a 3-hour period over a distance of less than 40km.
If we have to attack LoC & LAC today (hypothetical scenario), how far wrt above equipment's we are equipped today and are we closing the gaps to overcome the limitations. Any progess towards this.
10. Any contract for additional 48 nos MI-17V-5 signed or yet to be sanctioned financial accord.
11. Whether Dhanush-52 MGS offered by OFB undergoing trials.
12. Will Pantsyr be ordered by IA/IAF as VSHORAD or Hybrid Biho from SK.
13. As per your earlier reply the M-777s are reqd for Sikkim & AP, how many from 145 ordered shall be based in Sikkim & AP.
14. Any progress on Sea Avenger MALE-UAV for IN
15. Have arrived at a rough number for combat aircraft with Indian military as on today.
Su-30MKI - 279 (16 squadrons) + 12 to be ordered
Mig-29UPG - 48 (3 squadrons)+ 21 to be ordered
Mirage-2000-5 - 48 (3 squadrons)
Tejas Mk1- 20 (1 squadron) + 20 FOC + 83 Mk-1A to be ordered
Jaguar - ~120 (6 squadrons)
Mig-21 Bison - ~110 (4 squadrons)
Mig-29K/KUB - 42 (2 squadrons) for IN
in 2035 the force matrix shall be
Su-30MKI - 250 (14 squadrons)
Super Su-30MKI - 100 (5 squadrons)
Rafale - 80 Nos (4.5 squadrons)
Tejas Mk1- 40 (2 squadrons)
Tejas Mk-1A - 83 (5 squadrons)
LCA Mk-2 MWF - 40 (2 squadrons) + 9 more squadrons= totalling 200 Nos
Mig-29K/KUB - 42 (2 squadrons) for IN will be upgraded
Rafale Naval version - 57 Nos (3 squadrons) for IN
Are these numbers accurate?
16. the IA has a dense network of hilltop-mounted Ops & helipads for ensuring credible surveillance of the LAC in Sikkim & AP, Can you provide details of ORBAT and equipment deployed by IA & IAF in this sector
Thanks & Regards,
Pinkal Shah
contd below...
17. Has India achieved credible minimum deterrence, if not then how long it will be to achieve that.
18. Sincerely hoping to get back Pok & Gilgit Baltistan along with Shakagam valley by November to at-least settle our western border once for all. Do you reckon & agree with my view?
19. based on this article https://theprint.in/opinion/strengthen-counter-infiltration-grid-move-10-rr-battalion-from-terror-ops/42105, as per suggestions by Retd Lt Gen Panag, any progress made towards that by MoD & IA.
20. a. https://sldinfo.com/2018/01/21st-century-military-power-changing-the-hard-and-soft-power-calculus/
b. https://www.e-ir.info/2014/05/14/the-effectiveness-of-soft-hard-power-in-contemporary-international-relations/
c. https://watermark.silverchair.com/curh_113_762_157.pdf- Indian Soft Power in a Globalizing World
d. https://www.brookings.edu/blog/order-from-chaos/2019/02/12/the-use-of-military-diplomacy-in-great-power-competition/
Pls share your views on the above articles.
21. Back in 2012 indian armed forces has prepared LTIPP of 15 years till 2027 to achive required level of warfighting capabilties and deterrence, how would you rate is after 8 years into 2020 and how much (in percentage terms are acquired & inducted) as per plan.
22. In earlier thread you reply, "But as we now know, this has not happened & the PLAGF’s & PLA-BDR’s movements were all being tracked since last December through TAR & Xinjiang & hence their attempts at forcible land-grab in Galwan & Burtse/Trig Heights were forestalled & that’s why the PLAGF Commander of the PLA’s Western Theatre Command was unceremoniously sacked & replaced by a new Commander on June 2", while in reply to my question you replied as below
"Totally untrue, for if India was not caught unawares, then she would have pre-empted the PLA’s deployments all along the LAC"
Kindly connfirm which one is accurate
23. Is IN is considering procurement of half built project 12700 MCMV of Russia, which was cancelled by Saudi.
24. China is now claiming that the Trans-Korakoram Tract & its Shaksgam Valley that were ceded by Pakistan in 1963 is now an integral part of Xinjiang, has MEA from Infia has registered protest and highlight this as constituting a gross violation of UNSC resolution no.47 that concerns the undivided status of the princely state of Jammu & Kashmir.
25. https://www.aa.com.tr/en/science-technology/britain-and-us-accuse-russia-of-testing-space-weapon/1920949, your view on above article
Thanks & Regards,
Pinkal Shah
Has the Indian Armed Forces planned to counter PLA's plan to achieve Network Centric Algorithmic Warfare capability by 2035?
If yes, then what is the progress wrt building EW,Cyber & Space Capabilities?
Will India be able to develop Autonomous Killer Robots, Autonomous Combat Vehicles, DEWS, Swarming Technology, Decentralised Cloud Based Communication Systems, MUM Teaming, IoMT tech, EMP weapons, Hypersonics? If yes, then what is the current status & buy when does Indian Armed Forces expect to be prepared for Network Centric Algorithmic Warfare?
Govt of India last year created Defence AI council, does DAIC have a plan to reach PLA's level of AI Incorporation by 2035?
Best Wishes & Regards!
Ajay
Prasun Da,
(1) You referred to triple mode guidance in ATGM (to defeat countermeasure). Will you please name a few such ATGMs that have triple guidance? I did look up for it but couldn't identify correctly.
(2) Is DRDO developing these 3/3.5 gen ATGMs because they don't have the capability to develop 5th gen ATGMs?
Thanks again
1. Why does india takes 8 years to make a ATGM ? Is it so difficult?? Cant DRDO make a project structure with a single point manager and have backup plans for any eventuality and clear roadmap for indian sub systems and foreign substitutes for the same so that at the end project isnt delayed even if they have to import the subs sytem...what could be done to compress the time schedule for user test?...seriously horrible project mangement by DRDO
2.Btw this rafale MIDS JTRS is compatible with other SDR and legacy radio sets??
3. Does the buddhist politics is so rewarding for china to push back sino indian relations almost 50 years back after the galwan incident...Does china have any face saving offer for india and what will be the psycology effect for indian leadership hereafter for next decade atleast , as galwan incident will linger on for a long period in their mind??
4.Navy can import HWT for scorpenes using special financial power avl to vice chief?
5. Has IAF started ELINT/COMINT and image recce for target sites of china , keeping in mind the upcoming eventualities? Cant IAF take some sentinel ASTOR type AC from russia/western friends on loan for conducting recce ??
6.who is managing the china affairs currently ? Army, NSA , PMO, MOD , RAKSHA MANTRI? I am asking this bcoz who on earth promises to not use UAV in 10 km zone of LAC when enemy is at gates?? Its like u have gun but cant use when facing with death due to enemy
https://twitter.com/arunp2810/status/1273118568645877760?s=20
Why doesnt our current chief seek such clear cut ROE as suggested by veteran pilot Admiral Arun Prakash
7. Even the veterans are now trolling the pathetic state of armed forces readiness in the face of prospective war while our chief always bluffs that we are ready
https://twitter.com/arunp2810/status/1278352363166691333?s=20
https://twitter.com/arunp2810/status/1274696465923715072?s=20
Sir is NAMICA 2 carrying only 8 ready to fire and 4 in store .. under optimization...Can it carry more
In future will it carry combination of 7km Helina version and 12km SANT version..
Can retired aircraft's rocket launcher be placed on NAMICA like carrier or T55 that are in storage.. ..Probably many years ago you hinted much possibility...Can this be still done or thought over
Sir what about Ghatak assault rifle ....
Sir will this conflict of china and US lead west go to possible armed intervention ....Or financial block age..
Dear prasunji
1) How many of the 164 litening g4 pods contracted for in 2016 have been delivered?
2) Have those pods been made operational in the iaf?
3) What is the status of the upgradation of 10 ka-28 of the IN?
Has their delivery begun, when will it be completed?
4) How does the upgraded ka-28s compare with the upcoming mh-60 romeos?
5) How will the PAF use its mirage strike fighters against India?
6) Is it possible for India to win a defensive 2 front in ladakh and kashmir simultaneously? Do we have the resources for it?
7) Considering US, China and maybe Russia are superpowers, where do you think India currently stands?
Are we are a great power along with the likes of Germany and Japan or a Middle Power like Australia, Italy and South Korea?
Of course I know that India can't match the Japanese or Germans or even aussies or Korean as far as knowledge based economies and technology is concerned, my question is just dealing with strategic and military matters.
Thanks
Sir, thanks for the reply
I just checked the S-400 thread. The radar is ELM 2090U. Why has it not been ordered yet? In fact why don't we go for the Russian radar of S-500 since we already are buying the missile component of S-500
To SATYAKI: 1) China is NOT in a stalemate at all. It has already got what it came to achieve. Hence it is now digging in for permanency there. That’s why the ball is now entirely in India’s court. 2) Who said DBO is not defensible? The ret’d Lt Gen has already spelt out the force-levels reqd for making every inch of Ladakh defensible.
To ANIONE: No, the US did not advise against the use of airpower back in 1962. It was the IB led by Bhola Nath Mullick that did so. And like I explained before, there is still plenty of time since an AirLand campaign will at best last no more than 28 days.
To MG6357: 1) Orders cannot be placed in one go for more Su-30MKIs since the IAF is also service-inducting other MRCAs at bthe same time, like the Rafales & Tejas Mk.1s. 2) If that Dam bursts, then the whole of central & southern China will be in deep peril. 3) Only the Consulate there has shut down, not the Embassy that is in Washington DC. 4) To give them time to clean up matters. 5) No wonder the PSUs are always in deep shit.
To VEMKY: Have uploaded above the slides & text to explain how the multiplicity of unguided rockets causes shortages every now & then. Equipment standardisation, it seems, isn’t in the dictionary of the IA & IAF.
To PINKAL SHAH: 1) That cannot be said with certainty. 2) From Indian OEMs. 3) They are all recent creations & will take decades to mature. 5) Quite slow. 6) Yes it is true. Only 10 of them are IM variants. 7) Yes. 8) Matters are not entirely in their hands since the money always comes from the Union MoF. 9) Yes. 10) Not yet. 11) Not yet. 12) Not by the IA, but perhaps by the IAF. 13) None. 14) It is still too early to speculate on future force strengths. 16) Already did that way back in 2017 during the Doklam standoff. 17) Not yet, since the sea-based deterrent has yet to be perfected. 18) That won’t be possible & hence a step-by-step approach is reqd. 19) Not yet. 21) None of the objectives have been meet because such projections are not matched by corresponding economic growth projections. 22) Both are correct, since they address different portions of the PLAGF’s campaign. 23) Yes. 24) Not yet. 25) It is true. Russia has been developing what are called ‘parasitic satellites’.
To AJAY: 1) Yes & in many ways India’s armed forces are ahead of China. 2) Before going ga-ga over AI, it will do us all a lot of good if India’s decision-makers begin using their Almighty-gifted natural intelligence first.
To VIKRAM GUHA: 1) I had explained it in the DEFEXPO-2020 thread & the latest ATGM to employ tri-mode guidance is the JAGM. 3) The country’s existing domestic industrial infrastructure isn’t capable of translating the DRDO’s designs into engineered final products. Just look at GAETEC & ask why it is not possible in India to develop the kind of micro-processors & micro-chips that are mass-produced by Taiwanese OEMs.
To AMIT BISWAS: 1) I have partly answered that above, i.e. India’s existing domestic industrial infrastructure isn’t capable of translating the DRDO’s designs into engineered final products. Just look at GAETEC & ask why it is not possible in India to develop the kind of micro-processors & micro-chips that are mass-produced by Taiwanese OEMs. There are also severe human resource constraints. Just look how many test-pilots HAL has to0 do prototype flight-testing. 2) The term SDR itself explains how it will be compatible with all existing radios. 4) Yes, but for that the blacklisting of the OEDM that makes the Black Shark HWT will have to be lifted. 5) Yes, this is one arena where the US is providing a lot of assistance. 6) It is the PMO, assisted by the MEA. 7) The situation is quite bad & of one’s own doing. That’s why I have highlighted above how many types of unguided rockets are in use in India. In such a situation, there will always be a shortage of such hardware.
To BUDDHA: That is quite a good capacity, since they are being carried by helicopter-gunships & light attack helicopters. Only a heavier attack helicopter will be able to carry more ATGMs. Nowadays it is all about standoff PGMs, be they air-launched or ground-launched. They have gotten lighter, contain more lethal warheads, and can also loiter.
To PRAMODW: 1) All have been delivered. 2) Yes. 3) They are still in Russia where the SDR-based tactical data-links are now being installed. 4) The upgraded Ka-28PLs won’t have any anti-ship cruise missiles. But the TAL lightweight torpedo will be carried. 5) Like they were used on February 27, 2019. 6) Yes. 7) I don’t know, because nowadays no one is using terms like ‘Major Power’ or ‘Great Power’. Instead, new terms like ‘Jagatguru’ & ‘Vishwaguru’ are cropping up. It is as if India is overflowing with Silicon Valleys & Nalanda Universities. And yet India does not seem to have enough of the kind of political cockfights that we are now seeing WRT Rajasthan. I wonder who is financing that Pilot Jr fella & paying the bills of the resort occupancies.
To VARUN: What India needs is this, as I had already flagged it before:
https://www.raytheon.com/news/feature/qatar_ewr
https://defpost.com/raytheon-awarded-9-million-in-support-of-qatar-early-warning-radar-qewr/
https://www.theklaxon.com.au/home/xdx17f6auh0tew0g57ubqrzxkdeux9
Pakistan and China have entered a secret three-year deal to expand potential bio-warfare capabilities. In the wake of the Coronavirus outbreak on Chinese soil, China’s now infamous Wuhan Institute of Virology has signed the covert deal with Pakistan military’s Defense Science & Technology Organization (DESTO), to collaborate research in “emerging infectious diseases” and advance studies on the biological control of transmitted diseases. The programme is being entirely funded by China and is formally titled the “Collaboration for Emerging Infectious Diseases and Studies on Biological Control of Vector Transmitting Diseases”.
Indian Weapons Closeups: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUqmsIY6lq4&t=27s
hi prasun
why are these red hot women warming up the mig 29!!!
is the sword radar capable of doing what the raytheon ew radar in performance . I believe thet we can make that type of EW radar for BMD defesne . BUt my question is, wont it be the first thing to be atacked with cruise missiles?
has the darin 3 Jaguar been FOC cleared? Is it not thatthe experiance gained by the darin 3 avionics upgrade benefirt the future LCA program and the AMCA? wont we be full sufficient by the time AMCA come on line ? Ie AESA radar, moving map.SDR,data link ,MAWS, EW, mission computer etc?
IAF chief syas the rafales will be employed in war?
what input do we need to make the gaetc as good as the taiwanese? what do we lack??
if kulbushan is hanged will there be a strike on pak ?.
US Navy's supersonic SeaRam (no definitely not Sri Ram as Hindutva followers would like it to be) missile
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJCNXNAsYGE
Dear Sir,
How do you compare India's EW & IW Capability wrt China? As per Col Pravin Sawhney PLA has such advanced capability that it can carry out Information Warfare ops against India leading to complete Information Denial..He also says PLA can completely dominate Electromagnetic Spectrum due to which entire Indian C4ISR systems will be completely paralysed hindering any information..He adds,India is looking at a linear battlefield scenario wrt China where Army will lead ops & IAF will provide Air Support whereas PLA will fight in all 6 domains with synergy especially virtual domain..If all this is true how does Indian Armed Forces plan to counter PLA in EM Spectrum?
Regards!
ROHIT
Prasunda,
1. If sensor, communication and weapon packages for upcoming MH-60R has been finalised ? If so, kindly inform about the packages.
2. There is much media buzz about deployment od Type 15 light tank by China during Galwan incident. Is it that useful as being told in media? Should we need similar light tanks ? If so, what could be the best option ? BTW, what about the performance of T-90, T-72 and BMP-2 in ladakh ?
3. Indigenous Sniper Rifle solutions were displayed in defexpo by SSS Defence. If Army has shown any interest ? Are these rifles being tested ?
Thanks, regards
You stated about 28day max military ops inside enemy held territory. Am assuming this does not mean the sliver of western flank of Siachen Glacier. So what did you have in mind?
Hi Prasun,
Wouldn't it make sense for india to standardise on Boeing platform for awacs and mid air refuelers given we are already buying 18 P8I for the navy.
What do you think the play for F15EX is for mrca competition given that US is always looking at buying these in large numbers?
Regards,
Sandy
PrasunDa,
The link that you shared about how Pakistan & China will now jointly develop BIO Weapons should be a major cause of concern for New Delhi. Pakistan can very easily release Pathogens of deadly bacteria in India killing lakhs of unsuspecting Indians.
Center and State might react by imposing Lockdowns to restrict the spread of the disease. In the process India's economy will collapse.
Pakistan and China will get away with it because there will be no hard, concrete evidence against them. This is one major advantage of Bio warfare.
Thanks,
VIKRAM
Dear Prasun,
Greetings!!
Many thanks for your reply,
1. http://www.indiandefensenews.in/2020/07/vulnerabilities-of-peoples-liberation.html
this article concors with your view wrt PLA fighting capabilities in high altitude areas. What's your view on this
2. Did IAF has procured all retired Jaguars from UK & France to maintain our fleet as per this news link
https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/archive/nation/first-lot-of-jaguar-frames-for-ageing-iaf-fleet-soon-666480
3. Is TAR-7.62 x 52 & Ghaatak- 7.62 x 39 Rifles from OFB are in use by CAPF, State police Dept. How many numbers are produced till date
4. Is Atulya ADFCR for IA inducted & in operation with army?
5. How many TATRA trucks are in operation with armed forces (as per wiki approx 7000 is it true), will they be replaced with TATA & Ashok leyland designed & developed HMV trucks?
6. Only 10 of them are IM variants, means on 10 have El/M-2032 Radar?
7. Is QRSAM being inducted by IA and deployed in Ladakh?
8. What is status of implementation on the Supreme Court-mandated Police Reforms across carious states in india.
9. Has IN has procured Kh-35UE to replace older Kh-35E?
10. https://www.defenseworld.net/news/19740/Indian_Air_Force_Plans_Building_108_Hardened_Aircraft_Shelters, any progess on NG-HAS construction by IAF.
Thanks & Regards,
Pinkal Shah
To UJJWAL: 1) They were finalised last year itself. Here’s the proof:
https://www.naval-technology.com/news/us-approves-sale-of-mh-60r-seahawk-helicopters-to-india/
2) Type 15 MBTs are not deployed anywhere near Ladakh. Instead, they are to the east, above Arunachal Pradesh. As the past few threads have clearly explained, what is near Ladakh are Type 88 & ZTZ-99A MBTs. 3) Who said it is indigenous? Go to that company’s website & you will find out that this company is hawking solutions developed by a Brazilian weapons OEM.
To SANGOS: It refers to operations that could be carried out east of Ladakh & north of Uttarakhand or in northern Sikkim.
To SANDY: Not necessarily, but it will make sense to strandardise on the A330-220 as the platform for both the ‘desi AEW & CS’ platforms & MRTTs. But the ICGS too must get a watered-down version of the P-8I for EEZ surveillance. That way, the IN & ICGS will have standardised their long-range maritime surveillance platform fleets. As for the F-15EX, it is a H-MRCA & hence if proposed for replacing the Su-30MKI, then it will make sense, not otherwise. In fact, if all goes well with CEMILAC certification of the Tejas Mk.1A, then at least 120 of them ought to be ordered, instead of 83, plus a total of 50 additional MiG-29UPGs ought to be procured off-the-shelf from Russia. And all developmental resources should be channelled towards the MWF & not on the AMCA or TEDBF.
To PINKAL SHAH: 1) I concur. 2) Yes. 3) Onhly the TAR is. The Ghaatak is still being refined. 4) How can it be, when the QR-SAM system as a whole has not yet commenced its user-trials? 5) Yes, about 8,000 in all versions. There are no plans to replace them. 6) Yes. And only 22 AGM-84A Harpoon ASCMs. 7) Its user-trials haven’t even begun. 8) None of them have been implemented to date. 9) No. 10) Work on it began last year.
To VIKRAM GUHA: Interesting reads:
https://www.wilsoncenter.org/sites/default/files/media/uploads/documents/2020-07-HoldingAPenInOneHand-Brady.pdf
https://thedailyguardian.com/the-dark-world-of-chinas-multi-domain-warfare/
https://cenjows.in/article-detail?id=345
And this is the latest in data-links:
https://www2.l3t.com/csw/assets/products/product-sheets/MUMTi_(International)_Sales%20Sheet_WEB.pdf
To RAD: They are the wives of the naval air warriors during the commissioning of the 2nd MiG-29K sqn at Dabolim. The Green Pine LRTR was developed by Israel for catering to BM threats originating from Syria, Iraq etc etc, i.e. threats emanating only from 1 direction. Similarly, since South Korea faces BM threats only from the north, it makes sense for such countries to procure such radars that are directional in terms of airspace surveillance. For India, a constant 360-degree situational awareness is reqd for strategic deterrence purposes & hence the QEWS-type solution is the preferred choice. And given the Earth’s cuirvature, such OTH radars will have to be sited in the hinterland, which is far away from the envelope of cruise missiles.
The upgraded Jaguar IS/DARIN-3 received its IOC on July 14, 2018 & it will achieve FOC only next year after the TACDE finishes writing its employment tactics manuals. And since it is the IAF’s first aircraft-type to incorporate AESA-MMR, the manuals will also serve as foundational tools for similar manuals to be drafted for the Rafale & Super Su-30MKI. As for avionics suite upgrades, there were some significant mistakes made by the IAF in terms of priorities. For instance, after developing the family of mission computers (first by DARE & later by HAL), the next priority ought to have been the development of weapons management computers & digital map generators for Tejas Mk.1. Why so? Because then the spinoffs could easily have been incorporated on the upgraded Mirage-2000s & MiG-29UPGs & ultimately the Super Su-30MKI. And this alone would have saved a lot of money now being paid as royalty fees to the OEMs for upgrading the MIL-1760A databus-based software on the imported weapons management computers of the Mirage-2000s & MiG-29UPGs. In reality, this is the source-code that the IAF has always wanted, and not the commonly talked-about source-codes for MMRs. For, adoption of indigenously developed weapons management computers using domestically developed MIL-STD-1760A databus will enable the IAF to integrate any kind of weapon system anytime it wants to without the OEM’s assistance. To just give you an idea of how much it costs for such modifications, France has charged India Rs.10,000 crore just for the 14 modifications that the IAF had mandated for the Rafale.
As for GAETEC, it needs to be upscaled & this can only happen with private-sector funding & if GAETEC were to team up with Taiwan’s TSMC to create just such a private-sector entity (just like Maruti-Suzuki), then the chancdes of success will be greater. Today, due to entities like GAETEC & C-DOT being state-owned entities, they are just too slow to introduce innovations. No wonder C-DOT is not uttering a word about 5-G cellular communications when it should have been a pioneer in this arena & should also have proposed solutions for the IA’s TAC4G tactical comms system network & battlefield management system—all using cost-effective COTS-standard $-G protocols.
Cont’d below…
And finally we have ill-informed disinformation like this:
https://theprint.in/defence/for-quick-deployment-of-rafale-iaf-opts-for-hammer-weapon-system-not-israeli-spice-2000/467470/
This ‘desi patrakaar’ can’t even figure that since the Spice-2000 PGM has already been interfaced with the weapons management computer & related MIL-STD-1760A databus interface on the upgraded Mirage-2000Ns, doing so for the Rafale will be even cheaper & faster for systems integrator THALES. In fact, neither the Spice-2000 nor AASM Hammer will be optimally employable against targets located above 10,000 feet due to rapidly changing & hostile weather conditions. That’s because neither RAFEAL nor SAFRAN have certified such PGMs for release from altitudes of 20,000 feet & above. That’s why the IAF on its own didi several rounds of test-firings of gliding Spice-2000s over a 2-year period in Uttarakhand & Ladakh in order to obtain data test-points reqd for optimising the Spice-2000s FOG-based INS & its digital autopilot. And the same time-consuming procedure will have to be implemented for the AASM Hammer & hence it makes no sense to procure such PGMs on short-notice when they will be usable only after another 2 years. The only advantages that the AASM Hammer offer are: A) Its choice of 3 different types of modular terminal homing sensors. B) its rocket-powered propulsion, which enables it to be launched from lower altitudes like 5,000 feet ASL but only over plains & highlands & not over mountainous terrain, so that after release it gets lofted on its own power & then approaches its target but PROVIDED the target imagery has already been pre-loaded into the sensor & the navigational waypoints already pre-setted, or a ground-based laser target designator is illuminating the impact point of the target.
So let us not get carried away by all the muck being thrashed out by such 'desi patrakaars' & instead learn to have greater faith & reliance in the laws of the physical sciences & mathematics.
To VARUN: That reminds me of all the ‘desi’ TV channels using the term राफेल (RAAPHEL). But these channels are not able to reach a consensus on how exactly to spell the term ‘DRAGON’ in Hindi, or come up with a Hindi translation of that term.
To ROHIT: Did the PLA’s PLASSF unleash its cyberwar capacities against India back in 2017 or in present times? No. Did China employ such offensive tactics against the US in the past few weeks? No. Therefore, evidence on the ground supports my view that China has no such capabilities & capacities. Leave alone 6 domains, have you ever come across the PLA ever showing a simple MBT Gunnery Simulator or a J-10/J-20 full-mission flight simulator? Even when the PA wanted MBT Driving & Gunnery Simulators for its Al Khalid MBT fleet, it had procured them from Ukraine, not China. Even today the state-owned PLA Daily is replete with stories of how the PLAGF’s armoured vehicle operators are finding it very difficult to master the full potential of their new-generation MBTs, ICV & APCs—all due to non-availability of driving & gunnery simulators. The same goes for China’s inability to develop LEO overhead recce satellites for space-based ISR. All of China’s Yaogan 30A family of overhead recce satellites are orbiting in sun-synchronous orbits. In fact, that’s the very reason why PLA built in 2005 a scaled terrain mock-up of Aksai China (exactly as it would look when viewed from space), so that they could compare the terrain mock-up with the photos taken by the satellites in order to optimise the orbital path of such satellites. This is what I’m referring to:
https://virtualglobetrotting.com/map/aksai-chin-terrain-scale-model/view/google/
http://archive.indianexpress.com/news/from-sky-see-how-china-builds-model-of-indian-border-2400-km-away--------/9972/
Similartly, the PLA in the Gobi Desert has created similar scaled mock-ups of Kadena air base & a street-grid of New York City (all visible on GoogleEarth), all for the sake of developing target identification algorithms for its remote-sensing satellites so that their orbital paths can be programmed in a fail-safe manner.
But the ‘desi patrakaars’ who are technologically illiterate, along with dubious satellite imagery interpreters, recently resorted to creating fear psychosis through deliberately distorted narratives & came up with this kind of mind-numbing nonsense:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xH6EBRJ6Hs&t=24s
https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/how-pla-war-gamed-on-huge-ladakh-model-inside-china-1701299-2020-07-16#:~:text=India%20Today%20has%20accessed%20what,of%20Ladakh%202%2C500%20km%20away.&text=Sized%20900m%20X%20700m%2C%20it,including%20all%20Indian%2Dclaimed%20areas.
https://www.timesnownews.com/india/article/satellite-pictures-reveal-chinas-pla-studying-ladakh-terrain-to-train-for-possible-future-attack/598364
And the latest round of bullshitting appears here:
https://m.dailyhunt.in/news/india/english/newsx+english-epaper-newsxen/the+truth+behind+china+s+ladakh+spy+sats+and+how+it+planned+galwan+heist-newsid-n201160054
Little do they know that such remote-sensing satellites in sun-synchronous or polar-Earth orbits are not exactly overhead recce satellites, but are instead used for generating stereoscopic 2-D imagery of the terrain & all its natural/man-made features. It is only SAR-equipped LEO satellites that can provide 3-D imagery with depth that is reqd for military-standard ISR. Hence, never blindly accept all that is dished out by the ‘desi patrakaars’. Instead, one must always rely on solutions emanating from the world of physical sciences & mathematics.
Hi Prasun,
Big fan
Please forgive me, if iam being paranoid here but i would like to call out Pinkal Shah.
He seems to be very interested in Indian Radar coverage , radars, aircraft radar's and exact number of equipment.
Some of his questions creep me out, example :-
1)the IA has a dense network of hilltop-mounted Ops & helipads for ensuring credible surveillance of the LAC in Sikkim & AP, Can you provide details of ORBAT and equipment deployed by IA & IAF in this sector
2)As per your earlier reply the M-777s are reqd for Sikkim & AP, how many from 145 ordered shall be based in Sikkim & AP.
3)Recently there is news that Jaguar DARIN-2 (with EL/M 2032 radar) deployed in andaman islands, is it true. Also how many jaguar has 2032 radar.
4) Only collapsible masts that are 50 feet-tall are therefore advisable. Does IA/IAF has any mast with both battlefield surveillance radars & optronic LORROS-type sensors for Ladakh, UK, HP & Sikkim sector of LAC.
5)If we have to attack LoC & LAC today (hypothetical scenario), how far wrt above equipment's we are equipped today and are we closing the gaps to overcome the limitations. Any progess towards this
Earlier he used to ask such very exact questions, in his entire thread but nowadays, he seems to be mixing up, such questions with general queries, to avoid suspicion
He could very well be a Pakistani spy. Sometimes our enemies use a strategy of asking such questions to fill in gaps in their knowledge. Then they use whatever information extracted, to get a complete picture.
I think everyone,should be careful about guys like these.
Thanks,
Harsha
hi prasun
thanks for the detailed answer. could you pse elaborate on the w band seeker of the helina
and its advantageous- viz a viz atmospheric attenuation et, range ,precision due to higher resolution due to higher micro wave freq?
what is the freq in which the apache radar works ?. is it doable to make a smilar targeting radar given our maturity
Is moving map digital display akin to google map ? what would be the scale 1:50,00 or less?
i believe it has to be tied into the nav system and how accurate can it be ?. WIll the SAR imagery by the aesa radar be able be fused with the digital map as well as the desi navic ?
Is the L3 datalink shown more advanced thatthe israeli products?
How is the thales developed data link for rafales going to be tied into the desi afnet? or any indian system?
i believe india has a 3d digital map with fly through cababilities for missionsimulation? developed with carto sat imagery? will this be enough to simulate the chines hard model of ladak etc .
HAs the rafale got the capability fly hands of in a low low flight mode on atack mission in the mountain areasw ? we have seen that capability of rafal3e over the sea?
Prasunda,
There is no dearth of innovation and talent in India. What is required is to impart the right technical education, encouragement and creation of appropriate facilities for ‘Atmanirbhar Bharat’. A lovely example during Op.Brass Tacks. Something most Indian Enterprises do on a regular basis. Let DRDO build & let the Forces import where technology is not available. But everything need not be imported. A commitment to quality, efficient batch process & manufacturing standards besides innovation as in this mechanical mine layer vehicle https://www.tribuneindia.com/news/comment/great-indian-jugaad-117986
PrasunDa,
In this India Today report they have written that "Remote Controlled High Speed Boats" are being imported by the Indian Navy.
https://www.indiatoday.in/magazine/special-report/story/20200803-the-panic-buys-1704027-2020-07-25
Will you please let us know from which country these remote controlled high speed boats are being imported?
Thanks,
VIKRAM
Prasunda,
Many thanks for answering my questions. But few doubts are there
1. I have seen the company website and few other sites for SSS defence. They have partnership with CBC Global ammunition of Brazil for manufacturing different ammo, and also pertnership with Lewis Machine & Tools of US for small arms. But, the small arms offered by SSS defence are designed and developed by themselves. IPR of those small arms are owned by SSS defence.
https://www.sssdefence.com/
https://kaypius.com/2020/02/08/exchanging-shots-with-sss-defence-lessons-for-make-in-india/
https://www.financialexpress.com/defence/developed-and-designed-in-india-check-deadly-338-sniper-rifles/1866127/
The most unique thing is , small arms ( Assault rifles, Carbines , DMR, Sniper rifles) are offered as a full package i.e. firearm, optics, ammunition all are supplied by the same firm which is based at india and own the IPR of the product. So, there will no issue in future about availability of spares and MRO facility will be readily available.
So , I think SSS Defence may offer wonderful solutions for MoD , MHA and State govts if those products meet the required standards. It will cost less and reduce many future headaches.
Your views please.
2. Opposite side of LAC of Arunachal Pradesh may be conductive for Type_15 light tanks. But in our side, the condition of roads and geological condition may not help much for movement of such vehicles.But, in 1962, the chinese made some inroads inside indian territory during their advances. In similiar scenario , those light tanks may give some advantages. Your views please.
Thanks, regards.
What is the status of Indo-Israeli EMP emitting DEW that was used in Operation Orchard?Has it entered service?
Prasunda,
Is it technically possible & feasible to have a marine version of HTFE25 for naval warships.
Also Can HTSE 1200 be also converted into a turboprop for basic military & commercial aircrafts?
Also isn't it more worthwhile to develop a whole family of turboshafts with common architecture & components that can be used for both Shakti engine replacements & MI17V5 replacements
Hi prasoon
What do u make of this news. Guess the usual procastrination by government of taking hard offensive action across lac or loc. Suspected this from the beginning.
https://indianexpress.com/article/india/india-for-incremental-progress-status-quo-ante-at-lac-6523561/
Regards
Kunal
1) Sir have we ordered/ inducted Barak mx?
2) what happened to HAL SDR, and how many bnets have been installed in IAF jets?
3) read of littoral surviellance suit designed for P8 AN/APS 149 radar used in scanning ground effectively.
Can such radars or even JSTARS type reliably penetrate dense foliage and detect small groups of people?
I was wondering if 2 of these can be employed in support of CI in Northeast and red corridor.
4) How far even an irrational Pakistani military could hope to get even in an "complimentary advance" from GB towards Ladakh as LT Gen panag mentioned?
5) Have we needed to remove any military formation from western front? Seems to me two of our strike corps will have reduced strength if needed to mobilize to west as 1 each of their 3 divisions respectively are facing China in UK+ HP (not necessarily for war but just for eyeball to eyeball standoff across IB should jungjoo jernails try something across LOC).
Thanks.
To RAD: I had already stated earlier that data on the W-band MMR seeker can be downloaded from here:
https://publications.drdo.gov.in/ojs/index.php/dsj/article/viewFile/4118/2385
And here’s data on the LongBow radar:
https://external-preview.redd.it/y5OACSYyhAErmJdRJywGu1LtvQVrOgJyEihDO302jQ4.jpg?auto=webp&s=37f69786ddac8cb760c049da81b412b0081e945f
https://www.northropgrumman.com/air/an-apg-78-longbow-fire-control-radar/
And this is a digital moving map display:
https://www.iai.co.il/p/digital-moving-map
https://www.harris.com/solution/flitescene-digital-map
The IAF began using moving map displays since the late 1970s starting with the Jaguar IS, which made use of Ferranti-developed COMED, which can be seen here:
https://cdn.rochesteravionicarchives.co.uk/img/catalog/ZZ_1377176612_DDBR0293+%28O%26A-1b%29.pdf
The present-day digital map generators are the new-generation digital moving-map systems that have all evolved from the COMED.
The L-3/Harris data-link is the latest there is & has no peers. AFNet is totally different from data-link architecture. The latter can communicate in C, D, L, and Ku frequency bands to transmit and receive data, but for that SATCOM antennae will be reqd for installation on all flying platforms. When flying between mountains over valleys or river-valleys, manual control is a must & that too when the pilot makes eother use of NVDs attached to the helmet, or when the nighttime IR imagery is shown superimposed on a wide-angle HUD.
To KAUSTAV: This is why the IN’s P-8Is were despatched over Himachal Pradesh & Uttarakhand:
The last frontier village is Kunnu Charang in Himachal Pradesh’s Kinnaur district. After conducting recce, Kunnu Charang villagers have reported that China has constructed around 20km of road along the border in the last two months. Kunnu Charang’s villagers, the last village in the Morang Valley area, say that in the dark of night China is constructing a road towards Khemkulla Pass at a high pace. Drones also arrive from nighttime in China. Kunnu Charang village is close to the China border. There isn’t even a decent road there to drive to. The villagers have cellphones, but they have to travel around 14km to chat elsewhere, owing to the lack of bandwidth. A team of nine people from this village, along with 16 mules and five porters, went towards the border about 22km away. Along with this team, there were some ITBP personnel. When this team reached Khemkulla Pass and looked at Tibet, eyes were wide open. China had constructed about 20km of road in two months. The members of this team said that till October last year there was only a road to Tango, the last village of Tibet, but in the last two months, a 20km long road was built towards the outskirts as the snow cleared. According to the squad, road building is taking place across the border towards Yamrang La, also in the Sangli Valley district of Chitkul. The main area of interest is the PLAGF’s administrative base at 31 48 41.84 N, 78 48 31.62 E, which also doubles as a logistics facility.
To VIKRAM GUHA: LoLz! That ‘desi patrakaar’ probably got over-enthusiastic in his reportage. In reality, more of what was procured back in 2011 is being acquired & I had explained it here:
http://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2011/11/naval-updates.html
To UJJWAL: 1) LoLz! Just browse through the products section of the US-based company https://lmtdefense.com/product-category/firearms/) and you will see all the small arms displayed there. In short, a company with no prior experience in designing or building small arms cannot, within a matters of months or even a few years, offer homegrown solutions. Consequently, to claim that such weapons are homegrown is totally disingenuous. Secondly, even established small arms manufacturers don’t produce the ammunition & hence to expect a newly-arrived small arms producer to also embark upon producing the ammo is simply preposterous. So, if SSS Defence’s products are indeed available on a competitive basis, then they should be offered for firing trials to various India-based end-users. But so far there have been no takers. The same fate also awaits this venture:
https://www.financialexpress.com/defence/make-in-india-brazils-taurus-armas-s-a-and-jindal-defence-to-make-small-arms-in-india/1836675/
Therefore, entering a new business arena without ascertaining the business potential is always suicidal, as companies like Punj Lloyd & others have disovered at great cost. 2) Back in 1962 the PLAGF made advances into NEFA only with foot-soldiers. They never brought along any medium artillery or light tanks or any other type of armoured vehicle. It will be suicidal for any invader to invade with such vehicles when the only available means are the narrow river-valleys that are totally vulnerable to artillery fire-assaults & aerial straffing.
To UNKNOWN: Such DEWs have been in service with the IAF in small numbers since 2009.
To UNKNOWN/KUNAL: Not procrastination, but just buying time so that on one hand international pressure can be built up against China while at the same time, the offensive capabilities of the armed forces are built up by this October. Here are the list of emergency purchases for meeting urgent reqmts:
https://akm-img-a-in.tosshub.com/indiatoday/images/bodyeditor/202007/def-x625.jpeg?_jlmCakgMXiSOwhaGK4sY5ov4Vi3LLsH
https://akm-img-a-in.tosshub.com/indiatoday/images/bodyeditor/202007/Defence-Purchase-Aug3-22-x443.jpg?MU.oqi2GzwU1mRuFroYhCkAOpwzCrowJ
Mr.Prasun where can the Type 15 light tank be deployed in either Sikkim because as you said against Arunachal it will be useless and are Chinese forces opposite Demchok and Chushul part of Tibet MD or Xinjiang MD?
This fella saying HAMMER is coming and u r also sharing his image while earlier u said itsnt coming....whatever we are behaving like headless chickens
The momemt SATCOM is used wont it compromise AC own position??
Can rafale provide escort jammer support to strike package of sukhoi /Mig 29/tejas and other aicraft??
To UNKNOWN: The Type 15 is meant for use only as a defensive weapon over semi-urban or rural terrain like the ones existing within the Chumbi Valley & that's why it has been exercising only over similar terrain located at the firing range to the north of Arunachal Pradesh. Whole of Ladakh area is the area of responsibility of the South Xinjiang Military District.
To AMIT BISWAS: That's why I had described him as being over-enthusiastic, since he has included anything & everything, from light tanks to unknown surveillance pods to Spice-1000 (which is actually being negotiated for the Tejas Mk.1 FOC-standard aircraft & for the Tejas Mk.1A) to HAMMERs to 4 x 4 ATVs to non-existent remote-controlled speedboats (which can easily be bought online from Amazon.com for children to play with!). SATCOM won't compromise as long as the combat aircraft is only on receiver mode & it isn't transmitting anything.
Prasunda,
What do you think of this article by Praveen Sawhney? He seems to have an exaggerated view of the PLAs capability. Is there any basis for what he writes?
https://thewire.in/security/with-indias-options-in-the-ladakh-crisis-narrowing-high-level-talks-are-the-way-forward
Satyaki
Prasun Da
We need to ramp up fightrer strength and can't upset geo-political relations with Russia, USA and Europe. It is better to scrap MMRCA 2.0 and buy 72-80 F-21,24 Rafale and 20 Mig29 directly.
If we look at 75% availability rate, at any given time we will have only 27 Rafales in action, which is very low for two front war.
Allocate one time non lapsable fund to IAF (1.50 Lakh Crores), IA(75,000 Cr), IN(1.50 Lakh Cr) DRDO (30,000 Cr), HAL(20,000 Cr, IMRH, Sport LIFT, unmanned Tejas...)
Give 20,000 Cr to private firms to develop cutting edge drones and ask DRDO stop working on Drones.
On top of this they will get annual allocation.
Channel all 80G funds, Statue making funds, Horse trading fund(buying MLA,MP), etc to Defence modernisation.
Impose 5% additional tax on chinese imports for this purpose.
John
https://twitter.com/SpokespersonMoD/status/1287632300352475136?s=20
Significance of this visit ??
Sir
What's the role of mech inf if the war will happen with china in near future
JB
Dear Prasun,
Greetings of the day!!
Many thanks for your reply, first a reply harsha.
Harsha it seems you forgot the decorum of this blog and cannot understand the difference between spying and general discussion. Kindly learn the same before calling out names and displaying your ametuerize attitude.
Prasunji now back to our discussion
1. https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/00963402.2020.1778378, what is your view on this article, it seems accurate wrt deployed nuclear forces by our armed forces.
2. Have gone through all your thread in 2017 dealing Doklam standoff wrt to coordianted given for PLAGF location across tibet regions for airbases & other support infra. However for all only Shigatse/Xigaze airbase seems to be upgraded with second runway and other facilities but can't find any HAS/Blast pens to support and fighter aircraft permanently which again asserts your PoV wrt inferior capabilities of PLAAF wrt IAF.
What's your take on this?
3. it will achieve FOC only next year after the TACDE finishes writing its employment tactics manuals. And since it is the IAF’s first aircraft-type to incorporate AESA-MMR, the manuals will also serve as foundational tools for similar manuals to be drafted for the Rafale & Super Su-30MKI.
How much work on tactics manuals already been completed by TACDE for DARIN-3 aircraft as now 16 nos of upgraded DARIN-3 is available?
4. Also progress on Phase-2 for Karwar naval base expansion and Project Varsha at east coast seems to be at slower pace as seen from Google Earth imagery. is it due to lack of release of funds from MoF in timely manner, or shortage of manpower or both?
5. of all the DRDO-developed drones were highlighted here: http://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2016/11/never-ending-unkept-promises.html, how many are actually been operated or in-use by our armed forces.
6. "The same goes for China’s inability to develop LEO overhead recce satellites for space-based ISR. All of China’s Yaogan 30A family of overhead recce satellites are orbiting in sun-synchronous orbits", how is our progress on LEO overhead recce satellites as far as ISRO developed satellites all are placed in SSO/Polar orbits, kindly elaborate on this.
As per ESA website, LEO’s close proximity to Earth makes it useful for several reasons. It is the orbit most commonly used for satellite imaging, as being near the surface allows it to take images of higher resolution. It is also the orbit used for the International Space Station (ISS), as it is easier for astronauts to travel to and from it at a shorter distance. Satellites in this orbit travel at a speed of around 7.8 km per second; at this speed, a satellite takes approximately 90 minutes to circle Earth. It is normally at an altitude of less than 1000 km but could be as low as 160 km above Earth – which is low compared to other orbits, but still very far above Earth’s surface.
7. Far ahead of China, but are behind the capabilities of NATO member-states, by when our (tentative year) Indian NCW capabilities & capacities will be at par with NATO member states.
8. Will explain later today in chronological order what was China’s intention in initiating the military standoff, await you thread in this.
9. "That won’t be possible & hence a step-by-step approach is reqd" you replied on my earlier question. kindly share and elaborate the approach needed.
contd below...
10. In your reply to Ajay wrt EW, Cyber & Sapce capabilities-Yes & in many ways India’s armed forces are ahead of China, looking forward to your analysis or new thread on this subject. I will be great help is any literature is available in public domain which you can share the links.
11. When we can expect 2nd nuclear submarine from russia contracted on lease?
12. https://defpost.com/raytheon-awarded-9-million-in-support-of-qatar-early-warning-radar-qewr/
whether our armed forces looking for such UEWS system for 360 deg coverage?
13. The indigenous content of the Tejas is 59.7% by value and 75.5% by number of line replaceable units. is it accurate?
14. https://airpowerasia.com/2020/04/27/iaf-growth-and-indigenization-challenges/, you view on this article
15. whether HAL has developed weapons management computers & digital map generators?
16. Whether IA has MBT Gunnery Simulator for its T-72, T-90 & Arjun Tanks?
Thanks & Regards,
Pinkal Shah
Mr.Prasun why are the Chinese forces in Xinjiang MD so heavily armoured and mobile is it because of the terrain of Xinjiang and it seems that the PLAGF won't be able to fight much when it comes to capturing mountain heights because they just wanna ride in their Armoured/Light vehicles?
Hi Prasun
Very Basic question for you - Can IAF re-activate the recently retired Mig27s for CAS and Ground attack role in Ladakh and Arunachal-Sikkim sector. I remember there was a Squadron of Mig27s based at Hashimara and at several Bases in North India.
Further, if not then what will the IAF use for CAS role in case of hostilities with China
Thanks
Dear Prasun,
The following press release from Astra Microwave has some interesting info. It talks of AESA seekers, proto array of large project, strategic air defence system etc. Would you care to comment on this?
PrasunDa,
(1) In the latest edition of Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists they wrote that India is building Several New plutonium production facilities. Is this true? If yes, it means India is trying to achieve nuclear parity with China.
https://thebulletin.org/2020/07/indian-nuclear-forces-2020/
(2) In the Infographics that you have shared from India Today it seems India is purchasing Sypder -ER. AFAIK, India did not have the ER version.
Thanks,
VIKRAM
Can you share some links and on VN-1 with HJ-10 missiles in PLA service any video of firing?
Hi Prasunji,
1. Correct me if wrong about the Unguided rockets & rocket pods mentioned in above article.
We have developed Astra BVRAAM which seems technologically complex than Unguided rockets & rocket pods.
Compared to BVRAAM technology, Unguided rockets & rocket pods seem like low hanging fruits.
Why didn't we develop one yet & import these ?
2. We imported Jaguars in 1980s. Why didn't we choose Tornado aircraft instead of Jaguars ?
3. In 1-2 decades, we would reach where China is today. Do you think, we would have friction with USA like China in terms of Trade wars, South China Sea issue etc ?
Or is China an isolated example as it has become over-ambitious ?
4. How did USA gain so many islands like Diego Garcia, Pearl Harbour etc ? Even UK has Falkland Islands in their control. Chinese are grabbing lands by force or by economically impairing poor African & Asian countries.
Why can't we have islands like these countries have and what should we have to do to get such kinds of strategic locations in our control ?
Prasun,
1-with RR on board to develop the after burner portion of HTFE 25. How soon can we expect it to be ready for trails 7 by when can they be expected to be on jags?
2- Does India need amphibious aircrafts?
3-You had mentioned that VL-astra is still 8 years away. so will the frontline warships be equipped with barak MX -35 km version on the c-dome which as offered by isreal as an alternative as any other option will again requires mating the weapons(eg- sea ceptor) to the onboard sensors which mostly are of isreali origin with added costs of integrations
4-your reply to ujjwal on private defence industry offering small arms. while they may be offering a repackaged foreign design why are the armed forces not interested in testing them out .. is it b'coz the MoD tactically supports the OFB's. the ak 203 saga doesent seem to end and is stuck primarily due to its higher cost. given a bulk deal, i bet the private coz can offer a much cheaper & better weapon
5- Is the IRNSS been of any use during this stand off?
6 further to your reply to RAD on jaguras, which country is providing the weapons mgmt system & digital map generators for tejas Mk1- Israel? now atleast for MWF, the claim is it would be indigenous, can those be retrofitted into jags(provided their hardware support them)?
7- What benefits are expected by signing a reciprocal logistics agreemnt with Russia since they do not have any assests in the IOR region
8- Will there now be a geostationary satellite hovering permanently over ladakh+ J&K region to monitor the chinese going ahead
9- Why are't we using this opportunity extract commitments from the chinese over cpec transgression in PoK along with the withdrawal across ladakh..afterall its a part of the same same issue
"It was never about the DSDBO Road or DBO or anything like that. Instead, it is all about the Himalayan politics of which Buddhist sect will reign supreme over all such sects that currently prevail in Mongolia, Ladakh, Sikkim, Bhutan & India, and the winning stratagem employed weill ensure not only stability in TAR, but will also enable China to kill 2 birds with one stone, i.e. ensuring stability in TAR & adjoining Xinjiang while also ensuring the implementation of BRI through these areas & of course guaranteeing the success of CPEC." -- Prasun Could you explain the himalayan politics in detail.
Prasun sir, are DRDO and L&T working together to develop a light tank based on K-9 chassis?
Dada two A330 MRTT of the French Air force took off and one landed at UAE but one entered through gujarat and landed on IGI Airport. All that I followed on The tracking app. What does that mean? Rafale already home? Please clarify.
Hi sir..
What about indian light tank being talked about based on k9 vajra with Belgian barrel... Why can't indigenous 105 mm gun from OFB or KALYANI be utilized for same
Prasunda, some people who regularly provide news related to India's defence sector has tweeted that DRDO and L&T are designing a Light Tank. This tank will have a Cockerill 105 mm gun that will be placed on K-9 chasis.
Is anything of this sort happening? Thanks.
https://twitter.com/VinodDX9/status/1287768486303989765?s=20
hi Sir
I w feel compelled to comment again, due to the comment from harsha and pinakal shah.
To Pinkal shah; Whatever harsha said was the same thought that passed through my mind after looking through your questions( mixed or not) so it is natural someone asked it so please do not feel offended by it.It is like you are bursting with questions for which you need answers (if you noticed that have all been as answered with a bit of research you could have done online). But if the moderator feels it is okay, it okay for me and keeps my mind at rest
To harsha; I feel you, but dont you think that the moderator of this blog has got it under control. We have seen the answers to his queries and feel it is exact and brief.Same to you,if the moderator feels it is okay, it okay for me and keeps my mind at rest. I hope it does for you.
To Prasunda : Thank you for analysis and information, it is always eye opening and keeps me thinking. Please forgive me if i overstepped my bound on the above topic. Please continue the amazing work.
Regards
Remo
Prasunda,
PRC actually unleashed worldwide Biological attack & the fast pace of multiple vaccines being made & tested on an unprecedented war footing while other diplomatic & military manoeuvres go on in UN, the Himalayas & the South China Sea make it evident that we are into what is now the World War III equivalent of the Phoney War during World War II. It very certainly is being given that sort of build by the Media & must be the first world war fought also vide as well as on Social Media.
Prasunda, you have commented fleetinglyofleetingly this unprecedented international pace of manoeuvres by a nebulous Alliance & a PRC dominated Axis earlier. Could you elaborate or comment further?!
Dear Prasun,
In my above post about Astra Microwave press release, the link got missed out. Posting the same below
http://www.astramwp.com/admin/assets/uploads/reports/1593019660_5886Press_Release_24.06.2020.pdf
To VINOD: The HTFE25’s max thrust is not enough to generate 28mWe that is reqd for warships. HTSE can be converted to a turboprop but again it will be under-powered for 20-seat STOL turboprop aircraft. More powerful versions of the HTSE1200 can be developed for the IMRH, but not as replacements for the Tv3117 or VK-2500 engines of Mi-17s & Mi-17V-5s, as this will also entail the development of related gearboxes as well.
To VISJ: 1) No. 2) HAL SDR is on the Su-30MKIs & Jaguar IS/DARIN-3. BNET-ARs are going to go on Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A, MiG-29UPGs & the IL-78MKIs & A-50I/EMB-145I AEW & CS platforms, plus the LCH & Rudras of the IAF. 3) Yes, those are ISAR sensors, but the P-8I has APS-143 radar from Telephonics while the MH-60R Seahawks will have APS-153 radars. 4) That’s an impossibility since the existing road infrastructure does not exists in GB to support such a land campaign. In addition, the heliports/logistics bases at Oltinthang & Siari & Fraono are all highly vulnerable to IAF tactical air-strikes. 5) Not at all. All extra reqmts for troops/formations have been met by the Central Command & Northern Command.
To SATYAKI: That is for you to decide, not me. My views & opinions along with supporting factoids are all a matter of record in various threads of this blog.
To UNKNOWN/JOHN: Given the choice between procuring brand-new MRCA-type & existing but upgraded MRCAs, I will always opt for the latter as they are both cheaper & easier to induct into service & maintain them in high serviceability rates. Hence, additional MiG-29UPGs & Su-30MKIs are the way forward, followed by expediting the upgrade bof existing Su-30MKIs. At the same time, make both the Tejas Mk.1 & Mk.1A into ooptimised weaponised platforms by equipping them with MAWS sensors & ASPJs for increasing their survivability factors. And yes, both the LCA Sport & MWF need to be developed ASAP as both will have sidestick throttles & controls (just like the Rafale) & this in turn will make it easier for IAF pilots to be qualified for flying both the Rafale & MWF.
To AMIT BISWAS: he is an old friend of mine, he was previously the C-in-C of Indonesia’s KOPASSUS special warfare command & he is also a son-in-law of the late President Soeharto, i.e. he is by no means a lightweight.
To UNKNOWN/JB: They will be used for staging tactical offensives in areas like eastern & northern Ladakh, across eastern Himachal Pradesh & also to the north of Sikkim & perhaps along northeastern Bhutan in case of China invading Bhutan in order to outflank India’s tawang Tract in Arunachal Pradesh.
To PINKAL SHAH: 1) Those are all estimates & nothing can be said about their accuracy. 2) Both Shigatse & Lhasa-Gonggar are not dedicated air bases. The first dedicated air base is only now coming up in Lhasa & I had given its coordinates & GoogleEarth imagery in a recent previous thread. 3) TACDE has only started writing the manuals since the aircraft were delivered behind schedule. It will take TACDE at least another 2 years to complete writing the manuals for the Jaguar IS/DARIN-3. 4) You can see the progress for yourself through GoogleEarth imagery. It is all there for everyone to see. 5) NONE. 6) The NTRO operates two Polaris-A/RISAT-2 family/TechSAR LEO satellites & one more is due for launch. 11) When the first goes back to Russia for its mid-life refit. 12) Yes, it is on the lookout & e decision on this will be made only next year. It is well within India’s industrial capability to make them locally. 13) Yes. 15) They were all shown in the DEFEXPO-2020 thread. 16) Yes, since the early 1990s & they were all detailed in this blog since 2011.
To UNKNOWN: Because those forces are meant for use against the IA in Ladakh. Even back in 1962 all the PLA fighting forces in Ladakh came from Xinjiang and not from Tibet.
To KIDDO: No, since all the spares inventories & related MRO equipment have already been decommissioned for scrapping & have therefore already been withdrawn for disposal. Here is a beautiful video of those wonderful flying birds:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gYrlGpWgWQ
Also note in that in list of equipment for the MH-60R, the dunking sonar has not yet been listed, i.e. it has yet to be selected, meaning it will be either the THALES FLASH, or the L-3 HELRAS:
http://www.thales7seas.com/html_2014/products/214/thales_Flash_Dipping_Sonar.pdf
https://www2.l3t.com/oceansystems/pdfs/HELRAS_DS100_Nov07_low.pdf
To RAGHU: Astra Microwave had supplied the TRMMs for the S-band large-array radar for ISRO for space debris tracking & is also supplying similar AESA-based S-band precision-tracking radars for the the DRDO’s HSL-built BM tracking vessel.
To VIKRAM GUHA: 1) Plutonium production facilities can mean 2 different things: plutonium production as fissile material, i.e. from new research PHWRs; or machining the fissile materials for making plutonium cores. 2) Those 2 slides are quite wishy-washy, especially the one you are pointing to.
To UNKNOWN: Here they are, as they were uploaded just yesterday by the Chinese TV channels:
AG-600 Amphibian: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHHD_sXWe4s
PLAGF HJ-10A ATGM: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOa3q5dHsrU
PLAGF UAVs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rnr1PksYCQo
PLAGF Tracked SPH: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNgpkwhh8x8
China-Built Hand-Grenades Recovered in J & K UT:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPj60cIRfzw
To MG6357: 1) Because of non-application of sound common-sense. Anmy other answer eludes me. 2) Because it was far too expensive. But a BAE Systems proposal to equip the Jaguar IS with a fly-by-wire flight control system co-developed with HAL was not taken up. Had it been, then the LCA’s R & D timetable would have been shorter. 3) The only reason why India & China have not been able to get along is because it is like petrol & diesel. The ways of life & political systems & mindsets are totally different & there has never been any common meeting-point. This is what history teaches us, provided we make an effort to read about such history. 4) Some were captured from the Spaniards while some were leased from the UK.
To JUST_CURIOUS: 1) At least another 3 years. 2) Not at the moment, provided the IN has a fleet of 24 P-8Is since in future the submarines of Bangladesh, Myanmar, Thailand & Indonesia too will be sailing in the Bay of Bengal & Andaman Sea. 3) The Barak-MX can take over from the existing Barak-1s once the latter are due for decommissioning. 4) Other weapons on offer can be cheaper, but not necessarily better. Whenever procuring such weapons from abroad, topmost priority is always given to their in-service track-record with other global end-users. 5) Yes. 6) It was all developed by DARE & built by HAL for both Tejas Mk.1 & Jaguar IS/DARIN-3 & also the Super Su-30MKI. 7) It is just a formality for maintaining some degree of equivalence between the US & Russia. 8) All of India’s IRNSS satellites are permanently hovering over the IOR & hence the IRNSS cannot be labelled as a GPS, since it provides only regional coverage, not global. 9) Because part of China’s demands are to respect the sanctity of CPEC, while for India the fact that CPEC is illegal is non-negotiable.
To SUMIT SEN: The IAF राफेल/रफाल from Abu Dhabi will head for Jamnagar today & from there they will embark for Ambala tomorrow.
To HARSHA & REMO: Even if such a question were to be asked, do you reckon I will readily part with data deemed officially as SECRET? In fact, positional data about weapon systems has never been a secret. What is secret is the operationbal art, i.e. the way the weapon systems will be used & the ways in which critical mass of such weapon systems will be created in the shortest possible timeframe in order to create & exploit tactical breakthroughs on the ground. Hence, kindly don’t be too harsh on Pinkal Shah.
To SATYA, SANDEEP & SUJOY MAJUMDAR: LoLz! Let’s start with the basics, i.e. why are light tanks reqd? They are reqd because of the reqmt for rapid deployment, i.e. all such vehicles must be air-droppable by clusters of parachutes. That’s why the Sprut is supposed to be used along with the BMD-3. And since they are air-droppable, it means that they will be used by paratroopers/air-assault forces. So, in India’s case, has there been any instance of IA paratroopers or Para SF forces ever using such hardware? No. So, why should there be a reqmt for only light tanks & not for light air-droppable APCs or ICVs? Is this even possible? And of all places, why should light tanks be reqd in Ladakh where all bypasses & bridges are already being converted into permanent structures built of concrete? Why else did the IA deploy T-72CIAs & T-90S in Chushul, Burtse, Demchok & the depsang Plains?
Hence, kindly remember that whenever whosoever is talking about the IA going for light tanks but not going for accompanying light OCVs or light APCs, he/she is engaging in pure baloney, boulderdash & bullshit. Kindly don’t fall for such irrational rants/claims.
To PSS: Tibet was critical for British India to mitigate any potential direct threats from and confrontations with adversarial powers such as Russia and China. To counter them, it devised “buffer zones”, “inner and outer” territory concepts, employed “forward policies” and built strategic forts often termed as glacis. Primarily, these policies evolved to protect its mercantile interests. It was also done to ensure that the countries are not engaged in a zero-sum game. Similarly, the Russians also created a “sphere of influence” in Eastern Europe, Central Asia and the Far East. Despite its decline in the aftermath of the dissolution of the USSR, Russia under Putin is trying to protect its “near-abroad” in order to retain its great power status. The Chinese, on the other hand, have been practising the Li concept that primarily functions on a ritualistic tributary system of the “core” controlling the “peripheries” through economic, trade and cultural relationships. This imperial-era idea seems to still shape strategic thinking in present-day China in terms of both gaining additional territory and market access outside the country. The only counter to Sun Tzu’s “salami-slicing” strategy was found by the Mongols. A Mongol Khan once reminded the Chinese that a “small, sharp razor” could tonsure millions of hairs on the scalp at once. Of course, it was said in the context of Mongolian demographic deficiency vis-à-vis China. The Chinese “go” game involves taking less risks but also incremental steps while working on the enemy’s weaknesses to ensure complete victory. This recipe for winning war is being employed in the ongoing dispute in the maritime domain: in the South China Sea. On land, the slow invasion tactic has been the hallmark of Chinese success in Inner Mongolia, Siberia, Xinjiang and the Tibetan plateau. In the 1960s, Chinese leaders made a nuanced assertion of Bhutan, Ladakh and Sikkim always being subject to Tibet and thus to the great “Chinese motherland”. Since the military stand-off in 1962, the Himalayan perimeter between India and China is being defined under the mutually agreed-upon LAC mechanism. But China has not yet accepted the McMahon Line drawn by the British as the boundary between the two countries.
Cont'd below...
China’s thinking in many ways is indicative of how they eventually hope to change the Himalayan configuration to their advantage. In fact, the Chinese may have been thinking about playing the reverse strategic depth policy by leveraging the critical interplay between Buddhism and the Himalayas for a long time. After consolidating its hold over Tibet in the 1960s, China seemingly worked on the canvas of the southern Himalayas, what it called South Tibet. Unlike India, China never viewed the Himalayan ranges as a barrier but a bridge to create additional spheres of influence. Here, Beijing probably took its cue from the Qing Dynasty–using Tibetan Lamaism as a useful vehicle for enlarging the empire. China, in a masterstroke strategy, allowed the Dalai Lama to flee in 1959 to settle down in the southern Himalayas. Many conspiracy theories are afloat about his escape, including a CIA plot. It was a setback but Mao certainly had something else in mind. The Chinese believe in converting challenges into opportunities. For most Indian Mandarins, the game remains unfathomable. Instead, trusting Indians have excitedly facilitated every move made by the Chinese. They have rejoiced in receiving and harbouring a stream of influential Tibetan lamas who they thought would be useful assets for India, without realizing that the Chinese had quietly launched asymmetric warfare vis-à-vis India. Indian policies perfectly suited Beijing. The idea was to employ Sun Tzu’s dictum: “The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting.” Since then, the Indian state has done everything possible, like spend hundreds of crores of rupees annually, for Tibetan rehabilitation and welfare programmes. This is in addition to the financial assistance the cause receives directly from the US and elsewhere. Most importantly, India was made to feel proud of supporting the Tibetans without realising that the Chinese were directly ensnaring it in a game plan in which the ultimate victory is with China. Indian policy seemed to have failed on the ground of its inability to strictly follow British policies.
Cont'd below...
As stated earlier, first, British India defined its identifications in the north-western Himalayas for the strategic consideration of containing Russian threats towards India. Second, setting frontiers in the eastern Himalayas was driven by the need for securing the lower land in Assam for mercantile interests: tea plantation and rice cultivation. Here, the British avoided exerting control over areas that were wasteful and irrelevant for revenue gains. While qualifying those lines, the British were careful not to confront a situation of diminishing returns. Third, the boundary lines (Inner/Outer and McMahon Lines) in the Himalayas were conceived as against the Tibetan territorial claims. In fact, soon after the British left in 1947, the Tibetan authorities in Lhasa officially asked India to return the alleged (lost) territories of Tibet that virtually claimed the entire Indian Himalayan region. All in all, British India pursued a national boundary based on objective reality, devoid of any illusionary line that simply wasn’t there. However, in the aftermath of British rule, policymaking in India lost subtlety, became lacking in perceptivity and above all the ability to judge spatial patterns and taxonomic distinctness on the ground. While independent India continued to follow the British-drawn ‘colonial’ boundary line, in reality, policymakers may have grossly negated the inherent basis on which the frontiers were identified by the British, howsoever colonial in scheme they may have been. The most galling aspect is the absence of a counter-strategy for reversing the game. The system lacks comprehension and understanding, let alone the wherewithal to counter China’s asymmetric warfare. It also does not have the kind of scholarship that is needed to understand the depth of Buddhist political disposition. With the exception of a few such as Rahul Sanskrityayan, Raghu Vira, Lokesh Chandra and Ram Rahul, scholarly naivety in understanding the finer nuances may have done more harm than good for getting clarity. Western scholarship has rather obscured Himalayan geopolitics. Several books have brought to light the grandeur of the Buddhist Himalayas, mostly by tapping into various aspects of Tibetan Buddhism that were found to be appealing and even exotic, especially to Western audiences, in the second half of the twentieth century. In fact, the influence of the Dalai Lama and his efforts at drawing attention to the Tibetan political cause, combined with the power of publicity in the West, ensured that the Himalayas were projected as a kind of cultural and geopolitical exotica to the outside world. Tibetan Buddhism even became the subject of pop and rock songs in the 1960s and 1970s. Novels like Lost Horizon by James Hilton inspired many myths, such as the one about the legendary Shambhala–a sort of Shangri-La located in the Himalayas. It is also noteworthy that the myth-making process ran parallel to China’s massive efforts at transforming the economy and infrastructure on the Tibetan plateau. Yet, the myth of Shambhala and its profundity had grossly overshadowed the reality of Himalayan geopolitics. For example, the British strategists played the “Great Game” within the context of consolidating its hold while limiting if not undercutting the Himalayan proximities towards China-controlled Tibet.
Hi Prasun
regarding your answer to PSS regarding chinese end game , no offence but i find it a little hard to see how it affects india. i mean buddhism has little to no weight politically in india except for in sikkim and AP and it not like indian GOV is oppressing people in those states or anything. regarding countries like bhutan accepting BRI and undermining india i think you are underestimating the normal people of bhutan i mean even a avg person that does not read newspaper everyday can tell that CCP is a totalitarian regime ,what they are doing to ugurs is for everyone to see and yes there has been a lot of development in tibet but how much it profited the local tibetan people and how much it profited the newly settled han people is up for debate. i don't know much about the kind of buddhism followed in myanmar but the version followed in thailand and sri lanka is distinct and has a lot of hinduism beliefs in it. as to bhutan and sri lanka joining BRI i think if india offered to form a EU like organization with these countries + bangladesh , common sense would suggest that they will benefit from that more than from BRI. yes i consider pakistan and afghanistan and even Iran to some extant as lost causes but can easily be countered by a SAARC excluding pak economic union. i mean we have a working and somewhat successful model in EU. are you suggesting that if china is successful in its end game that india would not be able to instigate a insurgency in tibet but don't think India ever had the will or resources or plans to do so.
hi prasun
a follow on question : i don't understand how parking 4 divisions in aksai chin and building 4 post on finger point 4 and sitting on Y junction near burtse camp help achieve china's tibet end game.
PrasunDa,
2nd draft of Defence Procurement Procedure (DPP)/ Defence Acquisition Procedure (DAP) 2020 has been uploaded on the MoD website inviting suggestions & comments from all stakeholders/ public
https://mod.gov.in/sites/default/files/Amend270720.pdf
Hello Prasun,
Your perspectives are the silver light in the dark clouds covered with respect to the news/information emanating from Indian presstitutes. I wonder what is priority for them apart from sensationalism, plagiarism and misuse of the whatever the trust that is left among its readers. Now couple of indicative questions, which need not be answered with facts, hints or sense of guidance is fine
1) the preparation to defend the land currently held by Indian armed forces are in place; however, the political wherewithal (which is sadly missing) to seize the initiative to counter attack (need not necessary through military campaign) is not visible. Do you see anything positive at your end
2) has any sort of lessons learnt in terms of strategic thought process, following through by adapting and improvising, is it visible in political class and policy makers; or at least any semblance of it is visible according to you.
I personally do not believe in suicidal tendencies of capable people to save the country (whom are labelled as heroes after they pack up to first floor - dead) so that some less deserving people go back to sleep. I want capable people to live long, happy life saving the world, being the role model of next set of deserving people.
3) The present dispensation has done commendable job in pacifying the internal turbulence, acts interrupting the growth of capable people, lesser violence and stability in governance (in centre). I hope the lesser evil of Pakistan is annihilated for good so that China is tackled. Do you see that happening in next 3 to 4 years.
Thanks, Ganesh
@prasun da
1. Angad of ORF said India muat try grabbing 2 squadrons of MiG 29S ND 2 SQUADRONS F mIRAGE 2000 to shore up numbers and better use resource. while the Mig 29s may be easy to arrive from russia, the only possible Mirage 2000 may come from Greece that operates 44 of them and it may well sell off the jets as the pandemic has massively hit its already weak economy, i see no one else selling these
2. Why the fuss about PLA men as conscript being unable to fight, truth is when someone stands with a gun on behind line (communist rule) the boys in front will fight
3. is it even possible to deploy Rafale in Ladakh even by December?
4. when it was known that DSDBO road was always on hit of PLA arty why then the idea of building a road out of range was not taken, you and many others are saying tunneling under Saser la will help, but how much
5. read here panda wants to build a tunnel under the permafrost of Shaksgam glacie, is it possible
https://www.hindustantimes.com/india-news/india-moves-squadron-of-missile-firing-t-90-tanks-to-last-post-near-karakoram-pass/story-h4LtB6PZXtiYpMadupySlK.html
6. are we doing enough to confrant panda in himachal
https://www.news18.com/news/opinion/after-ladakh-face-off-china-may-intrude-in-himachal-pradesh-much-before-india-expects-2736583.html
thanks
Joydeep Ghosh
Hi Prasun - What roles can Apache attack helicopters play in an event where India has to take action to push the Chinese out of our territory? Secondly can these helicopters be used in anti-terror operations in Kashmir and reduce our casualties, at least where combat take place in non urban areas? Thanks.
Hello Prasun .. thank you for your reply . You mentioned that the Tejas sport project needs to come about soon .. do you have any information if this being developed at all ?
Mr.Prasun have you got any images of PLAAF XV AIRBORNE CORPS ZBD-3 ATGM Carrier Version and Command version vehicles?
To HOODS007: LoLz! How could you even dream about oversimplifying this issue? What if the ‘Dalits’ whom the so-called ‘Hindus’ also like to classify as ‘Hindus’, begin embracing Buddhism en masse as a form of socio-economic emancipation? Wouldn’t then those who claim to be ‘Hindus’ today become a minority community comprising only 15% of India’s population? For, one must learn from history that religiosity is the world’s greatest intoxicant & can therefore be used for either doing gvood, or doing evil. Now, coming to Buddhism, there are 3 prime sects: Theravada ("Way of the Elders"), Mahayana ("Greater Vehicle") & Vajrayana ("Diamond Vehicle"). The last, which is esoteric, developed in Tibet and the surrounding Himalayan region beginning in the 7th century AD. There was further dilution, from which 4 principal schools emerged within Tibetan Buddhism. Nyingmapa ("School of the Ancients") is the oldest (since the 14th century) of the Tibetan Buddhist schools & the second largest. The Nyingma school is based primarily on the teachings of Padmasambhava, who is revered by the Nyingma school as the "second Buddha." Nyingma monks are not generally required to be celibate. Kagyüpa ("Oral Transmission School") is the third largest school of Tibetan Buddhism. Its teachings were brought to Tibet in the 11th century. Sakyapa is today the smallest of the four schools of Tibetan Buddhism. It is named for the Sakya ("Gray Earth") monastery in sourthern Tibet. The Sakyapa school had great political influence in the 13th and 14th centuries. Gelugpa (School of the Virtuous), also called the Yellow Hats, is the youngest of the Tibetan schools, but is today the largest and the most important. It was founded in the late 14th century by Tsongkhapa, who "enforced strict monastic discipline, restored celibacy and the prohibition of alcohol and meat, established a higher standard of learning for monks, and, while continuing to respect the Vajrayana tradition of esotericism that was prevalent in Tibet, allowed Tantric and magical rites only in moderation." The Gelugpa school has held political leadership of Tibet since the Dalai Lamas were made heads of state by the Mongol leader Güüshi Khan in 1642. In Ladakh, the original Tibetan school born there was the Nyingmapa, while the Kagyüpa became widespread in Sikkim & the Drupka school remains predominant in Bhutan & hence the present-day 14th Dalai Lama has never been allowed to seet foot in Bhutan. Racially too, the Ladakhis, Sikkimese & Bhutanese belong to the same racial stock (mix of Dardic & Tibetan Mongol DNA) & are totally different from the Tibetan Mongols. Throughout recorded history, the Tibetan Mongols were always at war with the kingdoms of Ladakh, Sikkim & Bhutan & in turn these 3 countries always helped one another when either of them was attacked by the combined Tibetan-Mongol invaders. More about all this can be read here:
https://www.shambhala.com/snowlion_articles/drukpa-kargyu-kagyu/
https://www.diamondway-buddhism.org/diamond-way/karma-kagyu-lineage/
https://www.samyeling.org/buddhism-and-meditation/the-kagyu-lineage/
So, do not ever ASSUME that Buddhism is a monolithic religious faith or philosophy. There are strands within strands, all of which have their geo-strategic faultlines ready for exploitation.
To VIKRAM GUHA: Does it say that all govt shareholdings within the existing DPSUs will be divested? If not, then it should be instantly consigned to the dust-bin!
To GANESH: 1) No, I don’t see it as yet, perhaps because it has not yet taken a concrete shape & that’s because the decision-makers have not yet figured out the nature of the beast. And that’s why there’s a news blackout about the intrusions into the Depsang Plain (see the imagery & map that I have uploaded above to get the bearings right). 2 & 3) It will be futile to expect rationality from the present-day crop of decision-makers. Let me share an example: It is exactly like the till-now discussions about the Rafale MMRCA's procurement methodology. For instance, not a single ex-IAF or even serving IAF official has the intellect to state the obvious fact that fourth-generation combat aircraft can never be licence-built anywhere on this Earth. And why so? Simply because all fourth-generation combat aircraft's airframes are broken down into 3 distinct parts, i.e. front fuselage, mid-fuselage & rear fuselage. They are all machined & fabricated separately via highly automated industrial processes (thereby doing away with manual rivetting) & only then they are mated with one another at the final integration facility. And to replicate all this in another country becomes totally cost-prohibitive. Hence, all air forces worldwide that have procured fourth-generation MRCAs have procured them directly off-the-shelf from the respective OEMs. Consequently, India could never have been the exception by insisting on licence-building the Rafales. For, had there been any QC/QA lapses at the industrial-level by HAL, then the OEM Dassault Aviation would never accept product liability for them, especially in case of a catastrophic air-crash. It is for this reason that the IAF insisted all along that Dassault Aviation assume all responsibility for product liability for the Rafale, & when HAL was unable to pass Dassault Aviation's QC/QA audits, all negotiations about licence-building the Rafales were called off in 2013 itself & that's why the Govt of the day became a prisoner of its own words.utterances (about licence-buiilding such aircraft) & was therefore unable to conclude a procurement contract. And ill-informed & ignorant folks like Yashwant Sinha & Arun Shourie & Prashant Bhushan who have no domain expertise in this area have only created further confusion through their rants that are bereft of all known laws of the physical sciences, mathematics & economics. In short, the debate should have been concluded a long time ago by simply stating that since no one in this world can licence-build fourth-generation MRCAs, the only option before India was to procure the Rafales off-the-shelf. But then again, to expect such common-sensical & rational explanations from the great majority of 'Indian analysts' will be too much to expect.
To JOYDEEP GHOSH: 1) Sure, why not, for as long as he is willing to foot the bill for such delusional exercises! India-origin discussions by the steadily proliferating number of 'analysts' nowadays have content that can only be described as 'bounded irrationality'. FYI, it is the French themselves who had suggested back in 2006 that the IAF ought to retire its Mirage 2000s by 2009 & replace them with Rafales. I had written about it here:
https://trishul-trident.blogspot.com/2015/04/taking-final-call-on-what-was.html
Dassault Aviation offers to supply 40 Rafale M-MRCAs to the IAF in a single-source G-to-G deal. The offer is made by Charles Edelstenne, the then CEO of Dassault Aviation, when he calls on the then Minister of State for Defence Rao Inderjit Singh in New Delhi on February 20, 2006.
So, instead of taking a rational decision back in 2006, the ‘netas’ took that very same decision in 2016 while spending an exorbitant amount on upgrading the Mirage-2000s which tgoday is bereft of an AESA-MMR & IRST sensors. In contrast, Taiwan is now negotiating the upgrade of its Mirage-2000-5 that will contain both AESA-MMR & IRST sensor! Relay this to that Sardarji. 2) It is far worse, because the PLAAF’s hierarchical air-defence system is not able to synchronise its operations with that of the PLAGF, as reported here:
http://www.81.cn/jmywyl/2020-07/26/content_9860861.htm
3) Do you want to thrive living in ‘Dreamland’, or do you wish to live in the real world? I’m asking this after repeatedly explaining that wars are fought between opposing systems, not opposing platforms. 4) Because the mandarins making up the MEA’s China Study Group thought in their all-knowing wisdom that China will never resort to drastic steps to anger India just because China was enjoying the bilateral trade surplus with India. Well, looks like these mandarins have all been proven wrong. 5) Technologically, it is very much possible. 6) Like what? The last village of HP from the LAC is 22km to the west of the LAC. Not a soul lives near the Khimikul Pass, not even the ITBP. BTW, this is what I had stated on July 27, 2020 at 3:14AM This is why the IN’s P-8Is were despatched over Himachal Pradesh & Uttarakhand:
The last frontier village is Kunnu Charang in Himachal Pradesh’s Kinnaur district. After conducting recce, Kunnu Charang villagers have reported that China has constructed around 20km of road along the border in the last two months. Kunnu Charang’s villagers, the last village in the Morang Valley area, say that in the dark of night China is constructing a road towards Khemkulla Pass at a high pace. Drones also arrive from nighttime in China. Kunnu Charang village is close to the China border. There isn’t even a decent road there to drive to. The villagers have cellphones, but they have to travel around 14km to chat elsewhere, owing to the lack of bandwidth. A team of nine people from this village, along with 16 mules and five porters, went towards the border about 22km away. Along with this team, there were some ITBP personnel. When this team reached Khemkulla Pass and looked at Tibet, eyes were wide open. China had constructed about 20km of road in two months. The members of this team said that till October last year there was only a road to Tango, the last village of Tibet, but in the last two months, a 20km long road was built towards the outskirts as the snow cleared. According to the squad, road building is taking place across the border towards Yamrang La, also in the Sangli Valley district of Chitkul. The main area of interest is the PLAGF’s administrative base at 31 48 41.84 N, 78 48 31.62 E, which also doubles as a logistics facility.
To PRATAP: It is all about vertical envelopment, i.e. flying in behind the deployed PLAGF forces & attacking them from behind to achieve surprise. Why should attack helicopters be used for counter-terror operations? Why should even the IA be used? Are the terrorists carrying ATGMs or MBTs or ICVs? Since these are all counter-terror operations, why can’t the NSG be used against them in semi-urban & rural areas? BTW the last time the IAF was used for straffing the Mizo guerrillas back in the late 1950s, the opening sorties flown on Dassault Ouragans/Toofanis were flown by 2 IAF Pilots: Rajesh Pilot & Suresh Kalmadi.
To KARNFLAKES: To the best of my knowledge, no funds have been committed for the LCA Sport either by the MoD or HAL.
To UNKNOWN: Here it is:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaxe-rFD6Dk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_yooKhyElWM
To KAUSTAV: Wuhan lab signs deal to expand potential bio-warfare abilities:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9kIj_B8iLU
China Activates Underground Civil Defence Shelters in Beijing:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKYHzb6D8fI&t=3s
Pakistan's Plans for August 5:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ed8loR4XYAYY1Sg?format=jpg&name=large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ed8loSBWAAUP6SR?format=jpg&name=large
Sir,
"BTW the last time the IAF was used for straffing the Mizo guerrillas back in the late 1950s, the opening sorties flown on Dassault Ouragans/Toofanis were flown by 2 IAF Pilots: Rajesh Pilot & Suresh Kalmadi."
I believe it should be 1966.
regards
Chakraborty
Prasunda
You are ofcourse right as usual about the Himalayan Buddhist angle, but more than Tibet or Buddhism, it was Eastern Turkestan in 1948 that opened up India's North or Ladakh & Aksai Chin. No Chinese in the area till mid-1950s. To quote Claude Arpi
"The fact is that no Chinese national ever set a foot in the area till the mid-1950s and it is only due to the then Indian government’s weakness and negligence that Mr Zhao is able to make such outrageous claims today. One event is crucial to understand the recent development in Eastern Ladakh (EL); it is the annexation of Eastern Turkestan, now known as Xinjiang, the Western Province, by the Communist forces at the end of 1949. In Mandarin, Xinjiang literally means ‘New Frontier’ or ‘New Territory’, a proof in itself that the area is ‘new’ to the Middle Kingdom.
Claude Arpi, like you, spot on as usual, though he is a bit romantic like most westerners on Tibet unlike the British or YOU with no blinkers or illusions about the Tibetans
https://usiofindia.org/publication/cs3-strategic-perspectives/since-when-was-galwan-chinese/
Mr.Prasun is it true that 31 Armoured Division has been deployed in Ladakh or moved North?
Prasun Da,
What is this place with lake and Radar station and SIGINT antenna.Location seems high altitude.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hhMUN730Xw
To CHAKRABORTY: Yes, the exact dates are given here:
https://scroll.in/article/764186/planes-over-aizawl-a-cautionary-tale-for-a-government-planning-to-use-air-power-against-maoists
To UNKNOWN: Not true.
To SUSAN: That is the Ganba La radar station for the PLAAF located on a hillock southwest of Lhasa-Gonggar. It is at 26 16 49 N, 90 55 37 E.
Sirji,
1.) What amount does the army spends each year for maintenance of its armored fleet ?
2.) Like you said, war along the IB isn't likely to happen, Arjun Mk2 can then be used in adequate numbers to defend western sector. We can focus on improving existing road and support infrastructure for them and also investing in area denial weapons ?
3.) While we can place upengined T-90s in Jammu sector as well as along Chinese border. This way we can optimize the armored and save money which is required to maintain such a large tank fleet.
4.) Should the army's size be halved to 6.5 lakhs ? Do we really need a million strong army ?
5.) What do you think of proposal by CDS of CAPF personnel serving in the Army for set period of time ?
Mr.Prasun my source definitely suggests they have moved North but even I am skeptical but the source is olive green.
Prasun sir, could India consider acquiring Su-57 in future after it enters service with Russian air force with new engine, radar and other stuff that it currently lacks?
And what was the real reason behind abandoning the FGFA project with Russia?
To KAUSTAV: VMT, and as I had explained a few threads before, for some strange reason, Pandit ‘Chacha’ Nehru made 2 principal judgemental errors: 1) accepting the Karakoram Range as the watershed, instead of the Kuen Lun Mountain Range as was the case with the Princely State of J & K. Why he refused to accept the Prinhcely State’s borders with East Turkestan has never been explained. 2) He refused to accept the succession rights confered by international law between the Princely State & the Kingdom of Tibet. For instance, Menser remained a part of India even after Tibet under the 5th Dalai Lama brutally snatched the eastern half of Ladakh, covering the area of Rudok, Guge, Kailash, Burang and up to the Nepal border junction, during the 1679–1684 Ladakh-Tibet war. But for the timely military intervention of the Mughal Emperor Aurangzeb (who agreed to militarily assist Ladakh) and diplomatic intercession by the Bhutanese, the whole of Ladakh would have been part of Tibet-China today. The 1684 Treaty of Temisgang concluded at the end of that war entitled the ruler of Ladakh to govern the Menser villages for two key purposes:
a) retaining a transit place for Indian traders and pilgrims to Mount Kailash; and,
b) meeting the expenses connected with religious offerings to the sacred Mount Kailash.
The Treaty also confirmed the delimitation of the Tibet-Ladakh boundary at Demchok. Successive Maharajas of Kashmir continued to abide by these treaty obligations and collected taxes from Menser villages from 1846 until the early 1960s. Similarly, Bhutan also enjoyed legal rights over the Darchen-Labrang enclave consisting of a series of monasteries near Mount Kailash and Gartok. Both Menser and Darchen-Labrang served as key outposts for Indian and Bhutanese traders and pilgrims for over 300 years. They exercised full administrative jurisdiction and collected annual tribute from their respective enclaves until the early 1960s. But interestingly, India has to date not yet given in writing to China that it has surrendered its sovereignty over the Menser villages, nor has China asked for it in writing. So, technically, India can still raise her claim of sovereignty over the Menser villages.
In addition, the first problems between China & India arose due to the former’s refusal in 1955 to honour the trading agreements that it had inked with India in 1954 under the Panchsheel Agreement. The Bhutia traders based in Ladakh & today’s Himachal Pradesh & Uttarakhand were particularly targetted by Beijing. That was ther first ever treaty violation committed by China against India & I will upload more data on it soon. From September 1955 onwards, there were a succession of PLA military intrusions: the first ever at Barahoti, followed by Hipki La in Himachal Pradesh, Kaurik and Hipang Khud. These were the first territorial intrusions committed by China. In each case, China insisted the PLA was on its own territory. Khurnak Fort, in Ladakh, was occupied—and used as a base to supply outposts in Sanggur and Digra. In the summer of 1958, Deputy Superintendent of Police Karam Singh and IA Lt Ram ‘Tiny’ Iyengar headed out into the Aksai Chin, to determine just where the highway ran. Lt Iyengar’s patrol was detected, and detained, but Karam Singh’s reconnaissance established that the road (G-219 today) ran from Haji Langar in the north to Amtogar in the south, cutting some 160km through Aksai Chin.
To BHVK: 1) Don’t have an exact figure but it runs into hundreds of crores. 2 & 3) You are perhaps forgetting that war can always happen along the WB, especially the Chicken’s Neck area in the Chammb-Sialkot sector. Why else do you think the PA has hastily re-engined its Al Khalid MBTs by replacing the earlier Ukraine-origin air-cooled diesel engine with a water-cooled engine, also from Ukraine? Here is their induction ceremony yesterday:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWe4GSIE4so
4) The IA needs to a 1 million-strong. 5) Totally wrong. Instead, the CAPFs need consolidation, i.e. the BSF, ITBP & SSB should be merged. In which other country does one have more than 1 institution to guard the borders? There is unnecessary duplication of effort in India. Also, the Rashtriya Rfiles (RR) should be done away with & instead the CRPF should be empowered along with J & K Police to take on the counter-terror operations with the help of the NSG. RR was a temporary creation to conduct the large-scale counter-terror operations of the 1990s & after 2004 it was no longer reqd.
To UNKNOWN: It can always be redeployed to the Chammb-Soalkot sector along the WB should the PA try to do something unusual on August 5.
VT-5 MBT: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITW3awLJdzE
China-Iran Hype: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WlSBhaKEONU
PLAN J-15 Completes First Night Aerial Refuelling:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qyLT0vGm7-A
For those who are unaware, the PLAN began nighttime helicopter operations from warships only in 2012.
PLAN Type 055 DDG: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyVIuoQ1D54
PLAGF Pathfinders: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kmnTvM3PSmY
Tawang Is Secure: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BCZ9Rmwabdo&t=14s
Afghan Transit Trade Through Gwadar: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjdUdQDMMnc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qY4dfYD71YA
Sir..
If Afghanisthan using Gwadar then is Chabahar a waste of money..?
Are our PGM holdings sufficient for 10(I) war and what are those 500 NG-LGBs India bought from Israel other then Griffin and Spice series and Popeye?
Hello Prasun,
Reading through the “learned” General Panag's write-up on one of the presstitutes den (theprint); I for once agree with the assessment that the defense fortifications should be dual use (offensive and defensive); however, the staring (eye-to eye contact) sessions in inhospitable place for Indian troops; also like in Saltaro Ridge or any other borders is expensive in all measurable terms. Is there any way by which the work can be done faster which was screwed to this extent, by everybody with the central powers (my immense love towards Bharat ratna Chacha Nehru and his ilk does not diminish in any way for the treachery towards Motherland) since 1947.
As for me, a person with zero military experience (by any measure will remain zero), does it make sense to finish a task faster (even if it means) with high cost, assuring success and then pause to consolidate the gains and then to see where the grab can re-enacted again (against Pakistan and China). I see the blunder of LTTE chief Prabhakaran (not bothered to pronounce his name in Tamil way) when he rejected Ranil Wikramasinghe's offer and instrumental ascension of Rajapakses to power for annihilation of Tamil cause there. This example is with current dispensation riding on Uri Josh for winning the election; without remedial actions, the situation can turn unfavorable, since Chinese "Hunas" mleechhas are not going away in hurry.
I for once again rant that after cleaning up of Gilgit Baltistan, aksai chin (highway G119) will be starting point for them loosing Turkestan and Tibet.
For the reasons (my thought without any basis or proof) for Chinese to react now is to secure their hold on the above mentioned places for the reasons that
1) the current dispensation has shown swiftness to clear the path to integrate J&K
2) Ladakh according to me, the populace is very happy to be centrally governed.
3) The accelerated snail pace of infrastructure development in current border areas. Once further real estate comes to Indian grasp, the highway, the terma frost roads and other infrastructure can come handy to dismantle their defenses.
4) Taming the Sun(n)i (sunayi huyi) people (Pakistan), since their noise is currently not heard by many in the world stage.
5) Applying some pressure to allow BRI (or join it) in Gilgit, Baltistan and beyond.
Your thoughts please.
Last thought for this comment; the "learned" general needs a respectable post retirement posting than becoming a presstitute like "much loved" business standard Tank "Colonel" gent.
Thanks, Ganesh
Dear Prasun,
In case of any military face-off, what sort of casualty Indian armed forces may face from PLA? Are IA forces ready for this and planned to thwart the same?
Sir, I have an assessment about MMRCA 2.0 in which 8 aircrafts are competing
Mig-35 - won't be procured because it doesn't have a mature production line and it's not the most advance aircraft on offer
Su-35 - we don't require it since we already have Su-30 MKI which after upgradation will be at par with Su-35
Gripen - stands no chance as Tejas Mk2 is already in development
Eurofighter - Having already invested in Rafale, going for Typhoon would be foolish. Also we don't have strategic relationship with Germany and UK the kind of which we have with France
F-21 - rebranded F-16 in which nobody in IAF is interested
F-15 Ex - Doesn't suit the requirement
That only leaves 2 serious contenders F-18 and Raffle
F-18 would be great but since we have already invested in Rafale then why not cancel this MMRCA 2.0 tamasha and go for 114 Rafales in one go or may be in tranches?
What's the point of starting this tamasha again from point zero?
Sir
Why PLA build permanent SIGINT station where ever they go? I never seen such case with any other force.
Dear Prasun,
Further I want to know about the success story behind ISRO. Even though it's a government organisations, still it succeeded in every aspects and it's not public listed. Where do we lack actually? Is public listing for company is the only option. May you please enlighten me?
To NEWCOMER: Of course not. The overall reqmt is for 4 such ports to demand the container transhipment demands of Afghanistan, Iran, Pakistan, Uzbekistan, Tajikistan, Kazakhstan & Turkmenistan.
To JUST_CURIOUS: 1) The air-cooled engines have a tendency to seize & break-down when crossing water obstacles, whereas water-cooled engines don’t suffer from this deficiency. 2) By no means is the PLAGF massed along the LAC in numbers that are deemed sufficient for launching any offensive action. In fact, the PLAGF deployment is of a strictly defensive nature, albeit sitting inside territory that has claimed & patrolled after the 1962 war till last April. 3) It is too late now. That idiotic decision to upgrade should have been shot down in 2006 itself. 4) A 3rd aircraft carrier is reqd only after the 1st aircraft carrier (INS Vikramaditya) gets decommissioned, which is by 2052. 5) The Tejas Mk.1 is a 3.5-Gen MRCA while the MWF will be a true Gen-4 MRCA. 6) Existing practices, procedures & mindsets can’t be changed overnight. That’s why we have a particular missile being test-fired only once every year, be it an ICBM or the NG-ARM or HELINA. 7) Because, as the next thread will explain, India now does not hold any cards meant for having a say on the yet-to-reincarnate 15th Dalai Lama. That’s because the Panchem Lama has the 1st say, followed by the Karmapa. And the former remains untraceable inside China, while the latter continues to live in New Jersey, USA. So, it looks like the Tibetan Project will continue to be US-led project, as has been the case since the late 1950s. And India has been taken for a ride all along.
To UNKNOWN: NG-LGB is a DRDO-developed product, not Israeli. India has LGBs imported only from Israel & Russia.
To GANESH, Trust me when I assert that the existing PLAGF deployments along the LAC are not at all of an offensive nature, since they are not numerically superior to those of the IA & IAF combined. The overall objectives of China are totally different & war is not among them. I will explain them all in the following thread, which I have already uploaded but will keep adding further slides to contextualise the historical & cultural aspects of Himalayan geopolitics that have led us to the present-day situation. And yes, BRI & CPEC are also a part of the geo-strategic end-states desired by China in Ladakh.
To ASD: By no means is the PLAGF massed along the LAC in numbers that are deemed sufficient for launching any offensive action. In fact, the PLAGF deployment is of a strictly defensive nature, albeit sitting inside territory that has claimed & patrolled after the 1962 war till last April. Hence, neither China nor India are heading towards any kind of limited or high-intensity war, kindly rest assured. ISRO has succeeded because it is under the direct jurisdiction of the PMO. And nobody dare question the PMO’s directives & executive orders.
To PRATAP: Even the F/A-18 Super Hornet is no longer a serious contender. In the end, more Rafales will be procured & that’s the only writing on the wall for everyone to read.
To ARPIT KANODIA: because those SIGINT stations are along the LAC, which like the LoC is a temporary ceasefire line, nothing more & nothing less. Hence, the PLA requires such SIGINT outposts to serve as early-warning sounders.
Prasunda,
Your roadmap to building further & gaining incremental technology & design capabilities over & above on the HF-24 rankles badly. The arrival of these jets should be a moment of sombre national introspection. A nation that set out to procure 126 aircraft is able to obtain just five after two decades, that too by having to throw away piles of files that prevented any progress & the saddest part being after having built the HF-24 decades ago, but not building on eithee capacity or technology thereon, India still has to import combat aircraft, engage in suboptimal expensive upgrades of old imported jets
https://www.orfonline.org/expert-speak/celebrating-rafale-rethinking-indias-national-security/
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